What does a timesert "kit" cost?

[The Fred]

Some guy was telling me yesterday that you need a kit that costs several hundred dollars and he has one he won't ever use again..

[Cadillac Jim]

http://www.timesert.com/

The kit includes inserts, drills, taps, and everything you need to do the job in a small shop. Given the kit, all you need to buy are the inserts themselves. But, the kits vary by application. You couldn't use a kit for, say, a Ford 4.6/5.4, part number 6111, with inserts for a 1993-1999 Northstar, part number J-42385-500. The inserts are sold separately.

TimeSert doesn't give prices on their web site, but they give a list of distrubutors. A call to one of them will either give you the prices or the phone number of a nearby dealer.

[Ranger]

I believe the Northstar kit is $300 - $350 and it includes 10 inserts. You need to buy 10 more.

[BigCat83]

After reading for years about all of the issues involved with properly timeserting a Northstar block (finding someone competent enough to take the time to do the job properly) I am just about convinced we would all be better off to replace the motor with a rebuild - Jasper for example.

Your thoughts...?

I have no intention of ever geting rid of my Eldorado (almost 90K and still running, though paint and comprehensive rehab are coming) and a replacement engine is most likely the course of action I'll take when the time comes.

Hmmmm, the only thing that may temp me to sell my Eldo would be a black on black XLR.

[zonie77]

After reading for years about all of the issues involved with properly timeserting a Northstar block (finding someone competent enough to take the time to do the job properly) I am just about convinced we would all be better off to replace the motor with a rebuild - Jasper for example.

Your thoughts...?

Hmmmm, the only thing that may temp me to sell my Eldo would be a black on black XLR.

I don't know what you have heard but it is NOT hard to timesert a N*. It's like any other job...do it right the first time.

We had posts of bad Jasper engines awhile back.

[KHE]

After reading for years about all of the issues involved with properly timeserting a Northstar block (finding someone competent enough to take the time to do the job properly) I am just about convinced we would all be better off to replace the motor with a rebuild - Jasper for example.

Your thoughts...?

I have no intention of ever geting rid of my Eldorado (almost 90K and still running, though paint and comprehensive rehab are coming) and a replacement engine is most likely the course of action I'll take when the time comes.

Hmmmm, the only thing that may temp me to sell my Eldo would be a black on black XLR.

Issues with properly Timeserting a Northstar block? If you can read and follow simple directions it is no problem at all.

[BigCat83]

After reading for years about all of the issues involved with properly timeserting a Northstar block (finding someone competent enough to take the time to do the job properly) I am just about convinced we would all be better off to replace the motor with a rebuild - Jasper for example.

Your thoughts...?

I have no intention of ever geting rid of my Eldorado (almost 90K and still running, though paint and comprehensive rehab are coming) and a replacement engine is most likely the course of action I'll take when the time comes.

Hmmmm, the only thing that may temp me to sell my Eldo would be a black on black XLR.

Issues with properly Timeserting a Northstar block? If you can read and follow simple directions it is no problem at all.

It's been stories about shop techs under pressure to do the job quickly and get it out the door - flat rate?

[The Fred]

Well heck you could buy a "Jaspeh" (as people refer to them around here) and recover half or more of the cost selling the motor on the darned ebay.

But matter of a fact, you could do the timeserting easier if you had the motor out - so....

Well anyway how much is the used 93-99 NS kit thing worth.. ?

I think I could offer this Northstar hating )*@#&)*@#& $20 for it and sell it for at least $100

[gabyllac]

i got a timeserting kit i bought for my northstar im sellin for 300 its a nice kit all u need is the inserts

[jfreezn]

Some guy was telling me yesterday that you need a kit that costs several hundred dollars and he has one he won't ever use again..

He is correct, the kit is most of the cost, though the inserts are about $5 each.

There is a guy on EBAy that claims he has developed a kit that is better than time serts and it comes complete with 20 inserts for $349. Check out item # 150036654859. He seems legit and is very convincing, I hope I never have to make that call.

Jim in Phoenix

94 ETC virgin Northstar with 91K

[TDK]

Folks,

Before we dwell or obsess over the timesert kit cost, skill and why the NorthStar uses it... We should step back and agree that the reason the kits exist - is that the overall vehicle outlives its engine at times. And the engine usually fails due to to gross neglect.

Simply put, the car is just too good to toss over a headgasket!

We will not hear of other makes and Timeserts because this is a Caddy site to solve problems, (so you probably don't own the other makes) and lesser vehicles get sold or whatever.

Caddy has put a veritable buttload of engineering to compensate for our collective ignorance (Dexcool, deeper head bolts, run dry engineering, etc), but obviously, we can still break 'em - given enough time.

OK then (the Margarita Grande is wearing off), Here I am yammering about this and the BRD (Big Red Dog) just finished a 2,200-mile trip with no issues again. This is the original engine, tranny etc with almost 188,000-miles. If you have read my BS before, you will know I run it into the triples every chance I get, and it has never dissapointed me.

My new daughter in law squeaked a bit when the BRD was in the 90's downhill in traffic on the east side of the Johnson Tunnel on the way to Denver last week. It wasn't my fault, an STS with gold trim was my sponser and was just follow'in his lead... She just got nervous when a hay trailer was plodding ahead in our lane for a bit. My wife looked up from her book and said what can't be printed - and I backed it off a ways (slowed the andrenalin/testosterone drip so to speak).

Anyway, I'll say again, the cost & labor of a timesert kit would appear to be a good value, considering the relatively high usage.

Thanks and I'll shut up now

[Ed Hall]

Wonder if anyone has looked at the possibility of using threaded inserts readily available through McMaster-Carr. Just a thought.

http://www.mcmaster.com/

[KHE]

Considering all the work it is to Timesert a Northstar, I would not be willing to risk doing the development/valaditation for some guy on Ebay or trying some other threaded insert. His inserts may work initially but what about the long term reliability??? The Timeserts were developed when the Northstar engine was designed and validated so we KNOW they work.

The Ebay guy's inserts are just held in place with Loctite where the Timeserts are swedged in place mechanically to lock them in addition to the Loctite. That's why the installation tool needs to be turned in past the point of resistance when installing the Timesert - that is what swedges/locks the insert in place.

[tommysls]

Folks,

Before we dwell or obsess over the timesert kit cost, skill and why the NorthStar uses it... We should step back and agree that the reason the kits exist - is that the overall vehicle outlives its engine at times. And the engine usually fails due to to gross neglect.

Simply put, the car is just too good to toss over a headgasket!

We will not hear of other makes and Timeserts because this is a Caddy site to solve problems, (so you probably don't own the other makes) and lesser vehicles get sold or whatever.

Caddy has put a veritable buttload of engineering to compensate for our collective ignorance (Dexcool, deeper head bolts, run dry engineering, etc), but obviously, we can still break 'em - given enough time.

OK then (the Margarita Grande is wearing off), Here I am yammering about this and the BRD (Big Red Dog) just finished a 2,200-mile trip with no issues again. This is the original engine, tranny etc with almost 188,000-miles. If you have read my BS before, you will know I run it into the triples every chance I get, and it has never dissapointed me.

My new daughter in law squeaked a bit when the BRD was in the 90's downhill in traffic on the east side of the Johnson Tunnel on the way to Denver last week. It wasn't my fault, an STS with gold trim was my sponser and was just follow'in his lead... She just got nervous when a hay trailer was plodding ahead in our lane for a bit. My wife looked up from her book and said what can't be printed - and I backed it off a ways (slowed the andrenalin/testosterone drip so to speak).

Anyway, I'll say again, the cost & labor of a timesert kit would appear to be a good value, considering the relatively high usage.

Thanks and I'll shut up now

[Ed Hall]

Someone on another forum is doing a timesert job for $75 ($50 for the timesert threaded inserts + $25 for the tools from McMasters).

You can read about it here:

Click Here!!!

[jhall]

OK,

I'll toss in my two bits having performed this on my '97 Deville (now at 144K).

Check the archives under jhall. I'm one of a number of caddy nuts who has done this in his home garage to keep the car on the road. I pulled the engine down to just the block, crank and rods - including separation of the case halves.

The kit with all 20 inserts will run right at $350. Do not use thread inserts such as Heli-coils. These work OK in some applications, but will not hold against the head bolt tension in the aluminum N* block. Timeserts are glued (Locktite) and swaged to the engine block.

The installation of the timeserts is not difficult, providing you remove the engine, or at least get it so you can reach the head bolt holes at the firewall side.

I would not recommend timeserting the engine in the car unless you have lots of patience and time to "roll" the engine and reach the holes at the firewall while keeping the chips out of the engine (though it has been done by some of our readers).

The process is as simple as drilling to the proper depth using the supplied drill bit (and at least a 1/2" drill - takes some guts to move the bit) and then patiently tapping the holes. A guide bushing and plate act as a locating and depth control jig. WD-40 is the recommended drill and tap lubricant. The holes need to be cleaned thoroughly (recommend non-flammable brake cleaner in a spray can) to flush the chips during the drilling and tapping operations. The insert is installed using a threaded guide that installs and swages the inserts - pretty easy relative to removing the engine!

Bottom line - If you know the condition of the engine and the care given to the car, this helps with the engine repair versus replace issue. If the oil and oil filter has been changed per the DIC, chances are that the engine interior is in great shape. Repair if you know the engine condition is OK except for the head gaskets. Replace the engine if other damage or wear is suspected.

BTW,

Here's a link to some pics of the Timesert process on my '97 Deville - drill, tap, install insert.

http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...ic=4796&hl=

[Nikolai]

If/when I have to timesert mine, I'm just going to stud the thing. No more non-sense with timeserts. By that time it'd probably be boosted/juiced anyway. lol

[KHE]

If/when I have to timesert mine, I'm just going to stud the thing. No more non-sense with timeserts. By that time it'd probably be boosted/juiced anyway. lol

What do you expect to accomplish by using studs???? You still need to repair the threads in the block and there is limited clearance around the cams for any excess stud length. In addition, there is an aggressive threadlocker applied to the OEM bolts that cannot be applied in the field - that is why the head bolts are not re-used.