Buick gone?

[Dasher]

I just heard on the T and V Noon news that GM is considering dropping the Buick line in an attempt to save money.

That would be too bad but could only be a good thing for Cadillac. Those Buick owners have to go somewhere and I don't see them buying Pontiacs or Chevrolets.

[danbuc]

What will they do with all those new models they just came out with? If they dropped buick now, I think that would do more harm than good, to GM. They just spent all that money, developing those new vehicles, and if they drop Buick, all of it will be lost.

I definitely agree though, that dropping buick would be better for Cadillac. It would allow more freedom in the company, to design cars for a larger group of customers, and price ranges.

[sprucegoose]

Hadn't heard this report yet, but it is strange I was just thinking of this yesterday. All the hype about the Buick Lacrosse and Rendevous... I just don't care for them, and don't think they're doing too well.

The reason I was thinking about it was I actually noticed a seemingly increased number of seniors driving Pontiacs. Bonneville's, Grand Prix's, and even quite a bit of the Vibe's are driven by 60+year-olds! In fact all 3 of the Bonneville GXP's I've seen so far were driven by gray haired dudes!

[JasonA]

Oh no! I don't like that, simply for the fact that the Buick Lucerne is scheduled to get the LD8 Northstar in the near future! The way I look at it, the more choices I have for pre-owned Northstar cars, the better my chances are that I'll be able to find one in great shape a few years from now. We lost the Bonneville GXP, but the new Lucerne looked promising.

[tmpafford]

I hear that they were dropping ONE of their product lines. I have not heard them name Buick mentioned yet. It could be any one of them. SAAB, OPEL, Vauxhall, Holden, Saturn, Hummer, Pontiac, GMC, Cadillac, Chevrolet, or Buick. OPEL seems like the more likely candidate to me. I have never heard of Vauxhall or Holden.

[cadillac_caddy_sts]

First Oldsmobile than Buick! This is making me worried about Cadillac for the next few years!

[yenko]

What was the reason for dropping Oldsmobile? I never did like any of the Buick vehicles! Its about time!

[tmpafford]

Or maybe even the GMC consumer market. All their line up is just Chevrolets with a different grill emblem.

[JimD]

....As for market share, Lutz discussed several new models intended to reverse or at least halt the loss of customers to rivals. If those efforts fail, he said, he could not rule out eliminating one of the automaker's "damaged brands," such as Pontiac or Buick.

"Over time, if one of the troubled brands ... that's been undernourished for many years, if it fails to turn around, then we'd have to look at a phase-out," Lutz said in response to questions at Morgan Stanley's Global Automotive Conference in New York.

Lutz said he hoped GM wouldn't have to phase out one of its weaker brands at a time when competitors like BMW AG and Toyota Motor Corp. are adding brands. "That's what we're trying to correct with an exciting array of new products," he said.

But he added that he and GM Chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner are determined to invest money wisely.

"Rick is always saying: 'Let's not squander all our resources on trying to overcome negative momentum. Let's put the resources where we've got positive momentum, which is basically ... Cadillac, Hummer and GMC,' " Lutz said....

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

All above was taken from a Detroit Free Press article dated March 24, 2005. Sounds like Lutz is willing to do what he is paid to do; protect the investment of the owners of General Motors Corporation.

Cadillac is not in jeopardy.

[JasonA]

What was the reason for dropping Oldsmobile? I never did like any of the Buick vehicles! Its about time!

GM had one too many "mid-lux" brands. Cadillac had an image. Luxury cars. Pontiac had an image. Sporty performance. Chevy had an image. "Value". Olds and Buick both had the same sort of image, for decades. "Poor man's Cadillac". Basically, a nice compromise between a Caddy and a Chevy.

Olds had some really mediocre product in the late 1980s and early 1990s. The Achieva was particularly bad I think. Not necessarily from a mechanical standpoint, but there was certainly no curb appeal there. I think Oldsmobile suffered from a "name" stigma, and an aging customer base. It wasn't "cool" to own an Oldsmobile. They hoped the Aurora and Intrigue would change that around, but unfortunately, neither pulled the brand out of mediocrity I guess. As a longtime fan of Oldsmobiles, and as one who attended their centennial celebration in Lansing in August of 1997, I was sad to learn of their "cancellation" a few years ago.

I am surprised to hear that GM might be dropping Buick. Let's see if that actually makes it to fruition. I think Buick has been kind of struggling to find itself lately. The Rendezvous is pretty "out there". Where does that vehicle fit into their lineup?? Buick's version of the 2005 GM minivan chassis is just hideous looking in my opinion. I believe they've moved away from their traditional selling point -- classy and understated mid-lux vehicles.

It's interesting -- as I type this, I realize that with added options available on more vehicles now, it almost makes the distinct vehicle brands redundant (which is possibly why they're considering dropping Buick). For example, you could probably have said of the past, a Buick Regal was just a Pontiac Grand Prix or a Chevy Monte Carlo with leather. And that was probably true a few decades ago...because you couldn't get leather in most vehicles. You HAD to step up to the nicer brands to be able to order those things. But anymore, you can get leather in almost anything out there, which seems to make the vehicle brands that focused on a compromise between value and luxury redundant, because with the long option lists available today, you can custom-order your own personal compromise on almost any vehicle out there. You really can order a Chevy Cobalt with leather and seat heaters, and order a "stripped" Cadillac in cloth and all manual options but manual crank windows!

[Bob D]

I hear that they were dropping ONE of their product lines. I have not heard them name Buick mentioned yet. It could be any one of them. SAAB, OPEL, Vauxhall, Holden, Saturn, Hummer, Pontiac, GMC, Cadillac, Chevrolet, or Buick. OPEL seems like the more likely candidate to me. I have never heard of Vauxhall or Holden.

Vauxhall is one British line, Holden is an entire Austrailian company, about the equivalant of GM down there.

[KG6PSK]

As an aside, Holden (GM of Australia) is the maker of the Pontiac GTO. They make some nice toys down under! Check out their homepages at www.hsv.com.au and www.holden.com.au. The Ute and Maloo look like a new El Camino just waiting to happen!

Mark

[67coupedeville]

I really do not like the Buick Century, I really do not like the new GM Minivans in general, they're not new, they only got a face lift and a bad one at that, I do not like the Rendezvous, Rainier...forget about it, the new LaCrosse doesn't do anything for me. The only Buick's I like are the LeSabre and the new Lucerne, but Buick should have done some better marketing of the name. Across Canada, there is a Milk brand name called, you guessed it Lucerne. Buick just kicked themselves in the pants by bringing the term "Grocery-getter" to a whole new level, mind you it does look like a very appealing car with "catcher mitt type seating surfaces", I like that. To me though, the only Buick I would buy is the 2004 LeSabre with 17" wheels and a supercharged version of the bulletproof 3800 V6. But I guess that a used Buick is as best they'll get out of me .

Spence

[JasonA]

But I guess that a used Buick is as best they'll get out of me .

I bet you could get a screamin' deal on a used S/C 3800 Regal, 2-3 years old. 0-60 in 6.6 seconds I think with those cars. Complete sleepers.

[Regis]

I just viewed the video of the Buick Lucerne. I have to say that it's the first Buick ever to catch my eye. The one trademark design that nags me about Buicks in general are those carp/catfish/sucker mouth grill designs....ugh! I'll see a new Buick from the back and think "hey not bad" and then make my way around to the side "nice", then get to the front of the car and well....."ugh!" is all that comes out. When I hear someone mention Buick, I think fish lip car.

They changed the grill design on the Lucerne just enough to allow me to appreciate the rest of its attributes. To that alone I salute Buick. Impressive interior. Seems like they have a winner.

-kg

[Poobah]

The article I read said GM was considering dropping another brand. The names Pontiac and Buick were mentioned as "damaged brands" because investment in them has lagged in recent years. The article said GM plans to invest heavily in new models for these brands to bolster sales so it won't be necessary to discontinue them.

If they have to, it would make sense to me to drop the Pontiac name. That would leave Chevrolet, Buick, and Cadillac for bottom, middle, and top of the line.

I think it's interesting how forign auto makers like BMW and Mercedes have only one brand. Their bottom, middle, and top of the line cars are represented by different models of that brand rather than giving them different brand names like american auto makers do.

[Scotty]

Personally, I am not surprised by Buick possibly going away. To me Buick's styling is tired, and inevidably when you see a Buick its an older couple, not that I have anything against older couples. Buick has become blah if you ask me, in the 60's and 70's they had exciting vehicles in their fold in the Grand National, Regal T-Type, Riviera, GS, they had innovative engines with turbos. They have become a soccer mom vehicle, the new Lucerne looks like a recycled Ford Taurus, sorry to sound so harsh, but I have looking at the Buick lately and wondering what is going on. They need better designs that key on the Buick root 'look'. Buick has taken a lot of chances with their design and I think they have failed of late.

[sprucegoose]

The one trademark design that nags me about Buicks in general are those carp/catfish/sucker mouth grill designs....ugh! 

-kg

Buick = strange, ugly grills that is for sure! Your post reminded me of this car that a guy I car-pooled to work with years ago drove. It looked very similar to this one, and it had a straight-8 with 3 on the column if I remember right. Man, did that grill look like it would swallow you up if you got too close!

You know, i must really have been nulling out the Buicks, I didn't even realize that the new Lucerne had a N* in it!

[JasonA]

I think it's interesting how forign auto makers like BMW and Mercedes have only one brand.  Their bottom, middle, and top of the line cars are represented by different models of that brand rather than giving them different brand names like american auto makers do.

I think the different brand named-vehicles give a bit of an advantage to the consumer, because if you don't like the "flavor" of one, you can usually find another one that suits you. For instance, the minivans from a few years ago. If you liked the general minivan, but didn't care for the styling of the Venture, there was always the Montana. If you didn't care for that, there was always the Silhouette, etc. During no time was this more evident to me than in the 1980s, like with the G-bodies. The Buick Regal, Chevrolet Monte Carlo, Oldsmobile Cutlass, Pontiac Grand Prix...they were all the same cars. Each one had a bit of a different flavor. All had the Buick 3.8L V6 as standard, but if you wanted the Oldsmobile V8, you bought the Olds or the Buick. If you wanted the Chevy 305, you bought the Monte or the GP. The Grand Prix was certainly one of the "squarest" of the group, while the Olds and Buick looked pretty sleek for their time. And they ALL had performance models. Buick, Chevy, Olds, and Pontiac had the Grand National, SS, Hurst/Olds and 442, and 2+2 packages, respectively. I think this was good for the consumer. More choices is always good right? I guess if you have the volume to support that, it works, but I guess the GM's volume has been dropping lately, and it's time to consolidate.

Personally, Buick's exteriors never really turned me on as of late, and Pontiac's interiors were always just a little too "weird" for me. I love the understated elegance of Cadillac (and Olds before they were dropped), and I prefer the straight-up simplicity of the Chevrolets over any of the other brands. It makes sense to keep Cadillac as the luxury brand. And it would make sense to me to drop all the other brand names, and call everything but a Cadillac a "GM", kinda similar to how the Japanese do it with Toyota/Lexus, Honda/Acura, Nissan/Infinity. I think Chevrolet has too much of a "cheap" connotation to it in most people's minds to keep it as the ONLY non-Cadillac brand (and leave no mid-level name), but it's also too ubiquitous to drop completely. I think using "GM" for cars, "GMC" or "GM Trucks" for the trucks, and "Cadillac" for luxury makes sense. That's only my distorted opinion though.

[tjtjwdad]

Jason,

You're right about those S/C 3.8's. There're real sleepers.

For Buicks I like the Regal GS and almost bought one until found my current STS.

For Pontiacs, I like the Bonneville (don't understand why they're dropping the GXP) & the Grand Prix is alright. But one thing I don't like about them is those ... damned RED instrument lights. Reminds me of days gone by when I was riding submarines.

In general though, I beleive it will be better for the Division (GM) to cut the number of cars they offer as the're a lot of simalarities.

Jim

[JasonA]

You're right about those S/C 3.8's. There're real sleepers.

I raced a Grand Prix GTP one time to 60-70 mph. I didn't think she was gonna run, so she got the jump on me. My front bumper was pretty even with her rear bumper the whole time. In other words, the two cars were pretty much exactly even. The rags say those W-bodies do 0-60 in the high 6s, which matches what I G-teched my SLS at. I agree about the Pontiac interiors. They go a little out of their way to be "sporty".

[vantasticdude]

I have never heard of Vauxhall or Holden.

never heard of Holden .............................. ever hear of the new Pontiac GTO

[BuickLeSabre1960]

What was the reason for dropping Oldsmobile? I never did like any of the Buick vehicles! Its about time!

ahem

[jock82]

I would certainly hate to see Buick go, I would rather see Saturn go. My dad

drove Oldsmobiles in the 50's and we switched to Buicks in the 60's , 60

Inivcta, 64 Wildcat and 67 Electra 225 , I stated buying Cadillacs in the 70's.

Think they need to do something about the styling though. I never did care for

the Park Avenue . Mostly the name, I liked Electra better. GM lost Oldsmobile

I hated to see that, I hope I live long enough to see Toyota and Lexus disappear,

but probably not.

[iowaboy77]

I didn't think this sounded like a smart move for GM, especially with the introduction of new buick vehicles-- the following is from MSNBC.

"The message was sent by General Motors North America Vice President Mark LeNeve. In the message he says, "The reporting of this is a misrepresentation and incorrect paraphrasing of the actual comments made." LeNeve continues, "We are not, I repeat NOT, discussing the elimination of any of our brands."

The message was sent to dealerships less than 24 hours after GM VP Bob Lutz was quoted as saying (about Pontiac and Buick), "Over time, if one of the troubled brands that's been undernourished for many years, if it fails to turn around, then we'd have to look at a phase out.""