WarrenJ Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 A few months back we discussed here the issue of some or other federal law requiring auto manufactures to replace defective catalytic converters free of charge if they had less than 80K miles/5 years on them and were found to be defective. Now I'm not entirely sure of the numbers, but I think I'm in the ballpark. Yesterday a coworker was simply dumbfounded after his Lexus dealer quoted him in excess of $2500 to replace his converter and associated parts. Now this guy is normally no slouch, but he was down for the count. Stunned! Just out of it! Fortunately, his college aged son took matters by the horns and contacted the appropriate dealer and federal agencies and got this mess straightened out. The result? New converter/no charge. Until junior had gotten involved, the dealer was adamant: bring us your car and $2500. Gotta watch 'em like a hawk. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 We're all just people. I'm sure that the service manager was just mistaken. Whenever I run into something like that, I pour honey on the shotgun before I talk to anyone. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 We're all just people. I'm sure that the service manager was just mistaken. Whenever I run into something like that, I pour honey on the shotgun before I talk to anyone. Well isn't that just so nice! I'm certain the "Church Lady" would agree. Betcha she's got some honey under her skirts also. I meant on her shotgun, of course. Oh, wait . . . Well, you understand. I hope . . . Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 I'm not going anywhere near that honey, but here is part of the mandate from the Federal EPA (the complete document is here http://www.epa.gov/otaq/consumer/warr95fs.txt ). ****************************************************************************** United States Air and Radiation EPA420-F-96-020 Environmental Protection March 1996 Agency Office of Mobile Sources --------------------------------------------------------------------- EPA Environmental Fact Sheet --------------------------------------------------------------------- EMISSIONS WARRANTIES FOR 1995 AND NEWER CARS & TRUCKS [EDIT] A. PERFORMANCE WARRANTY The Performance Warranty covers repairs which are required during the first 2 years or 24,000 miles of vehicle use because the vehicle failed an emission test. Specified major emission control components are covered for the first 8 years or 80,000 miles..... [EDIT] .... you are eligible for this warranty protection provided that: * Your car or light-duty truck fails an approved emissions test; and * Your vehicle is less than 2 years old and has less than 24,000 miles (up to 8 years/80,000 miles for certain components); and * Your state or local government requires that you repair the vehicle; and * The test failure does not result from misuse of the vehicle or a failure to follow the manufacturers' written maintenance instructions; and * You present the vehicle to a warranty-authorized manufacturer representative, along with evidence of the emission test failure, during the warranty period. During the first 2 years/24,000 miles, the Performance Warranty covers any repair or adjustment which is necessary to make your vehicle pass an approved, locally-required emission test and as long as your vehicle has not exceeded the warranty time or mileage limitations and has been properly maintained according to the manufacturer's specifications. B. DESIGN AND DEFECT WARRANTY The Design and Defect Warranty covers repair of emission related parts which become defective during the warranty period. The Design and Defect warranty for model year 1995 and newer light-duty cars and trucks is outlined below: Design and Defect Warranty Coverage for 1995 and newer light-duty vehicles: * Emission control and emission related parts are covered for the first 2 years or 24,000 miles of vehicle use; and * Specified major emission control components are covered for the first 8 years or 80,000 miles of vehicle use. [EDIT REMAINER] Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted February 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 I'm not going anywhere near that honey Oh, you don't have to call me "Honey." There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Its really hard to believe the dealer didnt know that it was covered. My friend swears by Infinity... On his last visit that cost him $600 for an O2 Sensor... OMG.... my friend said, the repairs are very expensive, and the service writer responded, sir, you are driving a sophistocated luxury car..., you have to expect luxury car repair prices.. HUH? They charged him a large $$$ for computer diagnostics, what a laugh, This is why I am stunned everytime a member dumps on Cadillac and threatens to buy a Lexus... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve6 Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 any idea what year and model lexus? that article dosnt specifically say the converter.... its so vague it could be interpeted anyway(typical for goverment documents) i wonder if we have anything like this in canada... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 any idea what year and model lexus? that article dosnt specifically say the converter.... its so vague it could be interpeted anyway(typical for goverment documents) i wonder if we have anything like this in canada... In the US. OBDII Fed is 8 years, 80,000 miles on the catalytic converter and the PCM. The trade off, is everything else is 2 year 24,000 miles. See this link: http://www.epa.gov/otaq/consumer/warr95fs.txt Logan Diagnostic LLC www.airbagcrash.com www.logandieselusa.com www.ledfix.com www.ledfix.com/yukontaillightrepair.html www.ledfix.com/ledreplacements.html www.ledfix.com/j42385toolrental.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmarinov Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 you have to expect luxury car repair prices.. HUH? Grrr, I hate that mindset. Me at dealership: "Hello, I need a piece of rust, please." Service Advisor/Parts Guy: <<confused look>> Me: "....um, it's for a '94 Cadillac Eldo--" Service Advisor/Parts Guy: *grins* "That'll be $64.98 before tax." The windshield molding on my '94 cost more than the glass itself! The black/chrome molding is discontinued and unavailable everywhere, the $150+ was for a plain-Jane black molding. But at least it's sophisticated, I guess <!--fonto:Arial--><span style="font-family:Arial"><!--/fonto-->2007 DTS Performance - 50K <!--fontc--></span><!--/fontc--> As a matter of fact, I <i>am</i> driving 70 MPH in a phone booth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted February 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 Its really hard to believe the dealer didnt know that it was covered. Isn't it? But they *still* tried to go for the $2500! That was the point I had in mind! Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breeza_Brown Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 dealers are pirates, capitalism at its worse. most people (my mother/grandmother included) think you have to take back to the dealer for service or it won't run. Everyday Is Saturday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 The service writer didn't my ***. If he doesn't know, who does? He was just trying to turn a warranty job into a $2500 customer pay, because his paycheck is based on a percentage of what he sells. I was just at the dealer yesterday and found out from the service writer that his paycheck is 4% of his sales, AND it is reduced to 2% if he gets negative warranty feedback from customer surveys sent out by GM (not including CCP warranties). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epricedright Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 dealers are pirates, capitalism at its worse. most people (my mother/grandmother included) think you have to take back to the dealer for service or it won't run. My sister is the same way. No convincing her otherwise. She says she would rather pay extra and have it done right. Sad she won't take the time to find a good mechanic besides the stealership or have her all thumbs husband do some of the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted February 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 My sister is the same way. No convincing her otherwise. She says she would rather pay extra and have it done right. Sad she won't take the time to find a good mechanic besides the stealership or have her all thumbs husband do some of the work. Funny you should reply to this thread. You recently demanded that I not reply to any threads you might post. You even went so far as to suggest I not even *read* your posts. I've respected your wishes. Don't you think it odd you have failed to reciprocate? --Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted February 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 The service writer didn't my ***. If he doesn't know, who does? He was just trying to turn a warranty job into a $2500 customer pay, because his paycheck is based on a percentage of what he sells. I was just at the dealer yesterday and found out from the service writer that his paycheck is 4% of his sales, AND it is reduced to 2% if he gets negative warranty feedback from customer surveys sent out by GM (not including CCP warranties). Gee, now *there's* a surprise. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 In my experience, you must find a good, honest mechanic no matter what you drive. You can't do everything yourself unless you have two helpers, a lift, a compressor, a lot of special tools, and a scan tool. Finding one at a dealer is not as hard as, say, finding a service station that you can trust for general work on your Cadillac, but both are do-able. It's really very simple to find a non-dealer mechanic, just watch the customer lot of a mechanic for cars similar in type and age to yours, and make sure that nearly all of them roll over every two or three days. Then, stop in and check the office wall for certifications, and look at the mechanics for cleanliness, professionalism, intelligence, and morale. The first two or three times you use any mechanic, re-check his work by making sure that all the right bolts are in all the right holes, and if possible look at how tight they are, etc. Dealer mechanics sometimes change when you take the car in for different things, particularly with large dealerships, so eternal vigilance is best there, and you should have a relationship to a particular service manager, as opposed to foreman or mechanic at an independent shop. All of us do DIY within our available time, facilities, and ability. For most non-trivial work, we need a scan tool. There are lots of inexpensive OBD II scan tools that use a laptop for the software and screen available; just do a search on "OBD II scan tool" and you'll turn up several. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrantlee Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 In my experience, you must find a good, honest mechanic no matter what you drive. You can't do everything yourself unless you have two helpers, a lift, a compressor, a lot of special tools, and a scan tool. Finding one at a dealer is not as hard as, say, finding a service station that you can trust for general work on your Cadillac, but both are do-able. It's really very simple to find a non-dealer mechanic, just watch the customer lot of a mechanic for cars similar in type and age to yours, and make sure that nearly all of them roll over every two or three days. Then, stop in and check the office wall for certifications, and look at the mechanics for cleanliness, professionalism, intelligence, and morale. I don't recall if anyone has posted about another way to avoid the dealer and get a decent certified technician to work on their cars(they get really annoyed if you refer to them as mechanics---they do have papers.) Many technicians, GM, Ford, etc., have shops in their backyards, especially here in the South. They glady take on after hours jobs to put more food in their families mouths. You just have to ask around. I have a Caddy tech who works at a Buick/Pontiac dealer that works on mine. He will even get OEM parts for me cheaper or at least as cheap as I can. They are sometimes allowed to take home expensive tools(Scan tools, etc.). Again, all you have to do is ask around. The worst they can say is no, but they will probably know someone who does after hours work. The best part is the price they charge; well below what you would pay the dealer for the same tech to do the same work. A tech generally gets half of what the dealer charges for labor. So even if he charges you the same he would have been paid, you get the labor for half price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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