stokes Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 Can someone tell me the idle speed for a 2001 Deville?The manual I have doesnt seem to have it.Also is there a way to adjust the rpm's?The problem I have is the car stalled twice and no codes were set.The engine seems to be idling low,it goes down to 650 sitting at a light and has gone as low as 625.This seems kind of weak to me.It stalled when decelerating to a stop at a stop sign,then took 2 attempts before it would restart.It did this twice during a 10 mile drive.The first time I just assumed it wasnt warmed up enough,but the second time it was well warmed up.I set the DIC to show the RPM's while I was driving and as I said the idle speed seemed low to me.Thanks for any help here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 This is a 2001, this year is prone to bad crank sensors that sudden stall is a classic symptom. Sometimes they dont set codes. Your idle speed of 625 in drive sounds correct. I would clean the throttle body and IAC valve, if the IAC is caked with carbon or the passage is clogged it will not be able to supple air to maintain the idle. But keep your eyes open for crank sensor codes, there are two sensors. As an aside, check your fuel pressure Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 Thanks Bobby.When it stalled it didnt stumble or stutter at all.I actually couldnt tell it stalled till I tried to turn the wheel.Just coasted to a stop,no cough or anything.I'll check the air control valve and clean the throttle body as you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 2, 2012 Report Share Posted October 2, 2012 Did it start right up after it stalled? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 No,it took 2-3 tries to re-start.This happened this morning on my way to work,about an 8-10 mile drive.I ran the diagnostics after both incidents and had no codes at all.Coming home I had no issues at all.The manual says not to use any kind of liguids or solvents to clean the IAC valve,but doesnt offer any alternate methods.If it does look to be clogged,should I just replace it,or is there some way to clean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Hmm, that is not a symptom of bad crank sensors, bad crank sensors start right back up Check the TB and IAC and clean them up nice. Is it running rough? Do you have a fuel pressure gage?, if not see if you can borrow or buy one and hook it up to the fuel rail. dont buy the Harbor Freight unit, it stinks, I had 2 and they both leaked and had a cheap pindle that fell out. Check sears. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 No,its not running rough at all.Like I said,when it did stall,I couldnt even tell till I tried to turn the wheel and noticed the engine wasnt running.No sputter no cough,nothing.Just coasted like normal to a stop and the engine shut down.I assume with the throttle body I can just use Gumout spray,but what about the IAC valve? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 On the cars that had the bad crank sensors made in Mexico, it is not "if" but "when" they will fail. If they are original, they should be replaced. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Sounds like classic crank sensors to me. A friend of mine lent me his 01 Deville one time and it did the same to me. he said it had been doing it for some time but he didnt know what it was. It started out as a stall and quick restart but developed into longer time restartiing. replaced crank sensors annd no more problems. Just an opinion GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thanks for chimbing in guys, yes it certainly seems like crank sensors, but I was put off by the ",it took 2-3 tries to re-start" statement, I have seen those who have had a stall from a crank sensor say, that is started right back up. Now its possible that it is crank sensors but other issues are involved like plugs, fuel pressure, etc. But yes, it seems like crank sensors, we see it a lot with 2001s. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 First time it took 2 tries to restart,second time on the third try I stepped on the gas pedal as I turned the key and it started.We'll see how it acts this morning.On the way home last night it was fine.Thanks for all the input guys.I'll post back as I check things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike33 Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Stokes, check my thread, some of this may apply to you, I have a IAC Valve if you need it for a discounted price, they are $400 ac, $230 autozone: http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=42030 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Crankshaft sensors for 2001 Deville from Rock Auto vary in price by brand. There are two, a lower and an upper. Price for lower is from $28.79 to $44.79, the price for upper is from $40.89 to $54.89, with the highest price being Airtex Wells; AC/Delco is slightly lower. From Rock Auto, you IAC valve is $183.79 from AC/Delco or Standard Motor Products, and (gasp) $234.89 from Airtex Wells. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thanks guys,I've already looked at rockauto.com.Wont get a chance tonight to get under the hood and check the IAC valve and throttle body,but had no issues today,car ran fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 If the 2001 is the same, you will need to remove two torx screws to remove the IAC, there is a mushroom shaped pindle that can get dirty and look in the seat/passage to see if its clogged or narrowed. Do you normally have trouble starting your engine when its hot? Sometimes that can be a FPR, plus the crank sensors that caused the stall. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 No problem starting,hot or cold.Only problem ever was the 2 stalls yesterday.I did get under the hood and pull the IAC,it was pretty dirty.I cleaned it as best I could with a brush,since the manual says not to use any liquid or solvent.I also wiped out the opening the IAC valve sits in on the throttle body with a rag on my finger.Blew it out with compressed air as well.Dont know if it was even needed,but I did the IAC Valve learn procedure after putting it back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Good Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thanks for all the help.When I have time,I'll do a full cleaning/service on the throttle body and all associated components.If the problem persists,I'll move on to the crankshaft sensors.I'll give this cleaning a few days to see if I have solved it and post back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Dont spray cleaner into the TB, use rubber gloves, tooth brushes, detail brushes and rags to clean the throat and back and edges of the throttle plate. Use O2 safe carb cleaner, the first time you do this job, it will take 30 min Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 When replacing the crank sensors, use AC Delco sensors. Make sure they are the Denso sensors made in Japan, not the ones made in Mexico. It is doubtful there are any made in Mexico crank sensors on the market but it is never known if there is some NOS (new old stock) out there. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 If the 2001 is the same, you will need to remove two torx screws to remove the IAC, there is a mushroom shaped pindle that can get dirty and look in the seat/passage to see if its clogged or narrowed. Do you normally have trouble starting your engine when its hot? Sometimes that can be a FPR, plus the crank sensors that caused the stall. Why do you ask about trouble starting when its hot? Its funny cause I never had a problem....till today.I drove about 5 miles,car was well warmed up,syopped for coffee,car wouldnt start,took 3 tries.About 3 or so miles later stopped and again car took 3 times to start.It then stalled a while later,this time while driving,engine just stopped,no sputtering of any kind,coasting at about 10 mph and engine just died.Started first try,but I did hit the gas pedal slightly as I turned key.Time to get those crankshaft sensors??Forgot to mention,did get history codes AMP B1009 EEPROM CHECKSUM ERROR and IRC U1016 LOSS OF COMMUNICATION WITH PCM. What I have on these systems is AMP is for amplifier and IRC is intgrated radio module,so I assume they are unrelated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jim Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 Hard starting when hot sometimes indicates a problem with the fuel pressure regulator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 Exactly, the Fuel Pressure Regulator...... its possible that you have a problem with both the crank sensors AND the FPR, but dont just parts replace. It stalled again, see if you have a code right after the stall, but your crank sensors should be first, but. BUT, before you do this PLEASE put a fuel pressure gage on the engine and report the fuel pressure here with the KEY on, and with the engine idling and reving it... Lets not parts replace, diagnose to eliminate potential problems first. This could be a weak fuel pump or associated wiring first, lets eliminate that by attaching a gage first, that wont set a code either Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stokes Posted October 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 I'll have to find a gauge.You said Sears was a good choice,no?Am I correct in my assumption about those 2 history codes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 Yes, I like my sears gage. I can not comment on those two codes, maybe someone with direct experience with them can comment. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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