soul strife Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 I have a '96 Seville STS 4.6L N* and am wondering two things. 1) To loosen the tensioner pulley, do I turn clockwise or counter-clockwise? 2) The belt on the driver side seems to run the water pump. How do I place the belt on there? Thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 I have a '96 Seville STS 4.6L N* and am wondering two things. 1) To loosen the tensioner pulley, do I turn clockwise or counter-clockwise? 2) The belt on the driver side seems to run the water pump. How do I place the belt on there? Thanks for the help. To remove the SERP belt use a 1/2" breaker bar or ratchet handle, you will only be able to turn it one way, release the pressure and slip the belt off. There is a 1/2" notch in the belt tensioner. The water pump belt is on the driver side front of the engine. Remove the two nuts and one bolt to remove the belt shroud, and use a 1/4" breaker bar or ratchet handle to release the pressure and remove the belt, you will see the 1/4" notch in the tensioner. The tensioner is held by 2 bolts that you can loosen to slip the belt off and on Mike Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soul strife Posted March 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 Thanks for the information. I have not messed with this motor much so, getting information first is hightly important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 .... getting information first is hightly important. What a concept! Welcome to the board; lots of information available here (plus more than a few opinions). Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soul strife Posted March 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 Welcome to the board; lots of information available here (plus more than a few opinions). LOL, and I performed a search before I asked too! This is really the first time I have tinkered with this motor. I play with my LS1 all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 Welcome to the board; lots of information available here (plus more than a few opinions). LOL, and I performed a search before I asked too! This is really the first time I have tinkered with this motor. I play with my LS1 all the time. By the way welcome aboard. You can purchase a factory service manual either on ebay or at www.helminc.com they are very helpful, I have one for 91, 96 and need to buy one for 00 for my library, I find them great bedtime reading. You have an on board diagnostics system that will provide you with any diagnostics codes that are stored by the computer. Go to the top of the page, click HOW TO, DTC Codes, READING CODES, you will get the procedure. Here is a nice place to get some history and details about your year along with others <a href="http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm" target="_blank">http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm</a> If you go here, you will be able to download a PDF of your OWNERS MANUAL that you can search through with Adobe Acrobat and quickly find what you are looking for, its nice to have on your laptop. NOTE: On this same page you will see "Description of OBDII Codes", click that and you will find an explanation of what the codes mean. <a href="http://myweb.accessus.net/~090/resources-cad.html#om" target="_blank">http://myweb.accessus.net/~090/resources-cad.html#om</a> These photos are from my 96. Here is a photo of the water pump tensioner with my 1/4" breaker bar engaged. Here is a photo of the area, in it moving clockwise, you can see the transmission filler (lower right with red letters), the water pump, the thermostat housing, the water pump CAM pulley and the air purge line "bolt with a metering hole in it" that can clog and cause overheating.. hope this helps Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 This advice applies to the serpentine belt of several models up to and including at least my 1999 STSl. However, when it comes to the water pump belt, things can get quite a bit trickier on the later models. I've looked at my waterpump belt on my '99, had the shroud off and a few other little items, but there is absolutely NO clearance to remove it. It appears to my untrained eye that the actual pump housing needs to be removed in order to change the belt on this one. Can anyone confirm? Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 18, 2008 Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 This advice applies to the serpentine belt of several models up to and including at least my 1999 STSl. However, when it comes to the water pump belt, things can get quite a bit trickier on the later models. I've looked at my waterpump belt on my '99, had the shroud off and a few other little items, but there is absolutely NO clearance to remove it. It appears to my untrained eye that the actual pump housing needs to be removed in order to change the belt on this one. Can anyone confirm? I would hope not. What do you mean by pump housing do you mean the crossover? Does your pump area look like the photo I supplied above? I do recall that it is tight to remove the belt but if you remove the tensioner, you can get the belt out. Mike Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 OK, I took another look at it, here's the deal. First of all, the '99 has no dog bone, so you would think it would be a lot easier to get to right? Well its not, there's a lot more plastic shroud in the way. The tensioner might be able to be removed, but on the top of what appears to be the thermostat housing (largest red circle in picture #2) where yours appears to have two bolts going through, on mine these are two nuts that hold the shroud in place. The nuts are on two small studs that pass through the housing and these two studs (possibly more) go through to the mounting plate that hold the tesioner in place. The studs are threaded into the tesioner mounting plate. The tricky part is that the studs only have little protrusions on the end of the threaded parts.....a little "nipple" of steel that you MIGHT be able to get some vice grips to latch on to. Has anyone ever removed these studs? They might not be too tight, being locked in place by the nuts that hold the shroud on, but they don't appear to be intended for removal.......at least not with any normal tool. I suppose the old "two nut lock" trick might work. Just take the two nuts that hold the shroud on, and thread them both onto a stud and lock them together with a little torque. That way a wrench can be used to turn the stud out. Yes, if the studs came out, the tensioner would most likely come off and you might be able to get the belt off then. Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 OK, I took another look at it, here's the deal. First of all, the '99 has no dog bone, so you would think it would be a lot easier to get to right? Well its not, there's a lot more plastic shroud in the way. The tensioner might be able to be removed, but on the top of what appears to be the thermostat housing (largest red circle in picture #2) where yours appears to have two bolts going through, on mine these are two nuts that hold the shroud in place. The nuts are on two small studs that pass through the housing and these two studs (possibly more) go through to the mounting plate that hold the tesioner in place. The studs are threaded into the tesioner mounting plate. The tricky part is that the studs only have little protrusions on the end of the threaded parts.....a little "nipple" of steel that you MIGHT be able to get some vice grips to latch on to. Has anyone ever removed these studs? They might not be too tight, being locked in place by the nuts that hold the shroud on, but they don't appear to be intended for removal.......at least not with any normal tool. I suppose the old "two nut lock" trick might work. Just take the two nuts that hold the shroud on, and thread them both onto a stud and lock them together with a little torque. That way a wrench can be used to turn the stud out. Yes, if the studs came out, the tensioner would most likely come off and you might be able to get the belt off then. Here is the procedure, it does not get into too much detail but it also does not show it as a difficult procedure from what I can see, Mike Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 OK, I took another look at it, here's the deal. First of all, the '99 has no dog bone, so you would think it would be a lot easier to get to right? Well its not, there's a lot more plastic shroud in the way. The tensioner might be able to be removed, but on the top of what appears to be the thermostat housing (largest red circle in picture #2) where yours appears to have two bolts going through, on mine these are two nuts that hold the shroud in place. The nuts are on two small studs that pass through the housing and these two studs (possibly more) go through to the mounting plate that hold the tesioner in place. The studs are threaded into the tesioner mounting plate. The tricky part is that the studs only have little protrusions on the end of the threaded parts.....a little "nipple" of steel that you MIGHT be able to get some vice grips to latch on to. Has anyone ever removed these studs? They might not be too tight, being locked in place by the nuts that hold the shroud on, but they don't appear to be intended for removal.......at least not with any normal tool. I suppose the old "two nut lock" trick might work. Just take the two nuts that hold the shroud on, and thread them both onto a stud and lock them together with a little torque. That way a wrench can be used to turn the stud out. Yes, if the studs came out, the tensioner would most likely come off and you might be able to get the belt off then. The studs that retain the WP belt tensioner are removed from the opposite side - The nuts that are on the studs between the guard and the tensioner are part of the studs. A 10mm deep socket will remove the studs from the tensioner assembly. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyG Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 The studs that retain the WP belt tensioner are removed from the opposite side - The nuts that are on the studs between the guard and the tensioner are part of the studs. A 10mm deep socket will remove the studs from the tensioner assembly OK, this looks right. There are two other "nuts" that appear to be part of the studs that, when removed, should remove the belt tensioner. They are under the first couple of nuts that hold the shroud in place and are difficult to see. I didn't pull the studs for fear that they would loosen a seal or something in the thermostat housing, but it appears that thir only function is to hold the belt tensioner in place. Thanks! Never underestimate the amount of a persons greed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 The studs that retain the WP belt tensioner are removed from the opposite side - The nuts that are on the studs between the guard and the tensioner are part of the studs. A 10mm deep socket will remove the studs from the tensioner assembly OK, this looks right. There are two other "nuts" that appear to be part of the studs that, when removed, should remove the belt tensioner. They are under the first couple of nuts that hold the shroud in place and are difficult to see. I didn't pull the studs for fear that they would loosen a seal or something in the thermostat housing, but it appears that thir only function is to hold the belt tensioner in place. Thanks! That is correct Johnny. You can remove those they hold the tensioner in place. I thought that was an interesting way to accomplish two tasks by GM Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soul strife Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Great information guys! Lot's of information on this site. I am "searching" this place to death. Thanks for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Should the tensioner be replaced as well, mines squeaking on the passenger side, I thought I read that it was a cheap part and should be replaced?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Should the tensioner be replaced as well, mines squeaking on the passenger side, I thought I read that it was a cheap part and should be replaced?? Well squeaking at the pivot might be solved by lubricating the pivot point, if you are squeaking at the pulley, replace it ASAP, the pulley bearings can self destruct and the pulley run out of line and throw the belt. Release the belt pressure and feel the pulley for looseness and roughness. Also, there is an idler wheel that can also get noisy and it can also through a belt. I have replaced both on my 96 A new tensioner is about $55. Here is an illustration of the area, the tensioner is #6, the idler wheel is to the lower right of the tensioner standing by itself Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soul strife Posted March 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 S-belt is replace but, I do not see how to get the water pump belt off. I can move the tensioner but, how can you get the belt off. The water pump is in the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Should the tensioner be replaced as well, mines squeaking on the passenger side, I thought I read that it was a cheap part and should be replaced?? Remove the tensioner, two bolts hold it, the bolts have a dual purpose, they also hold the belt shroud Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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