New STS

[Dasher]

See my previous post under "A bit disillusioned with my dealer" for the start of this story.

I hadn't planned to trade my car for a long time; but after they discovered oil leaks I decided I might get a new one. I have always bought used; but decided to look at new ones. The discounts were better on the 2007's but I had a hankering to try the 2008 V-6 with 302 HP. I drove one and was impressed with the engine; but not so much with the car. They've taken all the bling out of it as far as I'm concerned. It has about 20% of the wood trim of the previous model, I don't think the leather is a s good as the previous model and I really missed that fantastic dashboard with the ometers painted on the glass and lighted in some mysterious way. The new one could have come from a Cavalier. On the outside that big expanse of side, with no side molding, just seems to beg for someone to bang their door into it.

About the engine. I drove the 2007 engine and it had good push in the first and second gear; but then began to fade. The 2008 has very good pick-up but doesn't fade in the higher gears. I liked it. I am looking at the AWD version.

I think if you write the biggest check of your life in the $40K range, the car ought to be irresistible. I'm having a hard time thinking what I really like about it. I felt like I was sitting in a bathtub barely able to get my nose over the edge (I'm 5' 11") and I don't think I'll ever get used to that. I may still get one because they won't be really changing the STS for 5 more years and I can't wait that long.

Can anyone here say "Bentley". I'm only about $300k short.

If anyone has a 2005 or later STS, and really love it, I'd like to hear from them.

By the way the Northstar is available only be order at my dealer. They had too many complaints about getting stuck in the Winter. They said that with those wide wheels in the back you might as well be driving a Vette in the snow.

[Bruce Nunnally]

I like the look of the 08 STS, although I think it would be a very hard sell next to the 08 CTS. If the CTS-V offers an automatic this time I think it should be renamed STS and mark it done.

[JohnnyG]

I don't like that high beltline either. I got the same feeling when sitting in a 1971 Boss 302 Mustang, like sitting in a bathtub. For that reason alone, I will consider a Deville (esentially the same as my old STS, without all the nice stuff) or some foreign model.

[Texas Jim]

I will consider a Deville (esentially the same as my old STS, without all the nice stuff) or some foreign model.

A quick question, please. First let me say that I have never owned an STS.

The question is what "NICE STUFF" does it have the the new DTS (renamed DeVille) does not have? I know the NightVision and HUD is not available in the new DTS. Last year for that was 2005.

[joeb]

any reason why you would opt for a V6 versus the northstar? I suppose a V6 might be a little better on gas but if you are going to lay out the big bucks for a new car why not get the big motor? the comment about a V6 handling better in winter seems a little odd. if you have 2 identical rear wheel drive cars i don't see how a V6 or V8 would affect the traction. throw on a set of winter tires and have at it. a friend bought a new mustang and they got the V6 model. yay, it looks nice but why not get a GT?

[WarrenJ]

I like the look of the 08 STS, although I think it would be a very hard sell next to the 08 CTS. If the CTS-V offers an automatic this time I think it should be renamed STS and mark it done.

Better yet, lose two doors and call it an Eldorado. THEN you can call it done!

Regards,

Warren

[JohnnyG]

They've taken all the bling out of it as far as I'm concerned. It has about 20% of the wood trim of the previous model, I don't think the leather is a s good as the previous model and I really missed that fantastic dashboard with the ometers painted on the glass and lighted in some mysterious way. The new one could have come from a Cavalier....

Jim, first let me start by saying that I never owned a Deville. (renamed various times lately by GM...DTS, DHS, etc. etc.)

HUD, NAV, and NightVision are not even being considered in my statement. I'm talking about the wood trim, the dash needles, the cruise control stalk, the nice perf leather, delete clock, and things like that. The new Devilles just don't have these things, and you can't get them as options. I feel that the new Deville (DTS) is a step backward from the OLD, full sized DTS, before the DTS was built on the Seville platform. Further, that the new Seville is a step backwards from the OLD Seville for many of the same reasons that the original poster has indicated.

[Bruce Nunnally]

My observation has been that the top option models of the Deville/DTS normally have equivalent or better features than the same-year model STS. In some cases the DTS has luxuries not available on the STS. The DTS is always heavier due to the greater length.

[Texas Jim]

Jim, first let me start by saying that I never owned a Deville. (renamed various times lately by GM...DTS, DHS, etc. etc.)

HUD, NAV, and NightVision are not even being considered in my statement. I'm talking about the wood trim, the dash needles, the cruise control stalk, the nice perf leather, delete clock, and things like that. The new Devilles just don't have these things, and you can't get them as options. I feel that the new Deville (DTS) is a step backward from the OLD, full sized DTS, before the DTS was built on the Seville platform. Further, that the new Seville is a step backwards from the OLD Seville for many of the same reasons that the original poster has indicated.

Please don't take this wrong. I am not trying to start an argument.

My DTS has wood all the way across the dash and down both sides of the Radio/Nav system to the center console.

The center console is wood.

The shifter handle is wood.

All 4 doors have wood trim all the way from front to back.

The power, tilt/telescoping, heated, steering wheel is wood on top and bottom and leather on the sides.

The seats are perforated front and rear.

The front ones are heated and Air Conditioned. The rear are heated.

Power Massaging Lumbar in both front seats. Power lumbar in rear seats.

There is a neat looking analog clock in the center of the dash.

The instrument panel needles do a cool sweep from left to right as you turn on the ignition.

The Cruise Control buttons are on the steering wheel, and if you drive with your hands at 3 and 9 .... left index finger speeds you up .... left thumb slows you down or turns it on and off.

Right thumb changes radio stations or cd tracks, right index finger controls volume.

Again, don't take offense, I am just describing the way "MY" car is equipped but since I have not owned an STS, I don't know what I am trying to compare it to.

Jim from Texas

[Cadillac Jim]

The Northstar weighs only 350 pounds. I think the dealer in Flushing, MI was blowing smoke about differences in winter traction because he just stocks the lower-priced, faster-moving V6. The OEM tires are 4-season, and that's all you should need. If he won't take a special order and get it from another local dealer, go to a bigger dealer.

[Dasher]

O.K. Here's a couple of answers to the questions I've been asked:

For Joeb:

I doubt that it would make much difference in traction between the 6 and the 8 as long as you have the AWD; but the 8 list for $60,000 plus, which is no small consideration.

For Jim:

This dealer is the largest Caddy dealer in mid-Michigan and his dealership is 3 blocks long. He stocks a huge inventory of Caddys. The V-8 has wider tires on the back than on the front and the "torque is so high with those wide tires that you might as well be driving a Vette in the snow." I was in the dealership a year ago and heard two doctors talking who met in the waiting room. They had both been stuck on the same day in 4" of snow. Down the road there is a guy with a Chrysler 300C with RWD. His driveway goes up hill from his garage to the road and he parked his car at the road all Winter long. There must be a reason.

[JohnnyG]

I was in the dealership a year ago and heard two doctors talking who met in the waiting room. They had both been stuck on the same day in 4" of snow. Down the road there is a guy with a Chrysler 300C with RWD. His driveway goes up hill from his garage to the road and he parked his car at the road all Winter long. There must be a reason.

That's so cool! Two doctors in a waiting room at a dealership! Talk about turning the tables

If the doctors were from the Middle East or Pakistan or something, I think I see the problem.

BTW, in case you forgot, or maybe never had a chance to try it, RWD cars totally suck in the snow.

[rek]

All that Texas Jim said.......Although the DTS is based on the "Non-Sigma Seville" Platform, it has refined (read less vibration transfer) front cradle/engine mounts. Smooooooooooth.

Before I purchased my DTS, I test drove the CTS as well as the STS. They are all "Nice", however, the seats in both CTS and STS didn't register CADILLAC, on my "Butt Meter".

All handled nice......go figure, they were NEW. The DTS, IMO, felt more like a Cadillac.

Take a test drive of all three, over the same road. Put them all to the floor (WOT). Hands down, the two ton North* DTS, did it for me. Cruise at 35 MPH......Nail it, All are peppy when they get down to 1st, BUT, the CTS/STS, again IMO, derive their "Pep" through gearing, rather that V-8 POWER.

The CTS and STS did seem to notice that three passengers (Wife, Salesman, Me) were aboard. On a "Solo" test drive, the CTS/STS handled slightly different........more bounce, more "Pep". The DTS could care less about the number of passengers. It was well planted and had power on reserve.

Considering the $ factor, there seems to be more "Wiggle" room when purchasing a DTS, at least at the three dealers I delt with.

Again, test drive them all..........

[Terminus]

My STS does fine in the snow, but I don't run the performance tires either. All seasons work best for how/where we drive it. Besides, the TAC does a fine job of getting the car moving in virtually any weather condition.

As far as the comment about Vette-like torque? Not even close.