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what to look for when purchasing 2000 deville


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Hello everyone, I am new here and looking for some advice on what to look for on a 2000 deville.....I am going to go look at this car in the next few days and I would appreciate any advice......I have read and read about the cracked block, water pump, crossover tube leaks and am hoping that insight will help me out......car in question is a 2000 deville with 125000 miles (200000km), apparently the car is in mint shape with one owner, 78 yr old, and gets oil changes every 3 months regardless.....now my concern is that it has what is described as a slight coolant leak...I asked what slight means, the response is that after driving to a dr. apt 3 hours round trip the reservoir is down approx. an inch. the old man fills and he finally bought a new car in November for these trips. Aside from that info only confirmed issue is a cracked winshield as well, apparently all service records, new tires, shocks, breaks and fuel line, and battery have been changed within the past year. I have no issues with crossover, thermostat and water pump leak repair but the crack block is of concern as I don't want to do a rebuild on this.....I intend to take my inspection camera when I look at it to hopefully diagnose the leak on the spot, I was gonna even use some uv dye with my led black light but I figure it wouldn't have time to cycle through to reveal the leak if it that small.....any advice on what to look for would be much appreciated, I am also going to scan for codes to see if there are any stored codes, would it also be worth my while to rent coolant combustion gas tool and check head gasket health too??

thanks for any info and help I should also be able to get this car for approx. 500 cad.....thanks

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If the coolant is filled after each trip, the combustion gas test might show a false negative. My guess is water pump crossover gaskets or the coolant pipes that run across the back of the engine. If you have a radiator pressure tester, that would be the ideal tool to pinpoint the leak if it is an external leak.

Before starting the engine, remove the surge tank cap and smell the inside of the surge tank - it should not smell like exhaust gasses. Drive the car and run it hard up a long grade and watch the temp gage to make sure the coolant temp is not rising.

At any rate, $500.00 sounds like a steal if the car is in decent shape.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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:welcomesmiley:

I think you mean head gasket leakage when you say "cracked block." KHE has a pretty definitive suggestion for checking for head leakage: smell the surge tank.

When you look at the service records, see if the coolant was changed at intervals not to exceed five years. If not, the car is a candidate for head leakage.

Head leakage does not require a full engine rebuild, just head gasket replacement. Removal of the head bolts for any reason requires that inserts be used for the head bolt threads on reassembly; GM recommends Timeserts. It's a big DIY job and is a big bill at any reputable shop but still quite a bit less than a full rebuild. A used engine is another possibility.

I elaborate on all this because $500 sounds like a price for a car with head leakage if it runs well, it's clean and has no rust.

Check the OBD codes and write all of them down. Note any CURRENT codes. See the link in my signature block for a Caddyinfo page on reading OBD codes.

Then, there's the CarFAX. I would never buy a used car without looking at the CarFAX and having a good mechanic or reputable used car inspection service go over the car.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Had a 'small' oil leak in wife's 'pristine' 2000 DeVille; 85K on the odometer. After-market maintenance protection plan wouldn't cover this; they argued it was a factory defect and GM wouldn't buy that. Wife loved the car, I loved her, so I elected to go with dealer suggestion to try the Timeserts. After putting the engine back together, the oil leak continued and the only option left was to replace the engine in this 'pristine' car, or scrap what was left.

Obvously, I'm not a big fan of the Timeserts and I don't think any mechanical shop will guarantee they'll work!!!!! I chose a "new" OEM engine with a 5 year, 100K warranty; approx. $5K. Cars been great, so has she, and I'm just hoping the tranny, A/C and a few other biggies don't go bad. Warranty expired in 2014!

Before you proceed, I suggest you research Timesert related articles on here; some real horror stories.

Steve M

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Had a 'small' oil leak in wife's 'pristine' 2000 DeVille; 85K on the odometer. After-market maintenance protection plan wouldn't cover this; they argued it was a factory defect and GM wouldn't buy that. Wife loved the car, I loved her, so I elected to go with dealer suggestion to try the Timeserts. After putting the engine back together, the oil leak continued and the only option left was to replace the engine in this 'pristine' car, or scrap what was left.

Obvously, I'm not a big fan of the Timeserts and I don't think any mechanical shop will guarantee they'll work!!!!! I chose a "new" OEM engine with a 5 year, 100K warranty; approx. $5K. Cars been great, so has she, and I'm just hoping the tranny, A/C and a few other biggies don't go bad. Warranty expired in 2014!

Before you proceed, I suggest you research Timesert related articles on here; some real horror stories.

Steve M

You had an oil leak so you had the engine Timeserted? That was a completely unnecessary repair. The oil leaks are usually confined to the bottom of the engine - specifically, the oil manifold plate that is between the oil pan and the lower crankcase.

When a Timesert job fails it is usually due to not using the drill fixture or attempting to shortcut the proper procedure. If an owner can repair a Northstar engine successfully, trained dealer techs should be able to do the same.

I have 104,000 miles on my Timeserted STS that I repaired ten years ago so it can be done properly.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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NADA shows the clean trade value for the car in question to be $2550 and the clean retail value of $4350. At the current exchange rate, that range would be $3696 - $6304 CAD. If the guy is letting it go for $500 CAD, there has to be something wrong with it that he is not disclosing - I'd make sure to check the headgaskets.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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thanks for the opinions and help guys. I will def pressure test the system for leaks and do my best to check for head gaskests. a typical dohc head gasket job wouldn't trouble me at all, (most recent being a 05 intrepid 3.5) but I will have to look into these timeserts to fully understand.....my background is originally from the mechanical world and have built a few sbc over the years (my baby 383 that is now fully disassembled and for sale) but I do not want to buy another large project like that right now so I will check the head gaskets as best as I can with a driveability test and if I have any concerns at all I will probably walk away, and let everyone here know where the car is so if anyone is interested.....thanks guys much appreciated

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just checked into timeserts and ns300l, a thread repair, helicoil type thread repair, I have a drawer full of helicoil for smaller stuff and so I doubt that would be an issue other then cost....wow those kits are expensive.... I am going tomorrow morning and will keep everyone posted, thanks everyone

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I will also note that there have been cracked blocks, not very common but more heard of on the 2000-2004. It happens because when head bolts in one area pull it puts more strain on the block in the areas that hold tight and excessive overheating or prolonged driving it with the pulled head bolts.

If the block cracks it is useless.

But like I said it is not too common but does happen.

Best of luck to you

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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just checked into timeserts and ns300l, a thread repair, helicoil type thread repair, I have a drawer full of helicoil for smaller stuff and so I doubt that would be an issue other then cost....wow those kits are expensive.... I am going tomorrow morning and will keep everyone posted, thanks everyone

DO NOT USE HEILICOILS - they will rip out of the block when you torque the head bolts and you'll be buying the Bigsert kit. If you go on the Time fastener website, you will see the description "repair for when Heilicoil fails".

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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just checked into timeserts and ns300l, a thread repair, helicoil type thread repair, I have a drawer full of helicoil for smaller stuff and so I doubt that would be an issue other then cost....wow those kits are expensive.... I am going tomorrow morning and will keep everyone posted, thanks everyone

DO NOT USE HEILICOILS - they will rip out of the block when you torque the head bolts and you'll be buying the Bigsert kit. If you go on the Time fastener website, you will see the description "repair for when Heilicoil fails".

Would like to know this info couple of years ago :D

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update....I looked at the car today and I thought I was prepared with my scanner, toolkit, ramps, block checker (combustion gas in coolant), rad cap and rad pressure pump and inspection camera with a few lights....I figured I should be able to determine for the most part what I was getting into.....well it turns out that "mint" condition is subject to many different interpretations....fist off interior appears to not have been cleaned in years, although there was no tears and was in decent shape without any blemishes it had to be severly cleaned.

Secondly the front bumber was cracked on the left side about 8 inches long, and the owner had attempted to sand and re-paint from the mid door moulding down...it was a terrible job, not to mention spray can white is not the same as pearl....

So now for the good stuff....the car that apparently ran great wouldn't start....hahaha....so I threw the scanner on it to get a tcc code, a few cam and crank sensor codes....I recorded them and cleared them, installed good battery from my van that I drove there and still no start...nothing...not even a pop...the cam sensor gave me some more codes so I assumed no spark due to faulty cam sensor....

So I now could only smell coolant res which smelled okay, checked under oil cap for signs, which were there so I didn't even bother checking for coolant leak.....but I still couldn't let this go so I had to look underneath.....looked surprisingly clean under the mid point but when I went to the rear all the links were extremely rusted....

At this point I gave up on this and had to walk away....I had let him know that if he could get 650 from someone who apparently looked at it yesterday to jump on it, and I might be willing to give him $100 for it....I was soooo bummed out that it turned out to be a pile when after talking to him twice he had talked it up like the best thing.....and it was just a base model with a tape deck .....

Here is the link for the vehicle if anyone is interested in a parts car

it is located in Thessalon Ontario

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-cars-trucks/sault-ste-marie/2000-cadillac-deville-sedan/1121027270?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true

I am sure a couple hundred bucks would take it away

Thanks everyone for all the help and advise, this is by far one of the best forums I have ever been on for quick, good, experienced help, and not just a bunch of kids telling you about stuff they have no clue about..........I hope I can find a caddy now to become a more fulltime member.

Thanks again everyone, and let me know if I can assist anyone if they are interested in the car.

Cheers

Josh

Edited by josh.simon
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I just want to say I have been in your shoes.

I bought my 97 Seville almost mint for 1500 with pulled head bolts. I have almost 6k overall in the 5 years I have had it, including purchase

I just bought my 97 Deville to add to my collection with pulled head bolts and am into it 3600 including purchase. I payed 900 for it, 400 too much but I felt it to be worth it.

But when rust is involved it can turn sour quickly.

I can gaurantee you will find another. I am stuck with the 90s era, I had a 01 ekdo which is 90s body with 2k powertrain, liked the body but not too crazy about the changes they made in 2k.

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Regarding that Timesert job mentioned in Post #4, Timeserts are recommended by GM for just about all the threads in the Northstar block, heads, and transmission. The Timeserts needed to fix an oil leak may have been for the oil pan bolts.

But still, this car was not in drive-away condition. I knew when I saw the $500 price tag it was a project or parts car.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Very good chance the heli-coils will fail if used for head bolts.

The Toyota 2.4L has a similar head bolt issue. Actually uses the same size Timesert insert as the early Northstars.

Anyway...it is often reported on the Toyotas that....once discovered...a Heli-coil was previously used....and has now failed.

So in the Timesert kit world....what you then need is the larger BS kit (big sert).

As for dealers...the techs are working against book time for repairs. So if the repair(s) are not going perfectly....in a sense they are working for free. So I would bet they would be more inclined to suggest a new engine from the get-go.

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