Ranger Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Well, since I just rolled over 100K I thought it might be a good idea to change the trans fluid (did the brake fluid last week). Checked Napa and they had no listing for a gasket. Went to a local trans shop and they didn't have one either but said that they reuse them all the time. So, inspite of what the service manual said I just cleaned the scavenger screens and gasket and reused them (saved $30). The fluid sure looked like it needed changing. It wasn't brown but it sure wasn't red either. Glad I did it. Typical build up on the magnet and found a small sliver of aluminum in the pan . The manual never does show exactly where that darn side cover drain plug is but by studying it I got lucky with the first try. I have to say, I was a bit surprised though. I had expected to get most of the oil out of the side cover from what I have read but that was not the case. 90% came out of the pan and 10% of that ended up on the garage floor . Put it back together and per the manual I put 11 qts. back in. Wouldn't you know it, it was over filled . I did not bother with the cooling line flush as the manual said there would only be another qt. or so to be gained and I was to darn tired. So now I am good for another 100K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhall Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Larry, I just did the trans fluid for my white diamond '97 Deville last weekend. Same story except I bit the bullet and went to the dealer for the screen & pan gasket kit ($90). The old gasket looked OK, but it was really stuck hard to the transmisson case at the back end of the case. I would hate myself if it leaked after all the work on the engine. I also pulled the side cover and replaced the gasket. When I pulled the pan I got the confirmation that most of the fluid was in the bottom - at least while the transmission was not operating. I took the engine and trans out for a head gasket replacement and decided to clean it all up while I was at it. I've installed a new converter main seal and axle seals as well, so I'm pretty sure I'm set for another 100K +. Engine and trans really sparkles on the stand in the garage. Hoping to reinstall in about 3 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Jhall, Did you change the filter that is located in the side pan while you had it apart? My 1994 manual shows a filter there. It would be a great time to do it, as it is nearly impossible with the engine & tranny installed. Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhall Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Hi Britt, Yeah, I replaced the main filter in the side cover as well as the scavenger screens in the lower pan. The lower screens looked OK, but I replaced them anyway. Had the obligatory grey colored film in the lower pan and in the side cover with a small amount of fine metal on the lower pan magnet, but otherwise everything looked clean and smelled OK for having 130K miles on it. Have a look at the attached for proof! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Well, since I just rolled over 100K I thought it might be a good idea to change the trans fluid (did the brake fluid last week). Checked Napa and they had no listing for a gasket. Went to a local trans shop and they didn't have one either but said that they reuse them all the time. So, inspite of what the service manual said I just cleaned the scavenger screens and gasket and reused them (saved $30). The fluid sure looked like it needed changing. It wasn't brown but it sure wasn't red either. Glad I did it. Typical build up on the magnet and found a small sliver of aluminum in the pan . The manual never does show exactly where that darn side cover drain plug is but by studying it I got lucky with the first try. I have to say, I was a bit surprised though. I had expected to get most of the oil out of the side cover from what I have read but that was not the case. 90% came out of the pan and 10% of that ended up on the garage floor . Put it back together and per the manual I put 11 qts. back in. Wouldn't you know it, it was over filled . I did not bother with the cooling line flush as the manual said there would only be another qt. or so to be gained and I was to darn tired. So now I am good for another 100K Larry, I just clean the screens and then use a new pan gasket from the dealer. The OEM pan gasket has steel spacers to assure the proper crush of the gasket ribs. The pan gaskets are in the $25 range. As long as the trans fluid did not smell burned, you should be fine. I think it looses it's red color over time. 11 quarts of fluid? Seems like you only get 5-6 quarts out with a drain and refill. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted June 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Kevin, The manual said 11 qts. for a drain (including side cover). I definately got more than 5 or 6 out of it. I did an oil change first and my drain pan was about 1/2 full. That's 6-7 qts. depending on how low the oil was. When I did the trans, the pan was almost full and there was probably about 1/2 qt. or better on the garage floor. I sucked a little out but 10-11 seems about right. Took it for a ride afterwards to dump the oil and it rode just fine and doesn't appear to be any leaks with the old gasket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 I like the under the hood method. Divert the transmission return line plumbing from the radiator into a 5 gallon bucket and idle the engine until no more fluid is pumped out. Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted June 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 The problem with that Jim, is that you can't clean all the crap out of the pan and the magnet. Your method certainly is easier, Ill give you that but I it is best to drop the pan and wipe everything out good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JIMDTS Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Good job Never hurts to change the fluids Cheers Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 I thought the whole point of using the trans line method was to remove the fluid so you could THEN drop the pan and do what you wanted , minus the mess? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 I like the under the hood method. Divert the transmission return line plumbing from the radiator into a 5 gallon bucket and idle the engine until no more fluid is pumped out. Is not it easier to loosen a clamp on the cooling sending hose before radiator and drain the ATF? In this case you do not need any fitting to attach a hose to the radiator outlet and the hose is closer to the ground so you can put it directly in whatever you use to collect the old fluide. I am talking about 4T60-E. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 The problem with that Jim, is that you can't clean all the crap out of the pan and the magnet. Your method certainly is easier, Ill give you that but I it is best to drop the pan and wipe everything out good. Ranger, It was the reason I took off the pan too - to see what is going on inside and clean it up. But after removing the pan I saw just a very thin film of metall powder in the pan and more thick one on the magnet. Even if you clean them up all transmission parts are actually covered with the same stuff and you cannot clean them. So... after the job was done I realized I had better just to replace the ATF without messy pan dropping and filter replacing. The old fluide was discolored, rather pale than brown and smelled just a little bit burned. Pan dropping allows to remove only 6QTR of old fluide and the capacity of 4T60-E is 11QTS so after all was done the ATF looked and smelled half-better . I probably will pump out the fluide in some 5.000 miles without removing the pan and will let it alone for the rest of car's life. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdictas Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 JHall, Did you replace the speed sensor in the tranny? It's that $30 part that costs a $1000 at the dealer to replace when the engine and tranny are install in the vehicle. Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc_caddy Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 I like the under the hood method. Divert the transmission return line plumbing from the radiator into a 5 gallon bucket and idle the engine until no more fluid is pumped out. To do this, do you disconnect the (top or bottom) transmision line entering the radiator? So you just: - Disconnect the top/bottom(?) line at the radiator, divert line into a bucket - Idle the engine until no more fluid is coming out - Shut down the engine - Reattach trans line to radiator (drain transmission cooler at rad?) - Then add fresh fluid through the dipstick hole? I'm assuming that you don't need to replenish with fresh fluid, during idling of the engine to extract the old fluid. Also, does the transmission line fitting come off/on with just an open wrench, or do you need a special tool? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 gc_caddy, I would use in in-line wrench not an open end wrench. This method will not do any damage to the transmission? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhall Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Did you replace the speed sensor in the tranny? It's that $30 part that costs a $1000 at the dealer to replace when the engine and tranny are install in the vehicle. No. I have not had any problems, but considering the work needed to reach the sensor, it might be a good idea. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 I like the under the hood method. Divert the transmission return line plumbing from the radiator into a 5 gallon bucket and idle the engine until no more fluid is pumped out. To do this, do you disconnect the (top or bottom) transmision line entering the radiator? So you just: - Disconnect the top/bottom(?) line at the radiator, divert line into a bucket - Idle the engine until no more fluid is coming out - Shut down the engine - Reattach trans line to radiator (drain transmission cooler at rad?) - Then add fresh fluid through the dipstick hole? I'm assuming that you don't need to replenish with fresh fluid, during idling of the engine to extract the old fluid. Also, does the transmission line fitting come off/on with just an open wrench, or do you need a special tool? Thanks. This describes a '98 + and possibly other years which use quick disconnect fittings at the radiator; your fittings might be different. No special tools required. Remove whatever is necessary to access the upper (return) transmission line at the radiator. Remove a locking clip and remove transmission line from radiator side-tank fitting. Do not lose the locking clip or the O ring! Remove the quick disconnect adapter fitting from the tank. Install something similar to this brass fitting adapter into the tank in place of the quick disconnect adapter. Pump fluid out at idle speed. My hose is long enough to allow me to sit behind the wheel with the hose in the bucket and one hand on the ignition key. I do not attempt to put in fresh fluid at this time. I am guessing there is less than one quart remaining in all the plumbing when it stops pumping. This is almost more difficult to describe than to do. Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 That is very cool Jim, I think this is a great idea. Once the fluid is out, I would drop the pan clean it out, change the filters, etc... Is the pan more or less empty at that point? Amazing, this would make the messy job of dropping the pan much easier.... Thanks for the tip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted June 9, 2005 Report Share Posted June 9, 2005 Did you replace the speed sensor in the tranny? It's that $30 part that costs a $1000 at the dealer to replace when the engine and tranny are install in the vehicle. No. I have not had any problems, but considering the work needed to reach the sensor, it might be a good idea. Thanks! Isn't amazing how a job keeps expanding and expanding? How about the solenoids? Also, while you are at it, did you take off the side pan and reseal it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc_caddy Posted June 10, 2005 Report Share Posted June 10, 2005 This describes a '98 + and possibly other years which use quick disconnect fittings at the radiator; your fittings might be different. No special tools required. Remove whatever is necessary to access the upper (return) transmission line at the radiator. Remove a locking clip and remove transmission line from radiator side-tank fitting. Do not lose the locking clip or the O ring! Remove the quick disconnect adapter fitting from the tank. Install something similar to this brass fitting adapter into the tank in place of the quick disconnect adapter. Pump fluid out at idle speed. My hose is long enough to allow me to sit behind the wheel with the hose in the bucket and one hand on the ignition key. I do not attempt to put in fresh fluid at this time. I am guessing there is less than one quart remaining in all the plumbing when it stops pumping. This is almost more difficult to describe than to do. Thanks! I looked at the fittings at the radiator side-tank and it doesn't look like a quick-disconnect (94STS). I will look into making some type of fitting. As mentioned earlier, your method would make removing the pan and cleaning the filter (if desired) a lot less messy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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