princess Posted July 20, 2014 Report Share Posted July 20, 2014 My Concours did something strange today. I was idling with AC on in front of a friends house for 10 minutes.... Coolant temp 221F (outside 92F) Drove off went 4-5 blocks and noticed Coolant temp 254F Seemed high to me so I shut AC off (on Econ) Drove 4 more blocks and steady decline down to 212F then 1 more to 206F Now I was in Richmond, VA at time which is roughly 96 miles from home. Drove it back home on highway with AC on normally Coolant Temp 192F (normal from what im used to) Got home idled with AC on for a good 7 minutes temp 230F Then during next 2 minutes drops down to 221F ( normal from what ive notitced) Just the - Coolant Temperature 255F - seemed a bit high or did it do that because of a variety of factors or am reading too muc into my car.and where the cooling fan relays are at Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted July 20, 2014 Report Share Posted July 20, 2014 ECT of 221 F is normal for the conditions (idling, A/C on, high outside temp). Coolant temp 254 F is NOT normal. Ever. I would check the fan relays and make sure that it will work in the HIGH setting. Also, check the bypass hose. If the relays are good and the bypass hose runs OK, then do the while overheading drill, starting with the radiator cap and 50-50 or better antifreeze. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted July 20, 2014 Report Share Posted July 20, 2014 I would check the bypass hose. It sounds like it had a air pocket in the system. GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted July 20, 2014 Report Share Posted July 20, 2014 then do the while overheading drill, starting with the radiator cap What does this mean? Anyway, the cooling fans MUST be running under your stated circumstances, and on HIGH. And, as others have stated, make sure that bypass hose is flowing correctly. 50/50 antifreeze mixture will prevent boil over, but it won't lower your temperature extremes. There is another reason for that. Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 OK WHERE IS THE BY-PASS HOSE AT? and if anyone can tell me where i may find the relays ill just go ahead and replace them just because...Sorry I order the Haynes manual but it hasnt come yet. im thinking the Relays for some reason didnt kick my fans on that one time until I turned off AC I tested yesterday too all day could could not get car to go over 230F in heavy traffic... while driving normally is 186-192F unless at Extended light then 201-206F LONG LIGHT 217-219F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jim Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 OK WHERE IS THE BY-PASS HOSE AT? and if anyone can tell me where i may find the relays ill just go ahead and replace them just because...Sorry I order the Haynes manual but it hasnt come yet. im thinking the Relays for some reason didnt kick my fans on that one time until I turned off AC I tested yesterday too all day could could not get car to go over 230F in heavy traffic... while driving normally is 186-192F unless at Extended light then 201-206F LONG LIGHT 217-219F The bypass hose connects to your surge tank... Disconnect it at the surge tank... start the car and let it idle... coolant should be running out of the hose. If you want to check for a clog... follow it to the other end and disconnect it at the "Bolt With a Hole In It" and see if there are any clogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 The little black house on top near right bottom left of overflow tank (if I am looking at vehicle) and where do i find the realays or are they on the right side with fuse box in engine compartment? This is has hot has i could get it idling in my drive way after 6hrs of driving with full AC on idling for 10 minutes Im sorry shortly after I took this pic it began declining and went back down to 221F in like 2 minutes so im thinking maybe the relays are slow? "service engine soon is O2 sensor it pops on and off at random Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 21, 2014 Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 It's not slow relays. I too suspect an air pocke formedt. When you started moving, the air pocket moved, and the water pump started circulating the coolant again. I also doubt the fans not working would cause such a spike. the purge line is most likely clogged. I know you had some done on the car, but did you ever have the coolant drained and refilled? - you need to verify the 50/50 mixture too. Also If the coolant gets changed, I would add the (at the time of manufacture) baars stop leak powder to the coolant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 21, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 21, 2014 No I havent had coolant drained and refilled yet I addressed brake issue first. I dont think im running a 50\50 more like 70/30 (ive put straight water in it like half a gallon since ive owned it) I know I know Bad girl...Im not used to a V8 I typically only drive V6 cars so im used to coolant never exceeding 200F under any circumstances...So in reference to Bars stop leak, I thought I should not add that to the cooling system? It runs really great it just seems to have a personality when idling still or in traffic when i see these 221F 219F, 233F temps with air on... Almost like driving a Ferrariand the 50/50 mixture effects the temperature range in the Northstar?Im asking because in both my fords i run 70/30 they just seem to run more stable at high speeds like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airmike Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 A suggestion, when you check the purge hose. Don't blow from the tank toward the engine to clear it! If you do the obstruction will move out of the way, only to return later. Remove the bolt and see if it is blocked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 The bolt with the hole in it is on the driver side torque strut mount. (dogbone mount). remove the hose, unscrew the fitting and inspect it. clean it out and reinstall it. Get the coolant to proper concentration. It is not worth damaging a engine due to incorrect coolant concentration. As for bars leak. I put 4 tabs in the lower radiator hose only when I flush out the system. IT ONLY HELPS WITH SMALL LEAKS, porousity, hose, crossover gaskets, but not pulled head bolts GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 Running a lot less than 50-50 can case steam pockets that can cause your symptoms. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 YEA, It didnt start doing weird little 233F tempertures until after I put straight water in it twice. Ill have it drained and refilled properly next weekend when im back home..... Rockfangd - Assume when i remove this bolt coolant will or should leak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 It will. do it while you are draining the system. But either way it wont leak a crazy amount GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 That surge tank on the side should not be filled to the top. It should be about 3 inches down. I am a little concerned you had to add coolant. A part of me is hopeing you just overfilled it from a normal level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 DIDNT KNOW THAT EITHER I Actually filled all the way well almost topped it off... LOL, Seriously i did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 22, 2014 Report Share Posted July 22, 2014 Thats good then. It explains why you added so much coolant. The first 1/2 gallon of excess water was released from the surge tank as it should have, then another 1/2 gal of water was added. This compromised your mixture, and also might have dislodged a clump of stop leak that can be in your purge line. All of this can cause your condition. Could be your purge line couldn't clear the air from the block because there was too much pressure or no place in the surge tank to take it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockfangd Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 if you fill the surge tank to the top there will be no room for expansion when the coolant heats up, therefore it will overpressure and purge from the overflow GM FAN FOREVER Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 23, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 LOL... OKAY IM LEARNING....Anyone one fly to my house for the weekend and eval my car?? I can cook really really really well and theres a fridge with nothing but beer in it in my garage ...(kidding) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 23, 2014 Report Share Posted July 23, 2014 I think you are doing a great job so far. A car this old requires careful care. When you drain and refill, make sure you put in the orange coolant that states on the bottle GM approved Dexcool. Buy the full concentration, and mix it 50/50 with distilled water. (Much less expensive this way). Not sure you know but the Northstar is known to pull head bolts, and one theory is that the 5 year life antifreeze gets acidic after about 3 years, and when it seeps into the threads of the headbolts, corrosion of the aluminum block around the threads occurs -compromises the clamping force, and eventually the bolts pull out. So if the coolant history is unknown, you really should do a drain and refill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2014 OK had it drained and flushed (rather had my roomate drop it off for me) turned out to be an air pocket states it came out more like an 80/20 mix. however the mechanic noticed that someone has already used that cooper bars stop leak within the coolant system so my question now is, do I put more in it now that I have had cooling system drained and refilled correctly? This may explain why the car ask me for 1/4 to half gallon every 700 miles or so ..... states he didnt visibly see leak.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 28, 2014 Report Share Posted July 28, 2014 Not sure what the copper substance is. It should have had the consistency of toothpaste with a rusty brown color. It sticks to the sides of the tanks. Sometimes it turns into a soft gummy clumps - almost like wet 1/2 dried silicone caulk that was broken up. If you saw alot of the caulk like substance in there, i would hold off on adding anything right now. If your coolant looks a bright orange, then you can add a tube of baars into the top radiator hose. NEVER add it to the surge tank. After adding i, the coolant will get a rusty look after a few days. (Alot of people didn't like this, and wrongly called it rust) i called it insurance. I think after a drain and refill, the '96 procedure was to add baars. I am glad its sounding like its working out on this little scare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted July 28, 2014 Report Share Posted July 28, 2014 I wouldn't add more sealant if it isn't leaking. The cooling system needs very little sealant. Excess sealant just settles in the surge tank and possibly other places that are harder to get to, like the bottoms of the radiator tanks and possibly even in the engine, and dense flakes of it can form that break loose and clog the bypass hose. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
princess Posted July 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2014 Perhaps Im over analyzing the car..... and I just need to drive the thing and enjoy it until either it begins to overheat\run hot or the leak becomes more prelivaint ....I think I can live with adding 1/4 gallon of coolant every week then.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted July 29, 2014 Report Share Posted July 29, 2014 Wait!! What leak? I thought we concluded you were just overfilling, and it was spilling out the excess out the overflow line as it should have. If you have a leak, you need to address that. The baars stop leak i am referring to is more of a preventative maintenance. As was stated, just fill the surge tank 1/4 way up. Leaks only get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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