acklac7 Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 Long time no see guys! (I see bbf is now caddyinfo staff..cool deal) Well engine overheated & limped home. Pulled the thermostat and it appeared to be bad(the little "pin" on the rim had froze and the gasket was bubbled and deformed). Replaced the thermostat, car ran ok for a couple miles, then overheated again. Bled out all the air from the system: kept overheating. Replaced the new thermostat with an OEM AC delco: replaced the water pump (I just happened to have one handy, and the old pump was due to go out) checked the purge line...All to no avail. Engine still rapidly overheats, like I will take it around the block and it will shoot from 200 to 250 in about a minute. Also should add that I'm constantly getting the "check coolant level" even though the coolant is full (that is something that has just popped up in the past day). A few more things: the coolant doesn't seem to be circulating throughout the engine, like I can squeeze the hoses and don't feel any coolant moving through them. Also should note that I took the coolant return line off of the bottle and there is no coolant draining back into the reservoir at any time??? (engine hot or cold). Also should add that the water pump belt has decent tension and the belt/tensioner are fairly new. Im guessing one of the hoses are clogged or I have some NASTY air pocket that just wont purge. Next step is to flush the system but I wanted to get your guys input first . BTW Engine was timeserted @ 50,000miles (currently has 109,000) Thanks, A.J. A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted April 25, 2009 Report Share Posted April 25, 2009 If coolant is flowing from the purge line, the system doesn't have any air in it. Have you tested the surge tank cap to make sure it holds the required pressure? Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winterset Posted April 26, 2009 Report Share Posted April 26, 2009 Are you sure the new thermostat was installed the correct way. I recall hearing the Northstar is kind of a reverse flow system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
growe3 Posted April 26, 2009 Report Share Posted April 26, 2009 Please read through each suggestion, BEFORE trying a diagnostic suggestion. You need to check a few items, in case you haven't already done so. 1. Are your fans working properly? Start the car and let it warm up. Watch the temperature gauge. One should come about 225 degrees, and both should be on by 230 or so. With the AC on, I believe both fans should always be on. 2. Is you radiator clogged, or flowing poorly? It is messy, but on a cool/cold engine remove the upper radiator hose from the radiator, and the lower radiator hoses from the water pump (for easier access). Put a garden hose, wrapped in a rag to provide a seal, in the lower hose. Turn on the water at a low flow rate. The water will come out of the upper radiator tube. Once it is matching the input flow, increase the garden hose water to maximum flow. There should not be any resistance in this flow rate. If the water does not flow out as fast as the input, then the radiator is partially clogged. IMPORTANT, if the radiator does not flow fully, do not keep the water pressure on, as you may cause an end tank to lift. A problem in radiator flow needs to be resolved, before the engine can properly pump the coolant through it for cooling. If the radiator does not flow properly, it may need to by professionally cleaned or replaced. 3. Clean out the coolant reservoir, preferably by removing it from the car, and then reinstall it. Yes, removing it is a bit of a nuisance, but then you are assured that it is completely clean and not part of a circulation problem. Be sure the coolant connection to the reservoir is clean, and plugged in properly! 4. Remove the hose to the hollow bolt and the reservoir connection. Force water through this hose until clear. 5. Make sure the hollow bolt is clear. Use a small drill , held by hand or a tap holder, to clear the hole. Do not try to oversize this hole, just clear it to the original size. 6. Add two tubes of Bars Leak Gold Powder into the lower radiator hose, then reconnect it to the water pump.. 7. Reconnect all other hoses, and refill engine with proper type coolant, using a 50/50 mix. Run engine with the radiator off up to 190-200 degrees, to allow air to work itself out. Watch out for the occasional "burp". Top of as required, and tighten surge tank pressure cap. Allow the car to idle and occasionally lightly "blip" the throttle. You should not have ANY overheating. If after 20 minutes or so all is well, go for an easy local ride. If car still overheats, allow to cool and recheck the coolant level. If coolant level is correct, check the coolant for signs of exhaust with a tester. Good luck, George Drive'em like you own 'em. - ....................04 DTS............................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted May 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Replaced the surge tank cap and it runs like a top Thanks guys! Also the cap autozone gave me is rated for 16psi however my old cap says 15psi....Anything to be concerned about? A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Replaced the surge tank cap and it runs like a top Thanks guys! Also the cap autozone gave me is rated for 16psi however my old cap says 15psi....Anything to be concerned about? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Replaced the surge tank cap and it runs like a top Thanks guys! Also the cap autozone gave me is rated for 16psi however my old cap says 15psi....Anything to be concerned about? Change oil, it degrades fast if engine overheats. Glad everything is fine. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted May 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 Replaced the surge tank cap and it runs like a top Thanks guys! Also the cap autozone gave me is rated for 16psi however my old cap says 15psi....Anything to be concerned about? Change oil, it degrades fast if engine overheats. Glad everything is fine. Intend to do that tomorrow. Amazing how much cooler the car runs with a new thermostat,waterpump,coolant and cap...Hasn't gone above 210, most of the time it stays at 205 (it used to run 212-218). A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted May 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 overheated again.....bad. Ran fine for a couple days, then last night I noticed some odd temp variations (temps were fluctuating in the 225-235 range when they should have been in the 200's-210's based on the outdoor temperature (high 50's). No doubt the radiator cap was bad, I mean before I replace it I couldn't drive a block without it overheating...Now Im wondering if the head gaskets blew...AGAIN A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Have you bought the kit from Napa and done the block test? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted May 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2009 Have you bought the kit from Napa and done the block test? Been sorta hesitant to purchase one because arent they like $50+? At any rate it looks like im going to have too.. A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted August 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 Well I fixed it, for good. Pulled off the heater core hose along with the return line and then flushed: no water flowing from the return line (as I had previously stated). So I somehow managed to jam the hose nozzle up into the tiny return line and then gave it a highly pressurized blast of water. After about a second or two I got flow from the heater core hose, so I switched back and flushed the heater core again and voila!: The return line was doing its job and returning water/coolant back into the tank! Problem solved Runs like a top...nice and cool...Ahhh nothing like my N* <3 Now to fix the rusted break line that failed on me while it was sitting over the summer Btw is it ok to drive the car short distances with no break fluid? Like do I risk damaging the ABS/Valves/Master cylinder? Only reason I ask is I sorta have to use it for a few days...Have no other choice (and yes I know it is VERY dangerous to drive without power-assisted breaks and im being extremely cautious on the few occasions I take it out ) Thanks again guys...Make sure to add "coolant return line plugged" to your list of possible head-gasket mis-diagnosis symptoms...Had me fooled for sure! A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmk9561 Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 Well I fixed it, for good. Pulled off the heater core hose along with the return line and then flushed: no water flowing from the return line (as I had previously stated). So I somehow managed to jam the hose nozzle up into the tiny return line and then gave it a highly pressurized blast of water. After about a second or two I got flow from the heater core hose, so I switched back and flushed the heater core again and voila!: The return line was doing its job and returning water/coolant back into the tank! Problem solved Runs like a top...nice and cool...Ahhh nothing like my N* <3 Now to fix the rusted break line that failed on me while it was sitting over the summer Btw is it ok to drive the car short distances with no break fluid? Like do I risk damaging the ABS/Valves/Master cylinder? Only reason I ask is I sorta have to use it for a few days...Have no other choice (and yes I know it is VERY dangerous to drive without power-assisted breaks and im being extremely cautious on the few occasions I take it out ) Thanks again guys...Make sure to add "coolant return line plugged" to your list of possible head-gasket mis-diagnosis symptoms...Had me fooled for sure! It isn't a matter of having no power brakes, but NO BRAKES AT ALL! Don't drive the car at all with a bad line and no fluid as you will not be able to stop at some point and will have to crash your car to avoid killing somebody. Get a taxi, bus, or friend to take you. The parking brake is not sufficient to stop the car from any speed and a hole in the system guarantees no brakes quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted August 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 It isn't a matter of having no power brakes, but NO BRAKES AT ALL! Don't drive the car at all with a bad line and no fluid as you will not be able to stop at some point and will have to crash your car to avoid killing somebody. Get a taxi, bus, or friend to take you. The parking brake is not sufficient to stop the car from any speed and a hole in the system guarantees no brakes quickly. I understand your/everyone's concern (i've been around here long enough to know you guys are anal about saftey....and rightfully so). However the car DOES have brakes, they just dont work very well with no fluid in the lines. I mean I its not like I cant stop, I can stop just fine, all I need to do is apply the brakes a little early. But yea what happens when someone pulls out infront of you etc etc. I agree and probably wont drive it anymore...However could I have done any damage driving it for 10 or so minutes without fluid in the lines? A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 It isn't a matter of having no power brakes, but NO BRAKES AT ALL! Don't drive the car at all with a bad line and no fluid as you will not be able to stop at some point and will have to crash your car to avoid killing somebody. Get a taxi, bus, or friend to take you. The parking brake is not sufficient to stop the car from any speed and a hole in the system guarantees no brakes quickly. I understand your/everyone's concern (i've been around here long enough to know you guys are anal about saftey....and rightfully so). However the car DOES have brakes, they just dont work very well with no fluid in the lines. I mean I its not like I cant stop, I can stop just fine, all I need to do is apply the brakes a little early. But yea what happens when someone pulls out infront of you etc etc. I agree and probably wont drive it anymore...However could I have done any damage driving it for 10 or so minutes without fluid in the lines? The increased travel in the brake pedal could cause the master cylinder seals to contact rust in the bores scoring the seals and damaging the master cylinder. I currently have a bad brake line and my car is sitting with no brakes, once the fluid is out there is no brakes at all, not sure why you have brakes maybe its related to the power booster and not the hydraulics, the seal at the back of the master cylinder can go bad in my experience and fluid can be pulled into the vacuum booster Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 It isn't a matter of having no power brakes, but NO BRAKES AT ALL! Don't drive the car at all with a bad line and no fluid as you will not be able to stop at some point and will have to crash your car to avoid killing somebody. Get a taxi, bus, or friend to take you. The parking brake is not sufficient to stop the car from any speed and a hole in the system guarantees no brakes quickly. I understand your/everyone's concern (i've been around here long enough to know you guys are anal about saftey....and rightfully so). However the car DOES have brakes, they just dont work very well with no fluid in the lines. I mean I its not like I cant stop, I can stop just fine, all I need to do is apply the brakes a little early. But yea what happens when someone pulls out infront of you etc etc. I agree and probably wont drive it anymore...However could I have done any damage driving it for 10 or so minutes without fluid in the lines? If you nevertheless have to stop using the parking brake, remember that it will not activate unless you are in neutral. You may panic and be in trouble. Once I did not have ANY time to play with parking brake and had to put it in Park to avoid collision... The bottom line, if your brakes do not work PERFECTLY do not drive because you do not know what is going to happen next. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted August 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 The increased travel in the brake pedal could cause the master cylinder seals to contact rust in the bores scoring the seals and damaging the master cylinder. I currently have a bad brake line and my car is sitting with no brakes, once the fluid is out there is no brakes at all, not sure why you have brakes maybe its related to the power booster and not the hydraulics, the seal at the back of the master cylinder can go bad in my experience and fluid can be pulled into the vacuum booster Yea im not really sure what to make of it either??? I mean the leak is obvious: its located about a foot in front of the drivers side rear wheel and dumps out nearly every ounce of fluid within minutes. Im almost positive there is no fluid left in the lines as I can hear air hissing out of the crack when I apply the brakes. A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 The increased travel in the brake pedal could cause the master cylinder seals to contact rust in the bores scoring the seals and damaging the master cylinder. I currently have a bad brake line and my car is sitting with no brakes, once the fluid is out there is no brakes at all, not sure why you have brakes maybe its related to the power booster and not the hydraulics, the seal at the back of the master cylinder can go bad in my experience and fluid can be pulled into the vacuum booster Yea im not really sure what to make of it either??? I mean the leak is obvious: its located about a foot in front of the drivers side rear wheel and dumps out nearly every ounce of fluid within minutes. Im almost positive there is no fluid left in the lines as I can hear air hissing out of the crack when I apply the brakes. That is about where my leak is, I need to get under there. I am very very surprised that you have any stopping power at all, mine went to the floor and I almost hit the car in front of me. The emergency brake is useless. I would avoid driving it Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted August 31, 2009 Report Share Posted August 31, 2009 If you can stop the car AT ALL, you still have fluid in the lines. If you had "no fluid" you would have no brakes AT ALL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Half of the brake system should still be functional - the car has a diagonal split master cylinder so one front and the opposing rear wheel would have functional brakes. When you apply the brakes, I will bet the car pulls to one direction. Based on your description of the leak, the driver's front and passenger rear brakes are still functioning. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Half of the brake system should still be functional - the car has a diagonal split master cylinder so one front and the opposing rear wheel would have functional brakes. When you apply the brakes, I will bet the car pulls to one direction. Based on your description of the leak, the driver's front and passenger rear brakes are still functioning. I didnt get this impression at all, my brakes went to the floor. If the tubing that runs between the rear wheels goes bad is this still true? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted September 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Half of the brake system should still be functional - the car has a diagonal split master cylinder so one front and the opposing rear wheel would have functional brakes. When you apply the brakes, I will bet the car pulls to one direction. Based on your description of the leak, the driver's front and passenger rear brakes are still functioning. 100% correct. A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Half of the brake system should still be functional - the car has a diagonal split master cylinder so one front and the opposing rear wheel would have functional brakes. When you apply the brakes, I will bet the car pulls to one direction. Based on your description of the leak, the driver's front and passenger rear brakes are still functioning. I didnt get this impression at all, my brakes went to the floor. If the tubing that runs between the rear wheels goes bad is this still true? If you have brake pipe running between the rear wheels, that would make me think you have a conventional split master cylinder - fronts on one circuit and rears on a separate circuit. If that is the case, you'd have front brakes but no rears. The '96 Shop manual decribes a diagonal split master cylinder though. If you pump the brakes, does it build brake pressure? Maybe you have two leaks? Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Half of the brake system should still be functional - the car has a diagonal split master cylinder so one front and the opposing rear wheel would have functional brakes. When you apply the brakes, I will bet the car pulls to one direction. Based on your description of the leak, the driver's front and passenger rear brakes are still functioning. I didnt get this impression at all, my brakes went to the floor. If the tubing that runs between the rear wheels goes bad is this still true? If you have brake pipe running between the rear wheels, that would make me think you have a conventional split master cylinder - fronts on one circuit and rears on a separate circuit. If that is the case, you'd have front brakes but no rears. The '96 Shop manual decribes a diagonal split master cylinder though. If you pump the brakes, does it build brake pressure? Maybe you have two leaks? I don't believe that I have two leaks, the fluid resouvior goes dry. Its leaking about 6 inches inboard of the RR rear wheel Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry94 Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Yea im not really sure what to make of it either??? I mean the leak is obvious: its located about a foot in front of the drivers side rear wheel and dumps out nearly every ounce of fluid within minutes. Im almost positive there is no fluid left in the lines as I can hear air hissing out of the crack when I apply the brakes. I had to replace the rear left line on my '94 this Summer. It completely blew out behind the drivers side rear wheel. As mentioned I still had brakes, however it required a couple pumps to get stopped. This line is quite difficult to replace as it disappears up over the rear suspension to a junction block just behind the rear wheel. If I remember correctly there is a bracket that holds the lines at this location. With the bolt removed from the bracket, the assembly can be moved out a bit to access the retaining clip and then extend the line to gain access to the fitting. I carefully removed the old line, cut it about to the drivers seat, and made an exact duplicate (bends). The newly formed line fit great. It's difficult to access, however it's the preforming of the line that makes it much easier. Barry 2008 STS V82016 Colorado Z711970 Corvette LT-1 Coupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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