CAREFULLY RESEARCHING AND BUYING USED

[PAUL T]

Some of you may have known that my Mother & Father-in-law just bought a nice 2004 Deville. Well it turned out not to be so nice. Me and my wife researched very carefully to make sure they would not get a car with problems. I figured that most leak problems would be minimal if they bought a low mileage 2002 & up Caddy. When we found this 2004 low mileage Deville we checked and it was dealer serviced from day 1, dealer had all service records, owned by an local older couple that traded every few years. My wife went with them so she could check any codes that may show up and make sure they fixed it before they bought it. My wife found a code and the dealer took care of that. They checked the records and everything came out clean. They got a 30 day 50/50 warranty. Car was supposed to be checked from top to bottom before they drove it off the lot. After about 2 weeks my father-in-law was complaining about some oil he found in the driveway and assumed it was one of my cars. My cars do not leak so I asked if he had looked under the new caddy and he said no. After finding more puddles he decides to crawl under the 2004 Deville and he found oil. Not being familiar with the Northstar I went and checked it and sure enough it was leaking somewhere around the oil pan. and I also noticed that it was wet around the drivers axle. Knowing that in order to repair the oil pan the engine would have to come out and it was not going to be cheap. He called the dealer back and set up to bring it in for inspection. They looked at it and the service writer said it was leaking around the rear main seal, the oil pan and around the axle seal. He worked some figures and said the total cost to fix would be around $2000 and they would have to pay half. This did not go over well and they told him they would pay nothing because the vehicle was supposed to have been inspected by the dealer for this before the sale and it was obvious that it had been leaking before they bought it. Long story short the dealer owner agreed to fix it free and gave them a loaner until it is fixed. So far so good hopefully it will end well. It just goes to show no matter how much you check and research, buying used is like buying a pig in a poke.

[BodybyFisher]

I hope this is resolved to your satisfaction, it sounds like it will be, but buying a car is not a fun experience..

[Bruce Nunnally]

Buying a pig in a poke refers to purchasing an item without inspecting it.

Relying on an inspection done by the Seller, is in fact similar to having no inspection done at all. A good inspection of a used vehicle should be performed by an independent third party, or by a third party who is friendly to the buyer.

I hope in this case everything gets resolved and the car gives good long term service.

[joeb]

50/50 warranty? you split the cost? and they agreed to not charge you? nice. i bought a grand prix last summer and could smell coolant. the seller said he had just changed anti-freeze so it may have spilled. ha ha. found cracked coolant elbow which is very common on these cars. changed it myself but i was pretty sure it was a minor thing i could fix.

[93SixtySpecial]

Buying used is sooo scary. You really have no idea until you get it home and start driving it like normal. I just bought a used 99 Deville and ended up with a weird shudder/bobing motion while climbing hills with TC locked up. Hopefully it's not the TC and it's something electrical, but it wasn't there when I went on the test drive.

[Texas Jim]

Here is a little more info about the origin of the saying... "Buying A Pig In A Poke"

Pig-in-a-poke is an idiom that refers to a confidence trick originating in the Late Middle Ages, when meat was scarce but cats were not.

The scheme entailed the sale of a suckling pig in a poke (bag).

The wriggling bag would actually contain a cat (not particularly prized as a source of meat) that was sold to the victim in an unopened bag. The French term acheter (un) chat en poche (to buy a cat in a bag) refers to an actual sale of this nature, as do many European equivalents, while the English expression refers to the appearance of the trick.

A common colloquial expression in the English language, to buy a pig in a poke is to make a risky purchase without inspecting the item beforehand.

The phrase can also be applied to accepting an idea or plan without a full understanding of its basis. Similar expressions exist in other European languages, most of them meaning to buy a cat in a bag, with some exceptions:

This trick also appears to be the origin of the expressions "Let the cat out of the bag", meaning to reveal that which is secret because if the would-be buyer opened the bag, the trick would be revealed, and the other expression..."left holding the bag", meaning to find oneself with nothing for their efforts, as the cat (and perhaps the seller) is quite likely to flee when the bag is opened.

Just a little bit of useless trivia...

[CarlaValentine]

Here is a little more info about the origin of the saying... "Buying A Pig In A Poke"

Pig-in-a-poke is an idiom that refers to a confidence trick originating in the Late Middle Ages, when meat was scarce but cats were not.

The scheme entailed the sale of a suckling pig in a poke (bag).

The wriggling bag would actually contain a cat (not particularly prized as a source of meat) that was sold to the victim in an unopened bag. The French term acheter (un) chat en poche (to buy a cat in a bag) refers to an actual sale of this nature, as do many European equivalents, while the English expression refers to the appearance of the trick.

A common colloquial expression in the English language, to buy a pig in a poke is to make a risky purchase without inspecting the item beforehand.

The phrase can also be applied to accepting an idea or plan without a full understanding of its basis. Similar expressions exist in other European languages, most of them meaning to buy a cat in a bag, with some exceptions:

This trick also appears to be the origin of the expressions "Let the cat out of the bag", meaning to reveal that which is secret because if the would-be buyer opened the bag, the trick would be revealed, and the other expression..."left holding the bag", meaning to find oneself with nothing for their efforts, as the cat (and perhaps the seller) is quite likely to flee when the bag is opened.

Just a little bit of useless trivia...

I always enjoy useless trivia and info.

[93SixtySpecial]

Here is a little more info about the origin of the saying... "Buying A Pig In A Poke"

Pig-in-a-poke is an idiom that refers to a confidence trick originating in the Late Middle Ages, when meat was scarce but cats were not.

The scheme entailed the sale of a suckling pig in a poke (bag).

The wriggling bag would actually contain a cat (not particularly prized as a source of meat) that was sold to the victim in an unopened bag. The French term acheter (un) chat en poche (to buy a cat in a bag) refers to an actual sale of this nature, as do many European equivalents, while the English expression refers to the appearance of the trick.

A common colloquial expression in the English language, to buy a pig in a poke is to make a risky purchase without inspecting the item beforehand.

The phrase can also be applied to accepting an idea or plan without a full understanding of its basis. Similar expressions exist in other European languages, most of them meaning to buy a cat in a bag, with some exceptions:

This trick also appears to be the origin of the expressions "Let the cat out of the bag", meaning to reveal that which is secret because if the would-be buyer opened the bag, the trick would be revealed, and the other expression..."left holding the bag", meaning to find oneself with nothing for their efforts, as the cat (and perhaps the seller) is quite likely to flee when the bag is opened.

Just a little bit of useless trivia...

Very neat, I din't know that!

[KHE]

Some of you may have known that my Mother & Father-in-law just bought a nice 2004 Deville. Well it turned out not to be so nice. Me and my wife researched very carefully to make sure they would not get a car with problems. I figured that most leak problems would be minimal if they bought a low mileage 2002 & up Caddy. When we found this 2004 low mileage Deville we checked and it was dealer serviced from day 1, dealer had all service records, owned by an local older couple that traded every few years. My wife went with them so she could check any codes that may show up and make sure they fixed it before they bought it. My wife found a code and the dealer took care of that. They checked the records and everything came out clean. They got a 30 day 50/50 warranty. Car was supposed to be checked from top to bottom before they drove it off the lot. After about 2 weeks my father-in-law was complaining about some oil he found in the driveway and assumed it was one of my cars. My cars do not leak so I asked if he had looked under the new caddy and he said no. After finding more puddles he decides to crawl under the 2004 Deville and he found oil. Not being familiar with the Northstar I went and checked it and sure enough it was leaking somewhere around the oil pan. and I also noticed that it was wet around the drivers axle. Knowing that in order to repair the oil pan the engine would have to come out and it was not going to be cheap. He called the dealer back and set up to bring it in for inspection. They looked at it and the service writer said it was leaking around the rear main seal, the oil pan and around the axle seal. He worked some figures and said the total cost to fix would be around $2000 and they would have to pay half. This did not go over well and they told him they would pay nothing because the vehicle was supposed to have been inspected by the dealer for this before the sale and it was obvious that it had been leaking before they bought it. Long story short the dealer owner agreed to fix it free and gave them a loaner until it is fixed. So far so good hopefully it will end well. It just goes to show no matter how much you check and research, buying used is like buying a pig in a poke.

Sounds like it all worked out - Your in-laws got a nice car that's now leak free. I would recommend a coolant change unless there are records showing it had been done in the last year.

[scott y]

The ol' trivia is good

[adallak]

Buying used is sooo scary. You really have no idea until you get it home and start driving it like normal. I just bought a used 99 Deville and ended up with a weird shudder/bobing motion while climbing hills with TC locked up. Hopefully it's not the TC and it's something electrical, but it wasn't there when I went on the test drive.

I agree - you can miss SOME problems at initial inspection and drive test. Some problems will show up only when you start to drive it every day.

As for the shudder (do not want to hijack the thread), when TCC is locked up, the transmission has nothing to do with shudder. The engine is the source of the shudder. Ignition problems, vacuum leaks and a million of other things can cause it. I have this problem with my LT1 engine. You press the gas pedal just to keep momentum while climbing a hill and there is no additional power there unless you press harder. Seems to be a very common issue with 5.7 liter Chevy engine... I know people who replaced MAF, MAP, PCV, EGR, plugs, wires, distributor, fuel punp, fuel and air filters, and who knows what else to no avail. I missed the crisp throttle response of my 91 Seville.

[PAUL T]

Update: Finally got the car back after a few calls just to be told they had trouble getting parts. To remind everyone, this car is a clean 2004 Deville with 42,700 miles. They replaced the valve cover gaskets, oil pan gasket, rear main seal, and left axle seal. This was a car originally bought new at this Cadillac GM dealership and serviced regularly at the same dealership it's whole life, had all service records and when my father-in-law bought it the dealership had no idea it leaked oil? Here is my take, original owner brought the car in complaining about the oil leak, dealer talked him into trading it in on a new one, dealer then sold it to my father-in-law with a 50/50 warranty. Then, when my father-in-law finds the problem they only agree to cover half the cost of the $2000.00 in repairs. If my 79 year old father-in-law had not stuck to his guns and demanded repairs free of charge he would have had to pay $1000 more for it and the dealer would have come out rolling in the money. They did agree to do the repairs free and so far all is well, but it is just wrong. I did all I could do help them avoid this very thing by researching and finding them a car with low miles and all service records, so they could have a nice trouble free Cadillac to last them, maybe, the rest of their lives. The only thing I did not do is go with them when they bought it, I sent my wife who checked the codes and to make sure what happened would not happen.

[ted tcb]

Bruce summarized your experience nicely, by suggesting an independent third party mechanical inspection.

The oil leaks would've shown up ... pretty tough to miss when the car is up on the hoist.

Most dealers will do the absolute minimus in terms of repairs, especially with things like oil leaks

which do not affect a safety certification.

I've been fortunate identifying mechanical issues, but small body/paint issues have been tough for me to spot on

test drives. Everytime I bring a used car home, I'm sure to find some imperfection within the first two weeks of

ownership:)