95SLS Posted February 8, 2004 Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 I heard on the radio (XM) where Onstar sued the FBI for ease dropping on onstar customers while they had casual conversations in their cars. Seem they used Mr. Bush's patriot act to drop in on the signal and listen to whoever they so desired. Yes it's true! So you are going down the road and whatever your are saying they can be listening. So, Onstar won the lawsuit that should disallow the further ease dropping. BUT not because of any violation of constitutional rights or invasion of privacy, nope they won the lawsuit because it is a breach of contract because while the FBI was listening to you on the onstar, it disabled the locator on the system. Thus, you were not getting what you paid for and that is the reason that they have to quit doing what they were. But, No onstar for me, I don't trust uncle sam that much and maybe everyone should conside that fact that thay CAN drop in on your conversation at any time if you have onstar! Check out this story it's true! MC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95SLS Posted February 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 I did a search and many articles came up, One gave information that the court ruling against the tapping only applies to states in the 9th district court. Ca was one, I guess in all other states, you still have to worry about the tap. Just type in onstar in a Google search and you'll get all the news on this story, It varies alot. So read a few. MC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Posted February 8, 2004 Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 removed by user Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjtjwdad Posted February 8, 2004 Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 Why am I NOT suprised. I have onstar on my STS but it is not activated. I guess they could still listen in. Does anyone know where the onstar components are? I know there is a small antenna on my back glass and the buttons on the rear view mirror but where is the GPS unit? Thanks! Jim White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob D Posted February 8, 2004 Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 Being a 'keep it simple' type, I never could understand why anybody would pay the extra bucks for the option, and then the (monthly?) service..For what? To unlock your car from orbit? Geezz..keep a key wrapped in plastic up in a corner underneath the car. ( I do on every car I own) Besides that, what else to you need, a cell phone (that you're already paying for..) and a 1.25$ map...Ok that's about it..right? They can listen in 'till the cows come home for all I care, I've got nothing to hide, and besides they've got WAY bigger fish to fry than me... What I really don't like is the ability to track my location and velocity from up above...uh, uh, Nope. Wouldn't be comfortable with that at all.. '93 STS.. opened, dropped, wide...fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted February 8, 2004 Report Share Posted February 8, 2004 Heres a link to the story about the OnStar... http://news.com.com/2100-1029_3-5109435.html Logan Diagnostic LLC www.airbagcrash.com www.logandieselusa.com www.ledfix.com www.ledfix.com/yukontaillightrepair.html www.ledfix.com/ledreplacements.html www.ledfix.com/j42385toolrental.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Nunnally Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 You get a 1-year onstar subscription for free with a new caddy, so that's easy enough. After that you have to pay for the subscription. Far as the phone monitoring, the legal advice I get is don't discuss anything you consider private except on a landline. Any cell connection is a broadcast. Not too worried about whether the Government is monitoring my speed at the moment, but I suspect someday in the future we will get tickets by computer monitoring, say for speeds of 100+ mph or similar. Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marika Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Why would the FBI be monitoring OnStar users anyway? Haven't they yet figured out that gangsters don't drive Caddys? They drive Lincolns and the newer generation of gangstas drive Mercedes and BMW. If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 You guys remind me of that dude on that Hank Hill TV cartoon who's always scared of a government conspiracy! ANY wireless telephone conversation can be listened to, you know that! It's not just Onstar. Besides, don't discount a few of Onstar's really unique and worthwhile features in my opinion. One is emergency dispatch in case of an airbag deployment event. In the event where you are knocked out or something else happens where you can't communicate, the Onstar service will dispatch emergency services on your behalf. That's pretty dang good in my opinion! I'm not sure if the advantages of Onstar justify the cost (I don't have the system, and don't know all of its features), but you also can't assume that any telephone conversation you have over the air won't be intercepted (by anyone). As Bruce said, if you're really scared of the government, use a land line. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95SLS Posted February 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 I'm with BOB D I have a door only key well hidden, and then I have codes in my alarm I can over ride if I need to get in, or send someone in for that matter. This way If they find my hide a key (I don't see how, I know where it is at and I have problems finding it once the road dirt settles) they still have 2 alarms they have to get through. Now mind you if I use that same key the alarms will go off also, But I can turn them off in seconds. (Using the over ride codes and valet button.) As far as getting help, WHO now a days does not have a cell phone? If is a real emergency I can call 911. I can always call for any kind of help I need. And I bet what arrives will be a lot cheaper. I don't see what is so cool about it, maybe the gps, that is IF you are apt to getting lost (Not me) and can't read a map, don't have GPS in your cell, or have a map program on your loptop. I can see how it might be helpful for Sr citizens who proably don't have to worry about any of their conversations being monitored. You never know what you might say taht will be used against you. The articles said that any joe blow can get equipment to monitor your car. I'm sure it's a lot better quilaity sound than a cell phone, since it has a better antenna and a very quiet listening enviorment. I never have pasengers so all they would get listening to me is 70's music on XM radio. LOL Ok, it's free. Watch what you say! How much is it a month anyways? And the mic is in same place as the sunglass holder two screws and it's out! Un-plug the microphone easily. Not too sure about the GPS but has to have a fuse somewhere. MC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 I'm with jadcock on this one, any perception of privacy in todays world is total fantasy. All cell phone have a locator chip, not only so the cell towers can find you, but law enforcement as well. That goes for satellite phones (remember the war in Iraq) and for all I know XM radio too! Anything broadcast on the air waves can be picked up by anybody that has the desire and a few bucks for equipment. Wether it be your cordless phone or your wireless network on your computer. And the sad story in the news from Sarasota...got pictures of the kidnapper before anyone knew a crime was commited. And while I'm on a rant, as you enter a football stadium, or airport, or a subway, and many more places that I haven't thought of yet, a camera takes your picture and identifies your facial features, these can be matched to your ticket stub so a database of your facial features can be kept, matched to your name, address and SS number. Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike98c Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Onstar (assuming a airbag deployment) would be handy if you end up unconcious in a ditch out of sight of the road, or even in sight of the road but everyone assuming no ones in the car and so no help until the highway patrol comes along and finds you slumped over in the car. That said you must also realize the court can yank the computer module on your late model car which always records and stores the last few seconds of your cars speed, brake force, steering wheel angle etc. This info. is continually overwritten but if your in a crash and the vehicle is disabled the info. is right there and can be retrieved. As I said once before, they used this info. to convict the driver of a Camaro who hit and killed two teenage girls backing out of thier driveway a couple of years ago. The driver said he might have been over the speed limit. The investigators knew this was obviously untrue. The data recorded just before the crash showed the driver traveling almost one hundred miles an hour and accelerating down the two lane residential street. I also mentioned the drunk driver that left the scene of an accident with his air bag having deployed. Onstar called emergency dispatch to report an accident with airbag deployment. When the authorities asked where the vehicle wasthe Onstar operator guided them to the driveway of the hit and run drivers residence where the guy was still sitting in his truck lol. That being said I still am uncomfortable with the possible abuse of the tracking system although as long as your cell phone is powered up you can be tracked and it doesn't matter if your making a call. I'm certainly can't see giving up the cell for that reason although some days I'd LIKE to give it up for other reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjtjwdad Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Since this a Caddy board I'll keep the politics out. What bothers me about things on this line is not so much the rule/law itself, it's the way they are abused from time to time. Jim White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 I would agree with your statement Bob D. I have been perfectly fine with the cell phone and a map. In an Ontar equiped vehicle that I ever may own...I will also disconnect anything that works with the system. It may be nice, but more than an invasion of privacy, it can be a tracking device for speed, which at times would be terrible...not at all for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike98c Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Just a reminder to all! If you rent a vehicle check the fine print since a few of the companies use GPS to track your speed during your rental. If they find you've exceeded the speed limit they could slap you with a hefty surcharge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 MikeC is correct... You now have to be very detailed about any accident info. "I was only going 55" will not fly. Dont tell them you were doing 60 and really doing 100. They will suspect all of your info after they see the data.. We actually have the equipment that can download the airbag crash data. The Vetroinix CDR. Sample 117 crash data... http://www.millerengineering.com/cdr-ex.gif For the most part I trust police departments. But....if they take your statement and then mention....oh, yeah...we will gather the crash data from the SDM. Its your word against the SDM. Hence the problem....bad news they will use it to throw the book at you. Any 'good' news....it may clear you.... But, if if does not they may reply that there no good data recorded etc. Hence we are here.... www.aibagcrash.com Logan Logan Diagnostic LLC www.airbagcrash.com www.logandieselusa.com www.ledfix.com www.ledfix.com/yukontaillightrepair.html www.ledfix.com/ledreplacements.html www.ledfix.com/j42385toolrental.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dasher Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Oh God! If my life were only exciting enough that the FBI would want to eavesdrop on my OnStar conversations. If I thought they would, I would get On Star! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Oh God! If my life were only exciting enough that the FBI would want to eavesdrop on my OnStar conversations. If I thought they would, I would get On Star! Ha ha ha!!!! +25 points for the best reply to this thread yet!!!! Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjtjwdad Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Dasher Posted on Feb 9 2004, 04:31 AM Oh God! If my life were only exciting enough that the FBI would want to eavesdrop on my OnStar conversations. If I thought they would, I would get On Star! Kinda' makes me want to sing Kum-bah -ya when head out today! Jim White Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 More info at this website.....also be sure to watch the video debate... CBC black box Logan Diagnostic LLC www.airbagcrash.com www.logandieselusa.com www.ledfix.com www.ledfix.com/yukontaillightrepair.html www.ledfix.com/ledreplacements.html www.ledfix.com/j42385toolrental.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Nunnally Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 The 2004 CTS manual says: Vehicle Data Collection and Event Data Records Your vehicle, like other modern motor vehicles, has a number of sophisticated computer systems that monitor and control several aspects of the vehicle’s performance. Your vehicle uses on-board vehicle computers to monitor emission control components to optimize fuel economy, to monitor conditions for airbag deployment and, if so equipped, to provide anti-lock braking and to help the driver control the vehicle in difficult driving situations. Some information may be stored during regular operations to facilitate repair of detected malfunctions; other information is stored only in a crash or near crash event by computer systems commonly called event data recorders (EDR). In a crash or near crash event, computer systems, such as the Airbag Sensing and Diagnostic Module (SDM) in your vehicle may record information about the condition of the vehicle and how it was operated, such as engine speed, brake applications, throttle position, vehicle speed, seat belt usage, airbag readiness, airbag performance data, and the severity of a collision. This information has been used to improve vehicle crash performance and may be used to improve crash performance of future vehicles and driving safety. Unlike the data recorders on many airplanes, these on-board systems do not record sounds, such as conversation of vehicle occupants. To read this information, special equipment is needed and access to the vehicle or the SDM is required. GM will not access information about a crash event or share it with others other than • with the consent of the vehicle owner or, if the vehicle is leased, with the consent of the lessee, • in response to an official request of police or similar government office, • as part of GM’s defense of litigation through the discovery process, or • as required by law. In addition, once GM collects or receives data, GM may • use the data for GM research needs, • make it available for research where appropriate confidentiality is to be maintained and need is shown, or • share summary data which is not tied to a specific vehicle with non-GM organizations for research purposes. Others, such as law enforcement, may have access to the special equipment that can read the information if they have access to the vehicle or SDM. If your vehicle is equipped with OnStar, please check the OnStar subscription service agreement or manual for information on its operations and data collection. Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 This is the special equipment needed to get the data- About $3000.....this one is ours.. Logan Diagnostic LLC www.airbagcrash.com www.logandieselusa.com www.ledfix.com www.ledfix.com/yukontaillightrepair.html www.ledfix.com/ledreplacements.html www.ledfix.com/j42385toolrental.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimJ Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 I have ONSTAR and I like it. I use the personel calling feature, and the virtual advisor feature. I drive to work and back and I play my XM radio. They would get bored pretty fast monitoring me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimJ Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 If you go over 110MPH with the cruse control on in my 2001. You set a trouble code. "Cruse Control Malfunction Speed grreater than 110" Make sure you clear your codes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dloch Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 If you go over 110MPH with the cruse control on in my 2001. You set a trouble code. "Cruse Control Malfunction Speed grreater than 110" Make sure you clear your codes. Obviously this is a problem that you can attest too...... Or was this hearsay.... LOL Dennis Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.