Jump to content
CaddyInfo Cadillac Forum

98 Etc Head Gasket Replacement


98ETC9

Recommended Posts

i am new to the forum and wanted some input regarding my etc. recently the car over heated on me, i check the water pump, t-stat and radiator all checked out fine. Cylinder #2 Developed a misfire after the overheating. Changed all the plugs ran great for about a mile and started misfiring again along with overheating. Scaneed it same outcome, pulled the plug it had antifreeze on it. Came to the conclusion it was the head gasket.. Tore the front bank of the motor down yesterday. Is it hard to timesert the block myself and what all is involved with doing so?

Here are some pictures of the parts

2010-08-28102225.jpg

2010-08-28103757.jpg

2010-08-28104909.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Personally I would not use Timeserts. "Norms" inserts have a coarser thread pitch. Timeserts have the same thread pitch that just failed. No it's not hard to do. Especially if you have ever done any thread tapping.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have done two complete head gasket repairs. The Timesert portion is not that difficult, but it does take time. You must follow the Timesert directions; no shortcuts or sloppy work.

It is technically possible to do the repair in the car, BUT it is highly recommended to remove the engine to do this work. It is also highly recommended to do both heads, if one side is bad, the other is; or will be soon,

There are many reasons to do this repair with the engine out of the car:

. Leaning over the car to do the drilling, tapping, cleaning, necessary for the Timeserts, is a back breaking job.

. The rear head is all but inaccessible do do the job.

. Re-timing the engine is difficult, if not impossible once the timing chain has been removed from the cams.

_The timing chain cover must be removed to be able to reset the cams, crank, relax the chain slippers,etc; to get every thing realigned.

_If not aligned correctly you will likely destroy the engine when you try to start it.

Although it is a pain (understatement) to remove the engine, once it is out the repairs are pretty straight forward. It also give you the opportunity to make a number of other repairs that usually need doing at the same time.

I have attached a PDF that shows what it cost on one of my repair jobs. You may not need to fix all of the miscellaneous items that I did, but be prepared for a few more thing that need fixing.

There is debate on whether to remove the engine from the top, or the bottom; I choose the top. Others on the forum have chosen the bottom. Either way has its problems.

Regarding Timeserts, I had no problem using them, and they are the factory recommended way to repair bad head bolt holes. Perhaps the best way is to use studs, but that raises other issues.

Good Luck, George

Drive'em like you own 'em. - ....................04 DTS............................

DTS_Signature.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

my heads looked similar. black and white exhaust valves from coolant leaking. i have not heard of anyone taking off the heads first and than pulling motor. seems to me it would make reaching the hidden brackets between the motor/trans easier to reach. but the firewall head is a major pain to remove. no access. rear motor mount bolts. exhaust manifold. ugh. been there. maybe take off both heads and than pull motor. work on it. put it back together and reinstall in car? your already 1/2 way there with 1 head off.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ttrying the attachment that did not make it the first time.

-George

Cadillac 1993 STS Timesert Repair.pdf

Drive'em like you own 'em. - ....................04 DTS............................

DTS_Signature.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

im considering doing all the work myself, i have a hoist and a engine stand. i want to remove it through the top i dont have room for the whole sub frame. is there a place i can find a manual online. i need my car for work and school, how long would a project like this take?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm considering doing all the work myself, i have a hoist and a engine stand. i want to remove it through the top i don't have room for the whole sub frame. is there a place i can find a manual online. i need my car for work and school, how long would a project like this take?

This is one project that you must have the manuals for. It involves many different special ways of removing and fastening parts. Torques, and turns after certain torque values are reached, must be observed; or your efforts will be wasted. There are subtle differences in some engine parts, and how they are fastened, you must be sure to use the values for your year car.

That being said, I highly recommend getting the Helms manuals, they are the factory manuals. Try e-bay, or an Internet search. The link below shows what you are looking for. Currently at $135, money well spent! These manuals cover the whole car, not just the engine.

1998 Cadillac Repair Manuals

This is an involved project, you will need help at times, an area to remove and keep things organized, to clean, etc.

Depending on the time you put in, and your technical experiance, I would say count on about a week to complete this project (I believe the shop time is in the order of 20+ hours; and they have all of the right tools and experiance).

The trickiest part, in my opinion, is getting the engine removed and back in (whether from the top or bottom). It is a tight fit, and and you must pay careful attention, especially around the heater cover area. It cracks very easily, and if damaged the only time to fix it is with the engine out of the car.

The actual engine work is not to difficult, just be careful, clean parts carefully before re-assembly, and follow the manuals instructions.

-George

Drive'em like you own 'em. - ....................04 DTS............................

DTS_Signature.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Drive'em like you own 'em. - ....................04 DTS............................

DTS_Signature.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks George for all of the insight and info its very helpful. I need to re-do the hall of fame and put you into it..

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

made some calls to local machine shops today, the cheapest price i got to pressure check and resurface the heads were $130, after calling about 10 shops i found one that would do the inserts. He quoted me $250 if i supply the inserts... does anybody know how much they usually cost? and which are the best ones to use? i'm a college student and i work part time so im on a really tight budget i want the work done correctly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

timeserts go in block. not heads. you know that right? just checking. heads usually are pretty tough. no need to mill heads since they rarely warp. timeserts are $3 each. you need 20 for block. i got mine thru a local shop called fastenal. they supply parts for shops/garages and retail also. how you getting the shortblock to shop? if shop says they can do timeserts, they must know how to install them right.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes i know they go into the block, id also hate to put the motor back together to find out i have a warped head and have to tear it down again. Doesn't aluminum warp faster than iron? why not just spend the money and make sure its done correctly, its already a pain to work on. I've built a mopar and chevy motor i can handle everything but the machine work. I have a way to pull and transport the motor. Is there a online dealer where i can order them

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you are going to use inserts, use Norm's (Ebay). They have a coarser thread pitch than Timeserts. If you want studs, contact Jake http://www.northstarperformance.com. If you use Jake's studs, they take the place of inserts.

Never heard of anyone needing to resurface the heads.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Really no need to mess with the heads.

Go to www.timesert.com and look at the videos on how to timesert the block. While they will charge you $250, that is NOT including the $550 timesert kit. You MUST find a shop that is VERY VERY familiar with timeserting the block, not just some machine shop

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

Link to comment
Share on other sites

local gm dealer said they would timesert my block for 1000. 8hrs labor? maybe if the tech is real slow. i had to deliver block of course. can you go back to shop and ask how they install timeserts? maybe you found a shop that is willing to try and has never done it before but figures it can't be too hard? if they have done it before, than you should be ok.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was referred to the shop by the owner of another machine shop who sold him the kit. After speaking to them im sure they have done the work before. The 250 was for the work. I will only need to supply the inserts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Be absolutely sure the guy has the proper drill fixture and step drill. The Timesert process is not tolerant of being installed too deep in the block.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...