kcd1184 Posted September 15, 2004 Report Share Posted September 15, 2004 My 94 Eldo (96,000) started making a whistling noise about a week ago. I sort of blew it off because it was almost imperceptible but now it is full blown. It is a high pitch whistle that seems to be coming from the driver side end of the motor, in the corner area towards the firewall. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to proceed in tracking this down. This motor does not have the decorative cover to remove. There are no codes at this time, and performance has not been affected as of yet. It also drops a little bit in pitch when I shift from park into gear. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 16, 2004 Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 Sounds like a vacuum leak, I would just get my head in there an listen for where its coming from. Although, if you do have a vacuum leak I believe your idle would be a little rough.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 I have been listening and looking quite a bit. I believe the intake manifold needs to be removed for access to the back area and I'm not sure of the process.(or if I need to go that route yet) Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67coupedeville Posted September 16, 2004 Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 I would try making sure you air box and all the hoses from the air box to the engine is all tight and free of cracks. If there is a slight crack or hole or just the cover is not all the way on, it would make for a hell of a whistling noise...just a suggestion . Spence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 Went out this morning so the motor would be cold and tried feeling around for the leak. Can't locate it , not sure what I'm looking for. It seems even louder than yesterday, almost like a small teapot. You would think that with that much noise, you would be able to pinpoint it, but sounds are funny under the hood. Could there be a leak involving the phenolic spacer plates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jschunke Posted September 16, 2004 Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 Get an arms length of 3/8" fuel line, put one end to your ear and snoop around with the other hose end. That's the best way to pinpoint a source of noise. Don't bother with a mechanic's stethoscope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfoo Posted September 16, 2004 Report Share Posted September 16, 2004 Uh.. does the noise change when you rev the engine? (in park or neutral) During WOT on the road does it go away? Give us some more into and maybe we can help pinpoint it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 17, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 I'm out trying to track down the whistle and and all of a sudden it changes pitch and velocity and stops. Like a one breath whistle calling your dog. I drove the car and it came back, but I believe it must be some kind of vacuum controled mechanism that is not working properly and is causing the whistle. (instead of an actual line leak) What is in there that is air controlled that i can check? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 17, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 I'm still trying to locate the whistling noise. If I put it in drive and give it some fuel, the whistle drops in pitch a little, which would mean the air volumn is decreased? Does that help anyone more in giving me a clue? It still quits whistling every once in a while. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 17, 2004 Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 Are you sure its vacuum and not a whine, like a power steering pump or an alternator bearing? Where exactly is it coming from? I think you said in front of the driver? Could it be a vacuum leak near the power booster for the brakes, there is a plastic metering valve there that can crack and whistle, it could be the booster. It sounds like a crack somewhere. Spritz the area with water without soaking electrics and see if you can make it go away or change. Diagnosing noises is hard here. Do you have a digital recorder, record the noise and email it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 17, 2004 Report Share Posted September 17, 2004 The more I think about this, maybe its your tranny whining? Trannys can make a high pitched whine that changes pitch. Check the fluid. Put it in gear with your foot on the brake and give it a little gas does it change? Is it a muffler leak? Could it be your blower motor, scaping debris?, that would change pitch also as the temp requirments changed. Have you taken the engine cover off and looked for cracked vacuum hoses? Again noises are hard to diagnose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 18, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2004 Where exactly is the power booster for the brakes. When I drive and give it some fuel, the whistle pitch decreases a little. Also when you turn the motor off, the pitch goes from high to low.(1 second) Similar to when you let off a big diesel motor after you get into it and the turbo slows down. I don't believe it is the tranny or exhaust. Are there any mechanisms on the lower backside of the motor, air related? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 18, 2004 Report Share Posted September 18, 2004 Well it sounds more like vacuum, and its beginning to sound like stored vacuum as you described that is kind of lags when you turn the key off. The booster is behind the brake master cylinder, you will see about a 5/8 inch vacuum hose attached to it, listen around there. Its rare for the booster to go. I will look in my manual and see if there are any vacuum 'tanks' for the HVAC system and get back later. Did you take the shroud off and look at the vacuum hoses? Also, someone mentioned the air filter box, open it up and look it over for leaks and cracks, make sure the covvection from the air box to the TB are tight. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 I have had a couple of different people, with no prompting, decide that the whistle is coming up from the area between the coil packs and the master cylinder. That's what I thought to but still you can't be sure with sound. I just can't imagine that whatever is causing this loud whistle isn't setting any codes or affecting performance. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 19, 2004 Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 As I expected there is a vacuum reserve tank under the car that looks like a small oxygen tank, if that tank is cracked I believe you would hear the noise you are hearing. I also believe however that you should be having HVAC problems unless the crack is so small that its not depleting the vacuum supply fast enough and just making noise. Since you are not experiencing any major idle problems or HVAC problems a small crack or cracked hose may be your problem. Turn off the AC next time and make sure the blower is off and see if it changes, put the AC controls through a bunch of different commands and see if it changes, defrost, recirc, hi, low, off. Hopefully you are getting close. Don't forget to take the engine cover off and look around for a vacuum hose crack. C50 I believe is a heated windshield option in the photo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 Whistle not affected by any cold or hot functions(heat or air). I am using a tube to try and locate noise location. What would you say if I said I think it might have something to do with the EGR piece? Or at least close to that location. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 19, 2004 Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 Whistle not affected by any cold or hot functions(heat or air). I am using a tube to try and locate noise location. What would you say if I said I think it might have something to do with the EGR piece? Or at least close to that location. Kent That is interesting. You said no codes so if you had a bad EGR it would set a code, so maybe it could be the EGR gasket, sucking air, but you should be having drivability problems i think as you would be losing vacuum but again maybe its slight. I hope bbobynski chimes in on this one. I still would look at all your vacuum hoses you may have to manipulate them to find the break or crack.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 In this continuing saga, I unplugged the EGR and it made no difference. It was making such a loud whistle, the wife shut the garage door. I went back to the listening tube and I thought maybe it was coming from a vacuum connection (straight through with a small feed on top) under the intake ,on the firewall side, about 5 inches away from the EGR. I thought it was changing pitch as I moved it with a screwdriver, and then the darn thing stopped. You can't reach it with your fingers, it's tucked just under the corner of the intake. I have restarted the engine twice and the whistle starts up just a little and then abruptly stops. (like taking the last sip of a milkshake with a straw) I'll drive it in a little while and see what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 OK, the whistle is back. I'm going to switch gears here and because of some more thorough listening, ask if it is feasible for the sound I am getting to be coming from where the throttle body ,upper seal and spacer meet? From the manual and loking at the motor, what I'm seeing is this: Intake manifold top--gasket-- throttle body-- gasket(seal)--spacer--gasket(seal) Is this correct? When I'm listening to the vacuum connection,location described earlier, and move about two inches left to the area where the throttle body sits on the gasket and spacer, it sounds like that is where it is originating at. I know I keep changing spots but I think this might be it. If this is possible , what is the solution? Is this common? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted September 19, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 19, 2004 That is the spot! I can poke it, the seals,(are they rubber?) and make the whistle change. If I do it just right, the leak seals. Do you think it would hurt to put some kind of gasket seal on the outside spot to see if it will plug the leak until I have time to go in full bore? Is the leak damaging anything now? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 20, 2004 Report Share Posted September 20, 2004 maybe you should just go to caddy and buy a new throttle body gasket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDK Posted September 20, 2004 Report Share Posted September 20, 2004 I do agree with Scotty in getting a new gasket and I think you also plan that "full bore" repair job. However, for a while, I think some silicone-seal on the outside might suffice. Let dry well and leave enough on the outside - so the small part in the hole can not get sucked in. If the leak is large enough, there may be a slight problem with the engine getting too much air bypassed the normal throttle plate and controls, such that it does not measure and compensate the airflow properly. Good luck Add power to leave problems behind. Most braking is just - poor planning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted September 20, 2004 Report Share Posted September 20, 2004 If I had a diagram of the area I would post if but my manual does not show the TB area. If you go to the dealer, he can print out the area and show you what gaskets are available. I know of two gaskets, the TB gasket and the rubber o-ring gasket that goes between the MAF collar and the TB that the air intake connects to with a clamp that looks like a hose clamp. You have a 94 so I am assuming it looks much like the 96 but I could be mistaken. good luck, let us know if you nail it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike5514 Posted September 20, 2004 Report Share Posted September 20, 2004 If you do use silicone use sensor safe. mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regis Posted September 20, 2004 Report Share Posted September 20, 2004 maybe you should just go to caddy and buy a new throttle body gasket Other then the whistle your caddy sounds like it runs fine. Just have your shop put a new one in or do it yourself. Gaskets are relatively cheap and since you'll be in that area check all 3. Unless there is a tear the gaskets are reuseable if I'm not mistaken. Glad you were able to locate the problem. I was following this string to see where it would go. My guess was a tear in the gasket under the cover, near the firewall. Not too far off but it could've been anywhere. -kg "Burns" rubber " I've never considered myself to be all that conservative, but it seems the more liberal some people get the more conservative I become. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.