Motor Swap

[chazglenn3]

So, I have tracked down a company that sells remanufactured Northstar engines for $2500 and they include a 3 year unlimited mile warranty. They also Timesert the motors during the process. I called a few Cadillac dealers in my area and the lowest quote I have so far to R&R the motor is $1500. Should I continue to plan to have the work done at a Caddy dealer, or should I look into some independent repair shops? I am concerned that the N* is different enought to require some experience in doing the job. Here is the text from the ad:

Custom Innovations has been specializing in Cadillac Northstar engines for years. We have used them in our own projects ranging from dune buggies to Fieros, with horsepower outputs from stock to 700hp! We are proud to offer completely remanufactured Northstar engines, with warrantees! This particular auction is for the VIN 9, 300 hp version years 93-99. What you will receive is a COMPLETE LONGBLOCK, including remanufactured heads, valve covers, harmonic balancer, and spark plugs. We guarantee you will not be dissatisfied with your new engine! When considering the cost of a new Caddie, WHY NOT make that Eldo, Seville or Deville run LIKE NEW again!!!

The most common cause of failure on these engines are head gaskets, due to pulled head bolt threads. We 'Timesert' (drill, tap, and install an alloy thread insert) every engine drastically reducing the fear of the threads pulling out ever again!

Our engines include the following new parts

Main and Rod Bearings

Piston Rings

Timing Components

Oil Pump

Overhaul Gasket Set including valve seals

Oversized pistons.

Quality Brand Name Parts

Clevite

Hastings

Sealed Power

Silvolite

TRW

Melling

Victor

Felpro

Remanufacturing Includes

Block Bore as necessary

Remanufactured crankshaft

Connecting Rods Reconditioned

Cylinder Heads Completely Reconditioned

Timesert cylinder head bolt threads

Warranty Information:

Custom Innovations warrants to the original retail purchaser for the time of 36 months from the date of purchase, that it will repair or replace, at its option, using new or remanufactured parts, this GM engine or partial engine, including partial engines in kits, that fail due to defect in material or workmanship. Coverage is for the cost of the parts and the labor to repair the engine.

Not covered under warranty:

Damage due to improper installation, negligence, alteration, accident,

or use for which the unit was not designed or approved by General Motors,

including, but not limited to, improper use, or any use other than a vehicle

it was designed for, or any use related to racing or competition. Proper

vehicle use is discussed in the vehicle Owner’s Manual. In addition,

coverage does not apply if the odometer has been disconnected or the mileage

reading has been altered.

Damage caused by lack of proper maintenance as described in the vehicle’s

original Owner’s Manual/Maintenance Schedule, failure to follow Maintenance

Schedule intervals, or failure to use or maintain proper type and levels

of fluid, fuel, oil, and lubricants recommended in the Owner’s Manual/Maintenance

Schedule. Proof of proper maintenance is the owner’s responsibility.

Keep all receipts and be prepared to make them available if questions arise about maintenance.

Damage as a result of overheating, contamination or lack of lubrication.

Loss of time, inconvenience, loss of use, or other economic loss.

Vehicles registered and normally operated outside of the United States.

This warranty does not apply to any unit installed under the General Motors

New-Vehicle Warranty.

$300 core charge required. This will be refunded within 48 hours of receipt of the core. Custom Innovations agrees to pay for shipping costs of the core return, but it must be palleted by you. Reuseable ratchet straps will be used to secure the new engine, which will aid you in palleting the old.

Charles

[Ranger]

Not covered under warranty:

Damage due to improper installation,

This clause may determine where you have it done. The Northstar is different enough to require some expirience when working on it, but I would not think instalation requires any more expertise than any other engine. I would get clarification on instaltion from the supplier before making a dicission. What is the price difference?

[chazglenn3]

Not sure yet...I have only spoken with 3 Cadillac dealers...2 said a little over $2000 and 1 was $1500. I have an aquaintance that works in a shop, and I plan to check with him.

Charles

[Cadillac Jim]

The price for a Northstar R&R is $1500 to $1600. I would ask the rebuilder where you should take it and choose from his list to avoid the "improper installation" clause.

[chazglenn3]

Thanks, Jim. The rebuilder is in Illinois and I am in Washington state, so I kinda doubt that they know of any installers in my neck of the woods, but it won't hurt to ask. The Caddy dealer quoted me 20 hours at $100 per. My friend said 20 hours at $80 per, but was reluctant to work with an unknown rebuilder to him. He suggested Jasper, but their motors are a lot more money.

Charles

[Cadillac Jim]

If your rebilder is doing Northstars for $2500 with full warranty, he will have installers that he has had good luck with in Seattle and Spokane. I woud research the rebuilder on the WWW and elsewhere if not; it's possible that he hasn't been doing business nationally for very long.

The price of $2500 indicates that these are rebuilt engines, not remanufactured engines. Any engine rebuilder can rebuild a Northstar. How reliable the product is can be dicey. Most dealers report mixed results with Timesert jobs, for example. It takes a stripped, clean egine in a clean environment and good equipment to do the machine work such as Timesert jobs with 100% reliability.

Find out everything you can, including at least two or three other customers that have Northstars from this rebuilder. If his results look good, check out his warranty, and possibly his record, if any, with warranty and legal issues in Washington State (check with Washington State's consumer affairs department). Then you will know that if the engine has problems then you will have the warranty.