Third Alternator Failure!

[Ohio Jim]

Good evening to all, once again,

Well it has been a few months, maybe three, since I replace that miracle of an alternator on the '99 STS. The water cooling has worked exceptionally! I wish I could get an alternator which would do the same with electricity! Saturday should be my third alternator change out, so I am hopefully getting pretty good at it! Bought the car with 37,k on it years ago. At ~120,k the alternator failed. Shop said it was a rebuilt. I thought that odd. Unable to get it rebuilt, so I bought a rebuilt unit for $175 with 'all new parts'. Ten months later it ate a bearing. Replaced at no cost, just a lot of my labor. Now it is failing to charge. Car says no charging going on. Volts at 12.2! Battery light flashed on a few times, but generally stays off. I am charging the battery and driving 20 miles one way to work, and charging again. Worked that way for two days now. Battery volts never drop below 12.2. I have verified with digital volt meter on the road. Twice the volts jumped up to 14.4, I stopped and verified with meter. It is easy when you drive around with no back seat! LOL Alternator shop says they will have another in the morning! i'll let you know how it all turns out. Could there be an underlying cause? The little clip on device located on the hot wire is in place and looks fine.

Thanks for listening!

Ohio Jim

[rockfangd]

I bought a brand new one for my 01 eldo for 175 I believe. Delco Remy. Worked nice.

• Before you replace the alternator inspect the pigtail that plugs into it. I now have a spare alternator because that pigtail was bad rather than the alternator. It didnt bother me anyway because the old one was a remy rebuilt

[Cadillac Jim]

I believe that the alternator is one of those things that if you pay a dealer for a new one and labor to change it, you get a lifetime guarantee, parts and labor. Ask your dealer if that applies to your car. Pricey, it it's out there.

[Ohio Jim]

rockfangd, and Cadillac Jim,

Thanks for the advice. If I new then what I know now! Where did you get a new alternator that cheap? The new alternator I was looking at was $540! Anyway I worked 17 hours at work yesterday, and then went home with the message of no change, but no battery light on. It was bugging me, so I kept trying to determine whether it was actually the alternator. I found the second wire attached to the sensor which clips onto the positive battery cable at the battery, to be hanging on by a thread! I repaired it and all appeared to be well. I went to the alternator shop who had ordered in a third alternator for me today. We hooked up his meter, and he said the sine wave was good and the volts were again at 14.0, which matched the dash reading. I left without the alternator. He agreed to keep it for two weeks in case the alternator does fail, before returning it. Dale just got added to my Christmas list!

So instead of the alternator change tomorrow, I plan to install new oil pressure sensors on both Caddy's, as I have been getting intermittent codes to shut down engine for low oil pressure! Can someone confirm I should remove the oil filter adapter in order to remove the sending unit, as I am unable to unscrew the units in the current position? Also, can anyone confirm the seals are #212 O-ring?

Thanks for everything,

Ohio Jim

[rockfangd]

great news. glad you fixed it.

I dont remove the adaptor. Others may, Typically it is possible to do it without removable of the adaptor but may be more difficult.

Just out of curiosity What oil filter are you using. I had a 96 eldo that didnt like fram. It would flicker as it warmed up and come on steady when it was hot.

[Ohio Jim]

rockfangd,

What the heck do you use to unscrew it! Are you a mechanic? I tried when I had the radiator out for the last alternator change and could not get the 1-1/16" box wrench even close to unscrew it! I read someone's post saying he did it in ten minutes. I've had the part in my console for months. I just bought the second one for my Deville because now I am getting the same message there, and I am about to leave for Florida in a few weeks. I remember changing the O-rings on my other '99 STS, so I removed the adaptor to do it. It just came to me a few weeks ago, "that must the ten minute change someone posted". Please tell me how you did it!! I only use AC PF-61 filter every time. Advance Auto with 30 or 40 percent off, so only about $2.68 each. I stock up when I can to make orders go high enough to get the discount.

Please tell Me!

Thanks,

Ohio Jim

[rockfangd]

Yes. I work on Diesels, buses, and cars. Alot of fords.

I used a deep socket 1/2 i believe with adaptor to 3/8 to gain room. Once it is broken loose it comes out decent. Hardest time I had was breaking it loose and starting the threads on the new one

[winterset]

I used a open end wrench on mine, and it worked just fine. I had my replacement oil sending unit sitting on my shelf for years. As soon as i replaced it the flicker stopped. I am by no means a mechanic.

[KHE]

There is a special socket for the sensor. When I had my engine out of my STS several years ago for the head gasket repair, I noticed the oil pressure sensor was leaking. I tried to remove it with a wrench and it felt like it was going to crush the sensor. I left it alone and just recently changed it. I picked up the socket on Amazon for $8.00 with free shipping. It came right out.

I did not remove the oil filter adapter - I was doing an oil change and it was on a weekend so I knew obtaining new o-rings for the adapter would be difficult. It was difficult to get my hand in there and start the new sensor. I could have removed the front engine mount but did not want to mess with that either.

[Ohio Jim]

Gentlemen,

I did not realize there was a special socket for this. I will now look into that

Thanks!

Ohio Jim

[Texas Jim]

Gentlemen,

I did not realize there was a special socket for this. I will now look into that

Thanks!

Ohio Jim

Here is the socket you need...

http://www.amazon.com/Lisle-13200-Universal-Pressure-Sending/dp/B0002SR27Y/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1404214182&sr=8-3&keywords=oil+pressure+sensor+socket

[Ohio Jim]

Texas Jim,

Thanks for the link. That makes it soo much easier. Will order right away!

Ohio Jim

[barczy01]

you can rent one from autozone for free.

[Z15]

Its near impossible to buy a NEW alternator/started for a car more than a few years old. They are all remanufactured, even the AC Delco/GM. The AC Delco are warrantied for a year, buying brands is a crap shoot, they cut corners to save cost. A friend manages a CARQUEST parts store and he told me 25% of the starters and alternators don't last 6 months. His phone rings off the hook all day long and there are only 2 questions, got a alternator for car? How much? Cost, not quality drives sales.

[KHE]

Its near impossible to buy a NEW alternator/started for a car more than a few years old. They are all remanufactured, even the AC Delco/GM. The AC Delco are warrantied for a year, buying brands is a crap shoot, they cut corners to save cost. A friend manages a CARQUEST parts store and he told me 25% of the starters and alternators don't last 6 months. His phone rings off the hook all day long and there are only 2 questions, got a alternator for car? How much? Cost, not quality drives sales.

Those are the reasons I have a local starter and alternator shop rebuild my existing starters/alternators. All of my vehicles have the ORIGINAL starters and alternators. One is approaching 200,000 miles, the other has just over 150,000 miles on the odometer. With that method, I have never had a failure.

[Cadillac Jim]

I've rebuilt a few alternators in my time. Unless the commutator needs to be turned or a winding is open, I can change the bearings, regulator, diodes, and brushes. I've even used special solder to repair a field winding that had been damaged by debris in the alternator. It's been a number of years since I have had an alternator failure, though.

[Ohio Jim]

KHE,

When this first started, that was my intent. I have always had my alternators rebuilt locally so I would have the piece of mind knowing the form, fit, and function remain intact. This time, my alternator guy said he could not get the parts, because the water cooled alternator was too rare. I cringed! I could have spent $50 less at Autoxone, but he assured me the alternator would be completely rebuilt with new parts. Do you know if there are any forum to find reputable establishments who do, in fact, rebuild alternators?

Ohio Jim

[Cadillac Jim]

I was getting a battery for my wife's car at a NAPA store and noticed a flier for rebuilding alternators. I asked about 1998-2000 Cadillacs with the water-cooled alternator and they said that they would have to look it up.

I think an exchange rebuilt alternator would be safe for one of these unless someone can identify a third-party source for non-AC/Delco builds. One horror scenario is to give up your water-cooled alternator and open the box and find an air-cooled cheap alternator that won't last and a fitting to hook the water input and output hoses together.

Another approach would be to find a source for a rebuilding kit that includes brushes and regulator at a minimum and do it yourself.

[Ohio Jim]

rockfangd, and Cadillac Jim,

So instead of the alternator change tomorrow, I plan to install new oil pressure sensors on both Caddy's, as I have been getting intermittent codes to shut down engine for low oil pressure! Can someone confirm I should remove the oil filter adapter in order to remove the sending unit, as I am unable to unscrew the units in the current position? Also, can anyone confirm the seals are #212 O-ring?

Thanks for everything,

Ohio Jim

Well how time flies! it is December and I just replaced the oil sending unit on the '99 STS. I removed the oil filter adapter and installed two #212 O-Rings. It worked out fine. Next is the front valve cover gasket with the cam seal. It appears to be leaking quite a bit. Any pitfalls I should know about before I buy the seals?

I was about to replace the oil sending unit on my wife's '04 Deville the other day, when my son mentioned the gasket is different. I see it online. It looks like a gasket with two O-Rings built into it. I plan to order from Rock Auto along with the valve cover gasket.

Thanks for all your support!

Ohio Jim

[KHE]

You need a power steering pulley puller to remove the pulley on the cam. Any auto parts store will have them - some in the free loan-a-tool program. Don't hammer or try to beat the pulley off the cam or you risk damaging the cam. You will also need a metric bolt and some washers to pull the pulley back onto the cam at the reassembly stage.

Front cam cover should be an easy job to R&R as long as you have the proper pulley puller.

[Ohio Jim]

KHE,

Thanks for the reminder about the puller. Now I did not realize I need a bolt and washers to reassemble. Do I use the bolt in the threads on the end of the cam and 'push' the water pump pulley back onto the shaft?

Thanks,

Ohio Jim

[KHE]

KHE,

Thanks for the reminder about the puller. Now I did not realize I need a bolt and washers to reassemble. Do I use the bolt in the threads on the end of the cam and 'push' the water pump pulley back onto the shaft?

Thanks,

Ohio Jim

Yes - the bolt with the washers threads into the cam. It pulls the pulley on. I think it is an M8 bolt but I am not positive.

[Ohio Jim]

Thanks KHE!

I will be prepared!

Ohio Jim