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Season changes (about fuel consumption)


Jan Olsson

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I always use studded tires in the winter. Always have and always will because there is nothing like studs when the roads are icey. I also drive quite much. My trips to and from work alone adds up to 370 miles per week. I also always buy among the best tires around because I believe they are a relatively cheap life insurance.

My preferences for buying tires are that they shall have a good grip on both dry and wet roads, good stopping distance, low noise and good comfort. Studded tires of course will be noisier but I still prefer the much better grip compared to all-season tires etc. My driving habits changes with the seasons of course. When its daylight and I have the summer tires on I usually drive with a lead foot and use larger roads for my trips to and from work which renders 17-18 mpg. If I just drive a trip for fun or if the whole family takes a ride I usually take smaller roads which improve average mpg quite a bit, usually around 19-20 mpg. Winters are however my “eco-driving” season! It’s dark and sometimes icey and I treat the studded tires with just a little bit more respect than the summer tires. Not so much WOT at low speeds or high g-forces and overall a more even flow with the traffic. This suddenly gives me insane mileage numbers. My last tank full of gas averaged 22.5 mpg and I still drive almost 20 mph over the speed limits (this is the limit for when the driver’s license will be inhibited in Sweden). Almost half the distance is made in 87 mph on the freeway. I can only call that darn impressive for a 2 ton Cadillac with 4-speed auto and 300 bhp. It has only 133 k miles on ;)

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I am aware of studded tires but have never used them. Do they ride roughly when there is not snow or ice? Do you keep a second complete set of wheels to make swapping easier, or do you just plan to swap after first snow or similar then swap back in the Spring?

Bruce

2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing

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Here in the states...studded tires have been outlawed in many states for 40 years. They tear up the road like crazy. They cut the life of a highway in half.

Also..tires are alot better now with all-season tires etc.

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my eldo gets 24 mpg regularly. I get about 500 miles per tank. I call that great mileage also. 140k.

Best mileage yet.

Driven mostly highway about 50 miles a day.

As for studded tires I have had them and I dont find them to be necessary, but each person is different.

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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I used to run studded tires (a long time ago). Back then they were legislated between certain months (winter, obviously) and I just ran them on my rears ('66 Tempest). They ran smooth but you could hear them 'sing' on a dry road. If I had to do it again (today; currently live in a warmer State) I would probably run winter tires, i.e., Blizzack, etc. and summer tires (since it would require a second set of tires/wheels or a dismount/remount in any case. My current situation allows for all season tires, but if I lived further north, two sets, would probably be the way to go.

Chuck

'19 CT6, '04 Bravada........but still lusting for that '69 Z-28

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I am aware of studded tires but have never used them. Do they ride roughly when there is not snow or ice? Do you keep a second complete set of wheels to make swapping easier, or do you just plan to swap after first snow or similar then swap back in the Spring?

I have a complete set of wheels for summer use and a complete set for winter use. In Sweden you are required to have winter tires from the 1st of December until the 15th of March. Studded tires are allowed from the 1st of October until the 15th of April. I usually have studded tires 6 months per year. They are a bit noisier than all-season tires and ride a little bit rougher at low speeds but modern studded tires are way better than they were just 10 years ago.

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Here in the states...studded tires have been outlawed in many states for 40 years. They tear up the road like crazy. They cut the life of a highway in half.

Also..tires are alot better now with all-season tires etc.

They do wear down the roads. But the main reason that they are hard on the roads is the combination studded tires and the road salt. The salt dissolves the asphalt; the studs just finish the job. The salt makes the road surface wear 5 times more than without salt. More importantly, studded tires are to some degree necessary to rough up the surface on icey roads in order to make stud free tires work. Modern studded tires in Sweden are required to use fewer studs, shorter studs and lighter studs than older tires were required to. This has greatly reduced the wear and tear on the roads and still they perform better than ever. Below average studded tires roughly equal the best stud free winter tires around when it for instance comes to stopping distances. The best studded tires has about 80% the stopping distance compared to the best stud free tires.

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my eldo gets 24 mpg regularly. I get about 500 miles per tank. I call that great mileage also. 140k.

Best mileage yet.

Driven mostly highway about 50 miles a day.

As for studded tires I have had them and I dont find them to be necessary, but each person is different.

I really would like to get my hands on a STS-V. But after checking around for some Euro spec. models I have found out that Germans now give away the “standard” STSs for free! Here in Europe it seems like a car is considered a gas guzzler if it can’t make 40 mpg. Not to mention buying a car with over 50k miles on the odometer. It’s good for me though that people over here rather pay large repair bills, mortgages and interest than gasoline. I seriously plan to buy a low mileage 2010 STS with the last Northstar, fully loaded sometimes next year. With the 6 speed auto and VVT I expect a mileage increase. This is not crucial for me, just a bonus! Oh, and all the cool gizmos to play around with ;)

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I used to run studded tires (a long time ago). Back then they were legislated between certain months (winter, obviously) and I just ran them on my rears ('66 Tempest). They ran smooth but you could hear them 'sing' on a dry road. If I had to do it again (today; currently live in a warmer State) I would probably run winter tires, i.e., Blizzack, etc. and summer tires (since it would require a second set of tires/wheels or a dismount/remount in any case. My current situation allows for all season tires, but if I lived further north, two sets, would probably be the way to go.

My new set of Nokian studded tires has 190 studs per tire. The law limits the amount to 50 studs per meter circumference if the manufacturer can't prove that extra studs won't increase road wear over a certain limit. The other brands usually only have 100 studs per tire but obviously Nokian tires successfully managed to make tires with god grip that don't tear up the road.

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The studded snow tires I remember from the early 1970s had metal, carbide tipped studs. Is that the same over in Sweden or are the studs a different design?

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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my eldo gets 24 mpg regularly. I get about 500 miles per tank. I call that great mileage also. 140k.

Best mileage yet.

Driven mostly highway about 50 miles a day.

As for studded tires I have had them and I dont find them to be necessary, but each person is different.

I really would like to get my hands on a STS-V. But after checking around for some Euro spec. models I have found out that Germans now give away the “standard” STSs for free! Here in Europe it seems like a car is considered a gas guzzler if it can’t make 40 mpg. Not to mention buying a car with over 50k miles on the odometer. It’s good for me though that people over here rather pay large repair bills, mortgages and interest than gasoline. I seriously plan to buy a low mileage 2010 STS with the last Northstar, fully loaded sometimes next year. With the 6 speed auto and VVT I expect a mileage increase. This is not crucial for me, just a bonus! Oh, and all the cool gizmos to play around with ;)

Wouldn't the v also be considered a gas guzzler and be free? I am sure you would like the choice if they are also "free".! Even just a little more than free would be awesome.

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That would be really great! Only problem is that they are really rare and still has a hefty price tag. I found one in Hungary though. It seemed ok and had a really good price but it is a little to far from me. I really want a EU spec STS-V but they are really rare.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Studs are the thing to have for black ice. If you never run onto black ice, winter tires are all you need.

The STS-V and CTS-V is never going to be free. Most people consider them exotic and baby them, and avoid rolling up the odometer. I'm about the only one I ever heard of with a long daily commute that takes the V and I've never seen another one.

I did see a Tesla Model S on the way home from work a few weeks ago.

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Studs are the thing to have for black ice.......

Studs WERE great for any colored ice. White, grey, black, brown, I've seen them all in S.W. PA. Sawdust tires were great for winter driving too, but wore out in one (winter) season most of the time. Had a set on the back of my RWD Fury Station wagon, passed a VW Bug stuck on on hill in 22 inches of snow once, it was a great feeling, even though I love sauerkraut.

Now I live in a warmer place and don't need any of that. In fact, saw a CLASSIC Tesla S60 today on my way back from Beall's! Black on black...then I watched the driver hit a curb with it while making a "Florida Left". (that's a U turn for those that have never been here) Oh well.

Anyone interested in a 2005 Crossfire? $13,500/10,000 mi. Convertible, black w/Grey inside. Like new.

Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed.

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I thought studded snow tires went away as fast as the RWD cars in the early 1980's. In all my years of driving FWD cars, they have performed on the snow and ice just fine. With the return of RWD cars (because all the car rags claims) I guess snow tires and studs have made a re-appearance.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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I thought studded snow tires went away as fast as the RWD cars in the early 1980's. In all my years of driving FWD cars, they have performed on the snow and ice just fine. With the return of RWD cars (because all the car rags claims) I guess snow tires and studs have made a re-appearance.

Fascinating thread. In 1988-90 I lived in Eagle County, (Vail/Beaver Creek), Colorado. I had a FWD 1988 Chevrolet Celebrity, (it had a manual transmission which might have been a special order I don't know as I bought it used). It snowed a lot. I don't remember what tires I had on it exactly but I know they weren't snow or studded tires. Point is that the FWD handled great in snow and ice conditions. That Celebrity was a great car. Never a minutes trouble out of it.

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I guess snow tires and studs have made a re-appearance.

I guess you are right, FWD had all but eliminated the need for snow tires. More RWD cars will SOMETIMES require snow tires. However, traction control and Stabilitrack make RWD cars much better in the snow than they were back then. I'm pretty sure that with these two systems on board, RWD cars will be just fine in the snow with just all season tires. It's the ICE that really presents the problems for drivers these days. Not much will help there unless you do have studded tires.

When I had my RWD Jeep Unlimited, I tried to do a "doughnut" in a parking lot covered in about 8" on snow just in (rear) 2 wheel drive mode. It wouldn't spin or slide! I was surprised to say the least! The computer cut the engine power, different brakes engaged by themselves, then NOTHING....the car just kind of drifted to a stop.

Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed.

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lol sometimes I dont even have to try to do donughts with my truck. usually as soon as let off the clutch it does its own thing.

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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I guess snow tires and studs have made a re-appearance.

I guess you are right, FWD had all but eliminated the need for snow tires. More RWD cars will SOMETIMES require snow tires. However, traction control and Stabilitrack make RWD cars much better in the snow than they were back then. I'm pretty sure that with these two systems on board, RWD cars will be just fine in the snow with just all season tires. It's the ICE that really presents the problems for drivers these days. Not much will help there unless you do have studded tires.

Somewhat true, but all FWDs are not created equal! I had a work car (2014 Fusion) last week and with less than 5" of fresh snow, I almost got stuck on my first incline (a bridge over a highway). Luckily I wasn't the guy in the CTS that was completely stuck, but I think SLS would have had no problem at all. Even the Fusion would have been ok with snow tires I think.

I did see a Tesla Model S on the way home from work a few weeks ago.

They are becoming quite popular here. I'm pleased about that... beautiful cars!

This suddenly gives me insane mileage numbers. My last tank full of gas averaged 22.5 mpg and I still drive almost 20 mph over the speed limits (this is the limit for when the driver’s license will be inhibited in Sweden). Almost half the distance is made in 87 mph on the freeway. I can only call that darn impressive for a 2 ton Cadillac with 4-speed auto and 300 bhp. It has only 133 k miles on ;)

That's really good! My winter fuel economy normally drops by a few MPG presumably due to the fuel mix, lower temperatures, and increased idle times. Winter does cause brutal traffic on the highways here which actually reduces fuel used due to stop-and-go traffic instead of the normal 75mph cruises :)

-Chris

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