BodybyFisher Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 Hey, I just did a search and I found that GM EOS might have been discontinued. I am going to buy a few quarts... Thought I would let you all know about this, Mike Here is where I heard that http://www.oldspower.com/vb/showthread.php?p=299315 Check out this site, is this snake oil? http://www.zddplus.com/ Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 WOW, $10 for 4 oz. Sure glad none of my cars are pre '88. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 WOW, $10 for 4 oz. Sure glad none of my cars are pre '88. You might revise that date upward a little. If anyone is concerned with flat tappet cams vs. roller cams, the N* didn't get rollers until 2000. I use Valvoline Synpower Oil Supplement. I can't recall how much I paid for it, but I'm sure it wasn't $10.00. Back when I used to read the Bobistheoilguy site, this product was reported (by used oil analysis) to contain high amounts of ZDP. One person quoted it as being "pure" ZDP but that claim was disputed on this board. At any rate, high residual levels of ZDP (higher than new oil) were found in used oil when as little as 1 or 2 ounces of VSOP was added at the time of an oil change. Since I found a source for the stuff, I've followed the 1 - 2 ounce additions and have noticed improvements in both fuel economy and reduced oil consumption. Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to say this stuff will do anything for you at all, I'm just saying that I tried it and I like it. Let's just say it gives me "piece of mind" when using SM oil. Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 25, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 Thanks Johnny Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 Check out this site, is this snake oil? http://www.zddplus.com Well, they specifically state that ZDDP is the active ingredient in their product: "One bottle of ZddPlus contains more ZDDP than two bottles of GM’s EOS, which is no longer manufactured." That doesn't smell of snake oil marketing to me. Of course, it couldn't hurt to check out their bona fides. In their FAQ section they state: "In the summer of 2007, [GM] EOS was discontinued, making it difficult to find today." That would agree with the info from the first site you mentioned. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 I wouldn't assume that use of starburst motor oil in 1993-1999 Northstars wouldn't continue to be OK for engine life. I have read online from links posted here about problems in bronze timing gear life in pre-1949 Cadillac V8's, V12's, and V16's due to decrease in ZDDP in modern motor oils. However, I would keep a watch on this, since the recent OnStar policy changes (they sold add-in OnStar for cars back to 1997 for years but stopped doing so) tell me that GM isn't interested in supporting cars older than the 2002 model year. How about checking with some of the larger engine remanufacturers? They are in the position of guaranteeing these engines for years after providing their products. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 You might revise that date upward a little. If anyone is concerned with flat tappet cams vs. roller cams, the N* didn't get rollers until 2000. True, forgot about that, but I think I am still OK. My car - '03 Northstar (rollers) Daughter - '02 Northstar (rollers) Daughter - '04 Grand Am 3400 (rollers I think) Wife - '96 Bonneville 3800 (rollers) Now my garden tractor is probably another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted October 25, 2007 Report Share Posted October 25, 2007 I think any modern automotive engine (including a 93-99 Northstar) is going to be just fine on any modern oil, even ILSAC GF-4 SM oils. I mean, it's not like the engine has bronze timing gears, distributor drive gears, old straight-gear oil pumps, etc. It's still a thoroughly modern engine...one that just may need some additional wear protection when compared to the even-more-modern 2000+ Northstar. It's also not as if SM oils have simply dropped all zinc and soldiered on otherwise unchanged. Different additives have replaced zinc as the primary anti-wear constituent. If you are really concerned about a 93-99 Northstar, the oil additive mentioned above won't likely hurt anything. There are other options as well, including 10W-30 HDMOs (like Shell Rotella T, which IS specified for both gasoline and diesel engines), and 10W-30 high mileage-type oils which offer a better additive package and usually slightly thicker viscosity compared with regular PCMOs (such as Pennzoil High Mileage and Valvoline MaxLife). I do agree with Ranger, by the way, regarding 4-stroke small engines. They DO have a lot of metal-to-metal contact, may or may not be pressure-lubricated, and are totally different animals compared with automotive engines. I personally run mine on Shell Rotella 30W. I believe it's either an SG or SL oil. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 If you are really concerned about a 93-99 Northstar, the oil additive mentioned above won't likely hurt anything. There are other options as well, including 10W-30 HDMOs (like Shell Rotella T, which IS specified for both gasoline and diesel engines), and 10W-30 high mileage-type oils which offer a better additive package and usually slightly thicker viscosity compared with regular PCMOs (such as Pennzoil High Mileage and Valvoline MaxLife). This is an interesting concept. I have yet to find a 10W-30 HDMO anywhere in this town. Nor have I found an SAE 30 diesel oil anywhere. Shell Rotella is an excellent motor oil, and I would give it a try if I could find it. But it's the next part that I find really interesting........."10W-30 high-mileage-type oils WHICH offer a BETTER additive package and usually..... I can agree with the "slightly thicker viscosity" part of this, but where does the additive package stuff come from? If there was a better additive package, wouldn't everybody use it in their regular formulations? Exactly which additive is this? What exactly does it do? Do the oil makers get a special break on SM "High Mileage" oils that don't meet the requirements of the spec.? I'm going back to my old favorite reason for this statement - Marketing. Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 10W-30 HDMO may be found as close as your local Wal-Mart. My local Wal-Mart carries Shell Rotella in 5W-40, 10W-30, 15W-40, and 30W. Regarding the high mileage motor oils, a lot of VOAs have been posted for high mileage motor oils that show different add-packs compared with their non-high mileage counterpart products. It's been too long since I've looked and I can't remember, but the data is on BITOG. Of course, oil formulations seem to change with the winds these days, so it could all be different now. I did note that many high mileage oils did NOT switch to the ILSAC GF-4 SM spec when the normal oils did back in 2005 or whenever it was. Many high mileage oils were still rated SL at the time. According to product spec sheets, it seems that most high mileage oils have finally been switched to the SM spec, so the differences in additive packs may not be as great today as they once were. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apache13 Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 yeah EOM is all but extinct out here in Colorado. I called around the dealerships to get a couple of bottles after my oil pressure nightmare (thanks BodybyFisher for the advice) and found nothing...1/2 the service depts told me it was disconinued and the other 1/2 said they were waiting on shippment and stuff like that. The only place I found some was at my mechanics...he has a couple of quarts. No charge for the 1/4 quart EOM...I didn't tell him though its was impossible to find and discontinued Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 Use Crane Cams assembly lube in an emergency; it's full of ZDDP. Otherwise look at the ZDDP link earlier in the thread; they have links to a distributor. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackc Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 It figures that they'd discontinue EOS now that I've made the decision to add it to my oil change regimen... I did use it with my last change and there's a noticeable decrease in my ever-present "lifter" noise. FYI - I got curious several weeks ago and started reading everything I could find about zddp and reformulated oils. Found some good discussions among the motorcycle guys..... Long story short, these are the conlusions I came to: 1. Beware of the new reformulated diesel oils - they may not provide the protection you think. I bought some Chevron Delo but wound up taking it back after I noticed it was the reformulated stuff. 2. Beware of any new oil labeled SL - there's a good chance they are just relying on the backward compatibility that any oil can claim for their SL status. I guess I'll go out and see how much EOS I can round up while its still on the shelves....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 It figures that they'd discontinue EOS now that I've made the decision to add it to my oil change regimen... I did use it with my last change and there's a noticeable decrease in my ever-present "lifter" noise. FYI - I got curious several weeks ago and started reading everything I could find about zddp and reformulated oils. Found some good discussions among the motorcycle guys..... Long story short, these are the conlusions I came to: 1. Beware of the new reformulated diesel oils - they may not provide the protection you think. I bought some Chevron Delo but wound up taking it back after I noticed it was the reformulated stuff. 2. Beware of any new oil labeled SL - there's a good chance they are just relying on the backward compatibility that any oil can claim for their SL status. I guess I'll go out and see how much EOS I can round up while its still on the shelves....... Jack, check this link, I am going to consider it, Mike http://www.zddplus.com/ Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 10W-30 HDMO may be found as close as your local Wal-Mart. My local Wal-Mart carries Shell Rotella in 5W-40, 10W-30, 15W-40, and 30W. Regarding the high mileage motor oils, a lot of VOAs have been posted for high mileage motor oils that show different add-packs compared with their non-high mileage counterpart products. It's been too long since I've looked and I can't remember, but the data is on BITOG. Of course, oil formulations seem to change with the winds these days, so it could all be different now. I did note that many high mileage oils did NOT switch to the ILSAC GF-4 SM spec when the normal oils did back in 2005 or whenever it was. Many high mileage oils were still rated SL at the time. According to product spec sheets, it seems that most high mileage oils have finally been switched to the SM spec, so the differences in additive packs may not be as great today as they once were. The last two jugs of 10W-30 Rotella I bought were SM rated in addition to the diesel ratings. I am now wondering if the Rotella oil contains any more ZDP than regular 10W-30... Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 The last two jugs of 10W-30 Rotella I bought were SM rated in addition to the diesel ratings. I am now wondering if the Rotella oil contains any more ZDP than regular 10W-30... Yes, I had that question as well. The MSDS for it seems to indicate so, but that may not be a real accurate measure. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackc Posted October 26, 2007 Report Share Posted October 26, 2007 Jack, check this link, I am going to consider it, Mike http://www.zddplus.com/ Sounds like a good product - I'll have to give it a try. Thanks for the link..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted October 27, 2007 Report Share Posted October 27, 2007 10W-30 HDMO may be found as close as your local Wal-Mart. My local Wal-Mart carries Shell Rotella in 5W-40, 10W-30, 15W-40, and 30W. Wait a minute! I live just across the border from West Virginia, my brother was BORN in a WalMart, you don't think I looked there first? Is there another place that sells oil? Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick7997 Posted October 27, 2007 Report Share Posted October 27, 2007 That zddplus website was very interesting.... I may have to consider that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted October 28, 2007 Report Share Posted October 28, 2007 Wait a minute! I live just across the border from West Virginia, my brother was BORN in a WalMart, you don't think I looked there first? Is there another place that sells oil? Look on the shelves real close, or ask someone. Our Wal-Mart "didn't stock it" either. But one day, I happened to be easing down the motor oil aisle and noticed that there was a shelf tag with "ROTELLA 10W30" or something like that. So I knew that they at least had a product number in their database. I asked (the person at the tire counter actually) and she went back there and said she found a whole pallet of Shell Rotella T in 10W-30. So I bought two jugs. The next week, I noted that they had it prominently stocked on their shelves. It's too bad our other vehicle doesn't also use 10W-30 (or even 5W-30) because I'd keep them in business with it. But Wal-Mart DOES sell it...and it is in their product database. If you ask, they MAY be able to get it for you. If you need a SKU number or anything, I can look. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted October 28, 2007 Report Share Posted October 28, 2007 ....But Wal-Mart DOES sell it...and it is in their product database. If you ask, they MAY be able to get it for you. If you need a SKU number or anything, I can look. Please get the SKU. Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted June 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 I was in my local NAPA parts dealer yesterday and they had bottles of ZDDPLUS, for those of you wanting to use 10W30 or 5W30 this might be a good product, check your local NAPA parts dealer http://www.zddplus.com/ Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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