BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 I just sent Paul a PM and asked him to take a look at what you have found, you have departed from my ability to help any further as I don't have direct experience with your engine. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Fred, do you have one spacer on each bank with 8 seals? I dont know if this is a different or aftermarket style of gasket but it does in fact differ from the diagram. We will see what Paul has to say about it. If this seal style is an aftermarket seal I personally would purchase an OEM seal set. Also for $200 plus shipping I would probably do those injectors if I were you. You will need to do all 8 injectors so that they have an even flow balance but since you are selling the car, I would imagine that if you could determine what injectors are acting up, you could do just those. Here is a statement on the lindertech site regarding replacing/reconditioning all injectors: Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 I've got round black things.. eight of them Right under the engine cover At the ends of them they have a square green seal Eight of each Kind of look like #1 in the picture.. except the picture shows them as one piece. I have 8 of them.. The spacer is it the thing I can look through and see into the combustion chambers? I can see into the combustion chambers there is a metal divider in each hole down in there. That picture mentions those 4 bolts someone was talking about Are we sure this picture is of a 94 motor? I have the 94 STS here Fred, it sounds like you just took the intake manifold apart. The spacers are under the "whole" intake manifold housing. If you have a 94 Engine and you put the intake manifold back together and the cover on, there are 4 bolts separate from the cover. those 4 bolts allow the whole intake, in one piece, to lift up and the spacers are under that. The manifold housing includes fuel rail, injectors, throttle body, FPR, and air inlet tubes. The air inlet tubes are what you are working on now. I will send you a diagram of the whole intake. If you have your cover off, hold it up and you should see 4 holes separate from the 12 bolt holes that bolt the cover on. If you do not then you have a different engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Fred, I sent you an email earlier with 3 pictures. One of those pictures is labeled INTAKE SERVICE it shows the 4 bolts that allow the whole intake and the throttle body lift up. The plates are under that. They are visible in that picture but not highlighted until the next picture labeled INTAKE MANIFOLD SEALS. You have that picture posted on post 174. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Hey there I got your e-mail, Let me wake up to a point where I can think... and I will post those pictures up on here and read what you're saying Got to have a cigarette and coffee jumpstart or kickstart MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Six and seven are what I was talking about... the picture is my motor. Fred, I sent you an email earlier with 3 pictures. One of those pictures is labeled INTAKE SERVICE it shows the 4 bolts that allow the whole intake and the throttle body lift up. The plates are under that. They are visible in that picture but not highlighted until the next picture labeled INTAKE MANIFOLD SEALS. You have that picture posted on post 174. I don't see one called "Intake service"... You have got my motor in these pictures though Those four holes in the cover appeared out of a nowhere I feel like a complete idiot now.. You must feel like I always feel when I always have to explain everything to someone, Like how to use a coffee maker or why 23% is a bad rate on a loan, This time I'm the idiot I swear this doesn't happen often Man. Sorry about my blindness. MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 OMG what a nightmare that engine is! That is so different than my 96, of course its all relative, mine is a dinosaur compared to a 2000 Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 OMG what a nightmare that engine is! That is so different than my 96, of course its all relative, mine is a dinosaur compared to a 2000 If I ever have to take off those stupid cover bolts again I will.. Just have to take them out again, But I hate those MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 This time I'm the idiot Let me get this straight now, THIS TIME you are the idiot? Who was the IDIOT before? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 This time I'm the idiot Let me get this straight now, THIS TIME you are the idiot? Who was the IDIOT before? No one on here, Just people I deal with in person on a daily basis.. MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Whew.... I feel better now But..... you deal with ME on a daily basis since AUGUST! Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Put the cover back on and it's not starting but I think it's out of gas MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Um? This begs the question, Who's the idiot now? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Um? This begs the question, Who's the idiot now? MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Um? This begs the question, Who's the idiot now? oh come on, you left yourself WIDE open for that! Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Um? This begs the question, Who's the idiot now? oh come on, you left yourself WIDE open for that! Agreed MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Well I took it up a bit have to take some things off the side to get it all the way out can't right now but will asap MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Well I took it up a bit have to take some things off the side to get it all the way out can't right now but will asap You do not have to take it all the way out, unless you want to. Go to my post #136 and read the way I did mine. The fuel lines will allow you to lift it up enough, without unhooking them, to put the 2X2 wood blocks in and pull the plates out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Well I took it up a bit have to take some things off the side to get it all the way out can't right now but will asap You do not have to take it all the way out, unless you want to. Go to my post #136 and read the way I did mine. The fuel lines will allow you to lift it up enough, without unhooking them, to put the 2X2 wood blocks in and pull the plates out. Right right I remember now, I will hopefully come back home in time to do it without waking up these darned middle class midwesterners I live near and around and all MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Well I didn't get a chance to do it tonight, But I have been thinking, That day when the car started acting up three injectors didn't just POOF stop working and get crusted up.. that doesn't make sense to me unless the gasoline had some pretty awful stuff in it alot worse than water and even then that is what a fuel filter is made for.. I bet these Phenolic plates are the story - I bet a chunk of something fell into one of the passages or some of a thing and POOF there came the problems BLAM what do you folks think Well I didn't get a chance to do it tonight, But I have been thinking, That day when the car started acting up three injectors didn't just POOF stop working and get crusted up.. that doesn't make sense to me unless the gasoline had some pretty awful stuff in it alot worse than water and even then that is what a fuel filter is made for.. I bet these Phenolic plates are the story - I bet a chunk of something fell into one of the passages or some of a thing and POOF there came the problems BLAM what do you folks think I wish I could go out and work on it but I live near normal people who sleep all of the time due to being employed (it's late out) MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 The only way I could see that the plates are the problem is if the gaskets are cracked or broken causing a vacuum leak. They could be all carboned up though and completely choked off. It definately will not hurt for them to be cleaned. You should notice, right off the bat, that it responds faster to the accelerator. Do not forget to have the vacuum handy when you clean off the head surface. By the way, I used black RTV on the gaskets for an added assurance of a better seal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 I sure hope I get a chance to get it done today What a day I just woke up it's 3PM and I have to go and help someone load some tables and also I have to go and put Windows 2000 on my fathers computer and reinstall everything on earth rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Put XP on the computer. W2K is fine but XP is mostly the same and will be supported by MS longer. I would venture that your crusting-up has happened since the car hasn't been running well. If the injectors all work well, I would try to clear them by driving. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fred Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 XP is nice and solid but it has too much cutesy **** I prefer 2000 because I am so old. 2000 is just as solid too it is sort of like NT MerryChristmas Be a Capitalist or work for one. Work for a Capitalist or be one. MerryChristmas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 19, 2006 Report Share Posted October 19, 2006 Put XP on the computer. W2K is fine but XP is mostly the same and will be supported by MS longer. I would venture that your crusting-up has happened since the car hasn't been running well. If the injectors all work well, I would try to clear them by driving. Jim, do you think that means that they stop putting out security patches for the operating system when they stop supporting it? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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