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Need help with 4.9 L 1991 Fleetwood


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Hi Everyone,

I have a 1991 Fleetwood, the normal edition (as opposed to the Special or Brougham), that has a 4.9L v8. It has about 80,000 Miles on it.

I recently took the car in to a Cadillac/GM dealership because the car was shaking a lot when I am on idle and while driving. Sometimes when I step on the gas pedal, at a certain speed (perhaps at a certain gear?) the car would shake. By "shake" I mean something like a strong jiggle or even repetitive jolting, something you can feel at the wheel. I apologize for my lack of car terminology.

My history with this problem is that I took it lightly. I was more focused on my serious oil leak and I thought that repeated injector cleaning would eventually iron out the roughness.

Unfortunately, the cleaners didn't work. To bring this back to the car dealership, they told me I need a tune up and new fuel injectors. They told me this would cost about $3,000 to fix -- half of it is labor costs.

I came across Caddyinfo.com and read the article about swapping/changing fuel injectors on a 4.9L v8. Reading the article gave me some hope because I was ready to just give up on the car.

I am here today to ask anyone who might see my message about what I should do, and where is the best/cheapest place to buy fuel injectors for my car. The article on this site also mentioned that I can get a set of 8 TPI 19LB Camaro 305 ci fuel injectors for $200. Does anyone have any opinions on this manuever, or know where is the best place to find the Camaro injectors?

Thanks to anyone who can help,

bests,

roger

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Hi, and Welcome.

I changed the injectors on my 1992 STS with the same 4.9L OHV V8 with 19 lb injectors I got from Summit Racing for around $200 for all 8. I didn't write it into the article but I think that these are the ones I used: p/n FMS-M-9593-C302

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.a...15&autoview=skuThe fuel trim values looked fine afterwards; they were a direct replacement. I changed the injectors in the driveway myself. Be careful when you relieve the pressure on the fuel system, and you need to have a way to safely drain the fuel from the fuel rail. Otherwise it was not all that hard. You will probably want the service manual just in case; a 92 manual can often be found on Ebay for $50 or so.

Bruce

2016 Cadillac ATS-V gray/black

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Others had a good luck with Bosh 19 lb injectors taken from Crown Vic's or Lincolns. You can try to get a set of eight from http://www.fiveomotorsport.com/ for about $250.00 As Bruce indicated it's a DIY work.

It would not hurt to get possible trouble codes. Just turn th eignition ON and press Warmer and Off simultaneously untill codes show up on the driver info center. Write down any codes you find. Turn the ignition off when you are done.

Forget the stealership...$3.000 for injector swap...oh well.

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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Hello,

Wow, thanks for the replies. I will try to get a look at those codes and find a good DYI manual! I hear the Haynes (spelling?) ones are pretty good. Thanks for the weblinks too!

You better get a factory service manual (FSM) on ebay for some $10-20. I see them there all the time.

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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It could be the repeated applications of injector cleaner ruined one or more injectors but it is hard to say. Any stored trouble codes will point you in the right direction. Proper troubleshooting will keep you from replacing good parts. The factory shop manual outlines the method of testing the injectors if the troubleshooting points in that direction.

Forget about a Haynes or Chiltons manual - they are just about useless. The factory shop manual is the only one to buy and it will pay for itself the very first time you use it to fix a problem. As others have said, $3000 is a total ripoff to replace injectors and "tune the engine up".

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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Hey Everyone,

I finally got my FSM for the car, and I was wondering where is the best place to buy an EGR solenoid and EGR valve? The reason I am asking because, besides the tune up and replacement of injectors, I forgot there was a mention of an EGR solenoid and valve replacement. I'm not even sure if it is necessary to replace those or were the guys at the dealer just trying to get more money out of me. I am about to order a set of injectors for about 200!! So much cheaper than what the dealer quoted ($1134.48, and that is without labor).

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Your dealer may be competitive on the EGR valve, but I would only replace that if it was having a problem. I would also check with gmotors.com and see what their price on it is.

Bruce

2016 Cadillac ATS-V gray/black

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Hey Everyone,

I finally got my FSM for the car, and I was wondering where is the best place to buy an EGR solenoid and EGR valve? The reason I am asking because, besides the tune up and replacement of injectors, I forgot there was a mention of an EGR solenoid and valve replacement. I'm not even sure if it is necessary to replace those or were the guys at the dealer just trying to get more money out of me. I am about to order a set of injectors for about 200!! So much cheaper than what the dealer quoted ($1134.48, and that is without labor).

Solve problems one at a time. Injectors first.

As for EGR valve the cheapest place to get OEM one is from gmpartsdirect.com (some $55). It will take two weeks to have it shipped though.

Do you have knock at light throttle (driving around a block) when engine is hot? This might be caused by bad EGR valve/solenoid, as well as clogged EGR tubes (inside Throttle body) or cracked /missing vacuum lines. Check out the condition of your throttle body (TB) and two tubes you can see under the throttle plates (use a flashlight). Clean them with some carb cleaner and a stiff wire. Do not worry about chunks of carbon falling down.

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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Before you do anything with the engine or spend any more money, tell us what's with this "serious oil leak" you mentioned?

As for the injectors, I took my 1993 Deville to a local shop to get the Fuel Pressure Regulator (FPR) replaced. Turns out there was nothing wrong with it, but I saw them loosen and partially remove the entire fuel rail which includes the injectors. The rail and injectors came up as one assembly. It took no time at all. Granted, they didn't completely remove the fuel rail from the engine, but it goes to show that removing the injectors might not be a real big deal.

I also remember reading in my FSM that if you remove an injector, you NEED to replace the o-ring. FYI.

Now that you have your FSM (you'll find it's a fun read), please post the codes here. We'd be interested to see what's wrong with your car.

2003 Seville STS 43k miles with the Bose Sound, Navigation System, HID Headlamps, and MagneRide

1993 DeVille. Looks great inside and out! 298k miles!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi Everyone,

I want to first thank everyone on this forum for their knowledge, know-how, and help. I wasn't able to change the injectors myself, but I was able to find a good (with a good reputation) and cheap mechanic to do it for me.

Here is my update:

I got my Cadillac back, and it is running smooth again! I bought the camaro injectors from summitracing for $200, and the labor to put them in was $150. But it wasn't that quick and easy. He (the mechanic) discovered that the last person who performed a tuneup on my car didn't tie up my wires, gave me a cheap cap&rotor, and that messed up everything else. He also said not all of my injectors were bad, some were leaky, and it was better to replace them all anyway. The wires that weren't tied up were the ones that run to the back. He said my engine burnt the wires apart and my engine was misfiring all over the place.

So in addition to the $150 for putting in the new injectors, he charged me an additional 240 for Tune-up plus cap and rotor (parts + labor).

The car runs fine now, but he told me the last thing I need to do is to replace something called the "Cam Sensor." One of the replies to this thread asked me about my error codes. I never got the chance to reply, but there was a whole list of them! The only error code left now is "41" -- the cam sensor (I didn't look it up yet, but the mechanic says that is what it refers to).

I also got a new muffler because there was a hole in it ($75)

I bought the ERG selenoid and valve from gmotors.com, but it's taking a long time to arrive, and the tracking code doesn't work! I'll give it a couple more days before I call gmotors.com. My car seems fine now, and my mechanic didn't say anything about replacing EGR selenoid and valve, so I might just keep the parts (it was cheap, less than $100) or return it.

About the "serious oil leak" another reply inquired about: I had a VERY bad engine oil leak. When I drove, the oil would drip to the catalytic converter and cause a lot of smoke. I was putting in oil every two weeks. I took it to a local mechanic and he couldn't tell where it was coming from and didn't feel like taking the time to fix it. It took me a while to get this fixed because I was really down on cash and was in between jobs. When I finally had extra money to spend, I decided to take it to the dealer and they fixed it. It turns out (among other minor gasket leaks) there was this line in the back that had a broken o-ring, and that was causing the puddle of oil and non-stop dripping I saw.

Oh, I almost forgot. I noticed every now and then when I start the car up, there would be some stuttering (like coughing) for a few seconds when I step on the gas. But this would go away if I turn the car off and start it again. My mechanic says this is the Error Code 41 (cam sensor).

The cadillac ride is so smooth, don't feel like I'm driving offroad and don't sound like a helicopter anymore! Only 80,000 miles, I am definitely going to take even better care of it!

Thanks everyone @ Caddyinfo.com =)

the muffler was a "heavy duty" one, normally for $100.00, but he gave me a discount on it.

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