Dex-Cool

[GreenMachine]

Yeah sorry for confusion on my post, I was referring to them changing coolant.

Is there a cheap "kit" I can get to test the coolant for exhaust gas?....although since its running so darn good right now I'd almost rather not know

[Cadillac Jim]

You want to know. There exist some test strips for both anti-oxidant capability and for combustion products but they are hard to find because they have limited shelf life and don't sell well. You might be able to find some test strips on the Internet. Many years ago, I saw test kits that amounted to small test tubes that you filled with coolant, and then you added a couple of drops of test solution and watched for a color change. Apparently the test strips are they way things are done now.

[KHE]

Yeah sorry for confusion on my post, I was referring to them changing coolant.

Is there a cheap "kit" I can get to test the coolant for exhaust gas?....although since its running so darn good right now I'd almost rather not know

No - most of those combustion kits are in the $50 range. Drive it and forget about it. It's not overheating and is running fine so it is most likely fine. If you are bored, make up a spark plug/air adapter and pressurize each cylinder to 120 psi. while at top dead center.

[BodybyFisher]

Yeah sorry for confusion on my post, I was referring to them changing coolant.

Is there a cheap "kit" I can get to test the coolant for exhaust gas?....although since its running so darn good right now I'd almost rather not know

Yes, Napa sells a cooling system combustion gas tester kit, see it here:

http://www.napaonline.com//MasterPages/NOL...2f+Engine+Block

Yes, ignorance is bliss

[Bruce Nunnally]

On a similar topic, the references all seem to agree that a simple PH test can be used to determine if dexcool's anticorrosion package is used up or in good shape. That seems like a good annual test to add to the maintenance plan.

Example: (not intended as an endorsement): http://www.radstrips.com/

[acklac7]

Am I the only one who finds MonzaRacer’s post to be somewhat suspicious? And not suspicious in the typical sense. I mean suspicious in that he seems to know an awful lot about chemistry and coolant for a tech, albeit an experienced tech.

Take this quote for example:

But other companies are jumping on HOAT band wagon(HYBRID ORGANIC ACID TECHNOLOGY) (they did use a Dex-cool like coolant in the 99 Cougar V6)and this come under the G-05 moniker used by Ford, its low silicate(they don’t like silicates as lazy people dont service thier cooling systems and the silcates chemical treatment washes away and then they sink) and no phosphates and uses instead benzoate.

First off several words are misspelled/misplaced, however disregard the grammatical errors and it’s almost as if your reading a post by you know who. The rest of the post is written in a similar fashion: An overwhelming sense of knowledge followed by obvious mistakes in grammar (possibly as a disguise?).

Furthermore there is a certain “definitive tone” that Monza uses, as if he knows for a fact that what he is stating is true. I have only seen one other individual use this tone….

I could be wrong, but for some reason I get the sense that Monza is a little higher up than an ASE master tech/ASE L1 tech….

EDIT: I guess this guy is a legit tech, judging from his posts, but he does seem to know a heck of alot about coolant.

[GreenMachine]

A search on Google could easily bring the knowledge of coolant he has, several articles I have read said basically the things he has said in similar style.

Then their are other articles which debunk parts of his arguement...and being the internet who knows what really true anymore.

I don't know if its a touchy subject or what but what happened to the Guru you guys all talk about, wish I was around when he was to fill my head with that knowledge.

[BodybyFisher]

A lot of the things you hear here are passed down from the guru, where we run into trouble is when some controversial topic comes up like this one where the guru could trump most head strong opinionated types with facts. Most headstrong opinions can be shot down by facts.

Why don't we all stop worrying WHO the individual MIGHT be and appreciate the data/info they bring to the table so as not to RUIN a good thing just in case. In other words lets not be stupid and spit into the wind here guys LET IT GO.

Bruce feel free to clean this up if you feel its necessary

(Never let the facts get in the way of a carefully thought-out bad decision, Marshall's First Law of Legislature)

[acklac7]

Why don't we all stop worrying WHO the individual MIGHT be and appreciate the data/info they bring to the table so as not to RUIN a good thing just in case. In other words lets not be stupid and spit into the wind here guys LET IT GO.

I agree, that is why I didn't post ask him directly how he came to know so much. The only reason I brought up the identity topic is that I often wonder if other guru-types surf these boards. Apart from a few grammatical mistakes he does seem quite knowledgeable, and has an assertive, definitive, professional tone that you just don't come across that much. Not to mention that Obi-Wan hasn't commented yet, which I find a bit strange.

At any rate my intention was not to stir up a ruckuses that would lead to some sort of confrontation with M.R. I was just wondering if anyone else had the same sentiment

[JasonA]

What's interesting is that all of the problems Monza posts about don't seem to be coolant-related. He calls all the 4.3L heater cores "Dexsludged", but we all know the real reason for that. He also points to a bad batch (chemically) of Dexcool. Fine. Neither of those are engineered problems with the coolant.

1997 Seville, with almost 156k miles, and still going strong with one coolant change and the original head gaskets.

[GreenMachine]

My mistake I wasn't trying to say that this guy is the Guru, just was curious where the Guru you guys talked about went.

[OynxSTS]

As it was relayed to me...

The Guru's boss at GM HQ asked him to stop posting to these boards... I guess it is GM's Corporate Policy that having a senior engineer help the owners of its products is a bad thing...

I hope that the Guru's boss gets "downsized" soon.

[Cadillac Jim]

Actually, as I understand it from a post on GM Insider, there was a corporate decision to stop interacting with the online community. I would gather that some litigious soul managed to cause GM some inconvenience in an incident that our Guru may never know about. As a result all GM employees terminated their memberships in BBS systems such as Caddyinfo, Cadillacforums, and GM Insider in which they were identified as GM employees or were interpreted as speaking with any authority of GM.

Lawyers and insurance companies have entirely too much to say about things due to the necessity of quick-response adjustment to those who seek to make a living without working through the legal system. Tort reform chases innovation in legal scams in a way that reminds me of the computer firewall and virus war. Access to the Guru was a casualty to this.

[OynxSTS]

Lawyers and insurance companies have entirely too much to say about things....Access to the Guru was a casualty to this.

Amen!

However, a strong management team/CEO should have recognized the obvious benefit of having the senior engineers who design and build a product being "out there" promoting it.

I would have loved to have been at the management table when this decision was made. Pure Stupidity. So as a result of this position, if one of us were to run into the Guru at a Pub someplace and ask him a question about the new STS-V, would he have to answer "Uh, sorry, I have no comment."?

Nice Job GM! Let's silence the very best product ambassadors you have.

If I was the CEO at Toyota, I don't think I could wish for anything better!

[epricedright]

Why he's gone makes absolutely no sense to me.

Q: What do you have when a lawyer is buried up to his neck in sand?

A: Not enough sand.

[Bill K]

I have to believe people like Guru were not a problem to GM.

However, we all know "experts" and when they are representing GM just by their employment status they could well be counter productive.

AS an example: I've known people who built/worked in the plants, at Whirlpool & Fridgidaire refirigerator factories. Some employees will say they wont buy a Whirlpool cause they know how its made. Same for Fridgidaire.

The old adage still holds; Familarity breeds contempt.

[KHE]

I have to believe people like Guru were not a problem to GM.

However, we all know "experts" and when they are representing GM just by their employment status they could well be counter productive.

AS an example: I've known people who built/worked in the plants, at Whirlpool & Fridgidaire refirigerator factories. Some employees will say they wont buy a Whirlpool cause they know how its made. Same for Fridgidaire.

The old adage still holds; Familarity breeds contempt.

The guru was not a problem to GM. There is much more that happened than what most of us realize. It is unfortunate that he does not frequent this board anymore.

[Ranger]

The guru was not a problem to GM. There is much more that happened than what most of us realize. It is unfortunate that he does not frequent this board anymore.

I think that is the trues statement yet. I don't think I ever heard him utter an unkind word about the General. He probably has a GM tattoo on his chest. Certainly no contempt on his part. He still makes an occasional appearance at cadillacforums, under another name of coarse and certainly makes no mention of any relationship to the General. He did more public relations work for GM than they will ever know and it is too bad that they don't. He was one of their best assests and advocates.

[weephee]

Perhaps I'm being a bit naive but if we feel this engineer added as much value to this forum as he did to General Motors perhaps a written letter from the authority of this board to GM public relations VP might allow them to explain their policy and rethink its' value. I received feedback from him several times and certain concur that he contribution was invaluable. Sometimes big corporations do listen.

[BodybyFisher]

The problem is the litigious nature of the world we live in. Let's face that fact! Even here when someone cries the blues about how their engine blew or burns oil or cracked OUTSIDE warranty, there are a whole slew of members that JUMP on the band wagon to sue GM, as a lot of you know it makes me sick.. We hear how GM can afford it and how GM has deep pockets... BUT the fact remains, the warranty has EXPIRED! No ticky no shirty!

Now lets say that I work for GM as a powertrain engineer and that fact is known. And lets say, I recommend that WOTs be done to improve oil consumption and to get rid of the cold knock..

One of the members goes out and looses control of his car gets killed in the process, blows his engine, kills someone, etc, and an ATTORNEY finds out that a GM employee recommended this "unusual" "dangerous" procedure that takes a motorist beyond the legal speed limit, YOUR HONOR...... AND to make matters worse, there is proof of it in the blogs... What do you think an attorney is going to do with that? This is one of the reasons, that when I recommend the WOT procedure I make sure to say to only do it on a LIGHTLY TRAVELLED DRY road... because you never know who is on the other side of the keyboard.

As a commercial real estate appraiser I can be sued for discussing values of real estate, because when I give an opinion its implied that "that's the value". If I provide a value without doing the work and research, and someone looses money as a result my neck is in a noose...

With the nature of attorneys and the law, that is sympathetic toward the little guy companies have to be careful. Now I am NOT saying this is what happened, this is just an example of why GM might NOT want their employees making public statements, the potential for liability.

Does anyone remember on the other board, the guy who did a WOT and blew is engine? The guru was stunned that the engine blew. Over the internet, its virtually impossible to properly diagnose noises, etc if there is a serious mechanical problem (rod bearing, etc) if a WOT is done, serious damage could result. So there is a risk. Lets face the facts we all have varying levels of mechanical experience and we could misdiagnose a serious problem for a carbon knock..

[weephee]

I agree with Bodybyfisher but, and there is always a but, not all the advice he gave was open to possible litigationi. He also sorted out a lot of maintenance problems plus he often described the reasons for certain designs etc. An Example is the beginning of this post which kind of got off topic. I guess what I'm saying is that he, as do all of us, has to be careful what is being said but that certainly doesn't prohibit good helpful discussion on all subjects.

[Cadillac Jim]

wheepee -- The situation with us and the Guru had nothing directly to do with the litigation issue. The litigation issue drove a corporate decision, and there could not be exceptions.

BodybyFisher -- I feel a lot of frustration when a newbie posts a very good question and expects a quick and accurate answer, such as "My transmission takes off in second gear, and my Check Engine light is on. What do I do?" We usually tell them to pull the codes and post them, but there is no substitute for the eyes, ears, and equipment of an experienced, skilled, intelligent technician. We can solve most of the problems online with the codes and descriptions of the problems and symptoms, but some of them can't be solved with text messages in a reasonable amount of time. And, what about somebody that has coolant in the water and doesn't know it -- and no codes hint at it, and calls about an engine miss or knock or rough idle when cold? A WOT could put coolant in the bearings or pistons... Coolant in the oil is a very rare problem with a Northstar but nothing is impossible in this world.

[BodybyFisher]

I agree with Bodybyfisher but, and there is always a but, not all the advice he gave was open to possible litigationi. He also sorted out a lot of maintenance problems plus he often described the reasons for certain designs etc. An Example is the beginning of this post which kind of got off topic. I guess what I'm saying is that he, as do all of us, has to be careful what is being said but that certainly doesn't prohibit good helpful discussion on all subjects.

I agree with you whole heartedly, I loved the guru and no one misses him more than me. He did NO harm and only bolstered GMs position and helped to support GMs products and dispel rumors and urban myths. His legacy is carried on here in our posts and knowledge, but, we sure could use his presence for the unusual situation that arises.

I learned so much from him, he had no ego, he shared his knowledge freely and when I/we made a mistake or mistatement he never came down hard or ridiculed. One of our members and not taking away from anyone at all, KHE, is always focused and to the point, much like the guru was/is.

[Ranger]

Perhaps I'm being a bit naive but if we feel this engineer added as much value to this forum as he did to General Motors perhaps a written letter from the authority of this board to GM public relations VP might allow them to explain their policy and rethink its' value. I received feedback from him several times and certain concur that he contribution was invaluable. Sometimes big corporations do listen.

NO, NO. The Guru specifically asked that "We let it die a silent death. The quicker the better". Let sleeping dogs lie.

[GreenMachine]

Didn't mean to side track the thread as much as I did, but its nice to know the whole story now, thanks for all that.

Ya know the position on dex-cool could be whats its designed to do, be a great, long lasting coolant for a low maintenance engine, but sometimes design differs from what actually happens. That seems to mainly be what happened in a few engine lines at GM.

Also, our correlation we discovered with more 96+ vehicles having head gasket issues could also be simply there are more of that body style on the road, more produced, plus the Northstar became the standard engine of Deville, Eldorado, Seville, that year, prior to that it was still an optional "system" on Deville, the number 1 selling traditional luxury car on the market, thats a large volume increase so naturally more cars with the engine=same percent of failures but more because there is more.