Power Steering Pump Whine

[BodybyFisher]

For about a month I have noticed that I have a power steering pump whine. I also think that I have less power assist while parking but that might be my imagination. I have replaced my AC Compressor, Idler Wheel, Tensioner and had my alternator rebuilt a couple of months ago. So that is why I am focused on the power steering pump, the noise isn't varied with steering steering input only RPM. However I will listen to it more carefully, I am in a hotel in Cape May, New Jersey taking a few days for myself in an Oceanfront hotel (boy did I need this! , coming back soon! ) and the garage I am parked in will help to magnify the noise so I will report back more findings after dinner, Because of the hurricane the surf is rough and the waves are really big, and the surfers are out.. pretty cool...

My fluid looks horrible, do you guys think a fluid flush would help? I have never flushed it Also, is there a bearing in the power steering pump?, that can go bad and have this not related to the 'pump' but just to the mechnical bearing? Hope that makes sense.

[Ranger]

I am sure there is a bearing on the shaft. Last time I had P/S fluid looked horrible was on a Ford. The fluid looked metallic. Turned out the rack was going bad and had to be replaced.

[JasonA]

Yes, there's a bearing (more than one I'm sure) in the PS pump. Ours went bad on our former Grand Caravan, and the entire pump had to be replaced. The PS fluid in these cars should be a golden copper or brown. Some cars use ATF (red) or other, but I think ours use standar PS fluid.

I replaced the PS fluid in my '97 Cadillac a reservoir's amount at a time with a turkey baster. The fluid was very dark brown, almost black. It looked pretty after a few fills.

[Cadillac Jim]

Sounds like air in the PS fluid. Make sure it's topped off, and check it again after a short trip with low RPM, like around Cape May, to work some of the air out. Etc.

[winterset]

I thought I read there is some type of valve seal in the PS pump that has a tendancy to fail on our PS pumps & the symptom is indeed a whine. I would try a drain, and refill with an additive (conditioner). it's worth a shot, and I can't think of any drawbacks, I don't believe there is anything special about our PS fluid.

[Marika]

Cape May, New Jersey during the threat of a Hurricane.... Next time you're in my neighborhood give me a call, we can get together for a coffee.

Here's my favorite hang out http://saddlebrookdiner.com come visit anytime!

[steve6]

Before I went on my vacation 2 weeks ago, I pulled the fluid out of my power steering reservoir and it was SLUDGE(siphoned it out). I was starting to get to a point that I could barely turn at low RPM's after the car warmed up.

I continued to pull the fluid out of the low pressure line, I could not believe how thick it was. (Its suppose to just be hydraulic fluid which is rather thin based).

I then filled it up with new oil, the issue is still occurring but a bit better, I need to drain it again some day and do that again.

I'm sure the oil thats in there is just hell on the pump, It was so thick I am surprised it worked at all.

[BodybyFisher]

Cape May, New Jersey during the threat of a Hurricane.... Next time you're in my neighborhood give me a call, we can get together for a coffee.

Here's my favorite hang out http://saddlebrookdiner.com come visit anytime!

Its funny you noticed that, I was on my way to Philadelphia and when I heard the hurricane info, I headed to Wildwood then Cape May....

[Cadillac Jim]

I'm aboiut 20 miles East of Philadelphia. Last I checked, Hurricane Noel was to pass about 300 miles offshore of Atlantic City at about 1:00 PM Saturday. Cape May had the worst exposure since an arm could come bashing in from the Northeast anytime, and those are a lot harder to predict. It wasn't bad here, but we were ready for high winds and rains if they came.

[growe3]

I also would recommend changing the fluid, AND the filter. I believe the filter is located just forward of the right, front, wheel well. It looks like an in-line fuel filter.

Use a replacement fluid that has seal conditioner in it.

-George

[BodybyFisher]

Before I went on my vacation 2 weeks ago, I pulled the fluid out of my power steering reservoir and it was SLUDGE(siphoned it out). I was starting to get to a point that I could barely turn at low RPM's after the car warmed up.

I continued to pull the fluid out of the low pressure line, I could not believe how thick it was. (Its suppose to just be hydraulic fluid which is rather thin based).

I then filled it up with new oil, the issue is still occurring but a bit better, I need to drain it again some day and do that again.

I'm sure the oil thats in there is just hell on the pump, It was so thick I am surprised it worked at all.

Yes, this is what I have, it sludgy, there was a glob on the bottom of the level stick, I am going to flush it ASAP, thanks for your experience, I will report back how this turns out.

By the way, which line is the return line is it hard to redirect into a bucket?

[Ranger]

Before I went on my vacation 2 weeks ago, I pulled the fluid out of my power steering reservoir and it was SLUDGE(siphoned it out). I was starting to get to a point that I could barely turn at low RPM's after the car warmed up.

I continued to pull the fluid out of the low pressure line, I could not believe how thick it was. (Its suppose to just be hydraulic fluid which is rather thin based).

I then filled it up with new oil, the issue is still occurring but a bit better, I need to drain it again some day and do that again.

I'm sure the oil thats in there is just hell on the pump, It was so thick I am surprised it worked at all.

There is more going on here than meets the eye. The fluid should never thicken up like that. You need to figure out what is causing it.

[BodybyFisher]

I'm aboiut 20 miles East of Philadelphia. Last I checked, Hurricane Noel was to pass about 300 miles offshore of Atlantic City at about 1:00 PM Saturday. Cape May had the worst exposure since an arm could come bashing in from the Northeast anytime, and those are a lot harder to predict. It wasn't bad here, but we were ready for high winds and rains if they came.

Its interesting, when I got there at 5:30 AM Sat morning, I walked down to the water and the wind was coming directly at me off the water, later in the day when I was watching the surfers the wind was coming from the Northwest and I was thinking that I was getting hit by the back end of the winds off the hurricane,

Surfing takes guts surfing in the freezing cold water with a wet suit with hands, head and feet exposed around jetties and rocks, its not for me, I hate cold water.. This morning before I left, I walked on the beach and the water and winds were normal. I found my new favorite place, Cape May, next week is a Jazz festival, the head liner is Pieces of a Dream.. http://www.piecesjazz.com/

Cape May Jazz Festival, I WILL be there next year for sure...

http://www.capemayjazz.com/

[BodybyFisher]

I also would recommend changing the fluid, AND the filter. I believe the filter is located just forward of the right, front, wheel well. It looks like an in-line fuel filter.

Use a replacement fluid that has seal conditioner in it.

-George

Thanks George, will do. Hey the 04 is looking nice, when did you get it?, don't know if I recall..

[BodybyFisher]

Sounds like air in the PS fluid. Make sure it's topped off, and check it again after a short trip with low RPM, like around Cape May, to work some of the air out. Etc.

I guess what I was trying to say above was that it was not a hydraulic whine, its a mechanical whine due to it being RPM related and not steering input related. I believe that if it was steering input related it would be hydraulic. So I think its mechanical, maybe bearings and I should replace it soon as the next thing I will have is a bad seal at the shaft and blow fluid like what happened in my 91. I have 102,000 miles now and have replaced all accessories that rotate and turn already except the power steering pump.

I will flush it first however, change the filter, add some clean fluid with seal conditioner and see what happens, thick fluid will only get worse in the cold weather and probably raise the line pressure beyond normal.

[adallak]

Mike, you can pump out old fluid by running engine with disconnected PS return line. That's what I did, but I was replacing PS return lines anyway. As far as I remember, you should turn the steering wheel from NEARLY stop to stop to get rid of all fluid. It would help if someone pours fresh fluid in the reservoir during the procedure.

[Cadillac Jim]

There have been a lot of posts about sludge and milky fluid, filings in the power steering, etc. If you have any of that, all bets are off. I note a post about a filter; I think I'll find mine. In 130,000 miles, I've never touched the power steering or the brakes. You guys are starting to get my maintenance juices flowing. Besides, I think I hear another vacuum leak when it's cold.

[BodybyFisher]

When I do this flush, I am going to put a magnet in the pump attached to a wire. I found this on a Volvo forum:

http://www.vcoa.org/700-900-faq/Steering.h...ringPumpFailing

Fluid and Maintenance:

Power Steering Fluid Cleanliness. I keep inside the power steering fluid reservoir a small but VERY STRONG magnet. I lowered it down inside on a wire and because it is strong it attaches to the metal bracket holding the reservoir. After first two weeks I was cleaning it every second or third day and you would be surprised how many metallic particles it was able to take out. For the first week the magnet was all covered and black every time. Now my power steering fluid is so clean, that I can see the bottom of the container with a flash light. Of course I changed the fluid after I take most metallic particles out. Besides there was a bulletin issued by Volvo stating that inside PS container there should be a magnet.

I have magnet R622, from this site, I have three of them once they are stuck together you can not pull them apart, its amazing, you need to sheer them apart.

http://www.kjmagnetics.com/

[Cadillac Jim]

Since the Cadillac has a power steering pump filter, you can probably put the magnets on the outside of that and change it later with the magnets attached and get the same benefit.

I've seen magnets designed to be wrapped onto oil filters. Perhaps one of those on the power steering filter as a permanent thing would be a good idea.

I think that if you have a discoloration and sludge issue in the power steering, then the system isn't sealed and/or water is getting into it.

[growe3]

I also would recommend changing the fluid, AND the filter. I believe the filter is located just forward of the right, front, wheel well. It looks like an in-line fuel filter.

Use a replacement fluid that has seal conditioner in it.

-George

Thanks George, will do. Hey the 04 is looking nice, when did you get it?, don't know if I recall..

I picked the DTS up late April this year, nice and comfortable ride, and good power, but.... lacks the punch of my STS's. It is pretty much just what I figured it would be like, each has there strong points.

Regarding the PS fluid, when I changed mine:

I raised the car to take the load off of the wheels, cut the clamps from the filter, placed the hose ends into gallon jugs, and then turned the wheels lock to lock. I had a friend start the car (idle only), and do it a couple of more times.

You may want to let a pint of new fluid go through at this point to help clear the lines. Then install the new filter and clamps, then add fluid. I after starting the car again, the air rapidly bled out. I would let the engine idle when filling, revving will just tend to whip air into the fluid in a partially filled unit.

A magnet to catch minute metal particles is a good idea, many of the cars from the 50's and 60's had them from the factory. A retrievable one that you can wipe off is even better.

-George

[clarkz71]

Here's the p/s filter and fluid.

[BodybyFisher]

Thanks Clarkz

[clarkz71]

No problem.