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Coolant loss


Spurlee

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I disagree, the 4.1 was the prototype of the 4.9 and yes it did have problems as the computer systems were not as modern and reliable. The 4.1 was an aluminum block with cast iron heads and developed little horsepower.

As a matter of fact the 4.1 is listed as one of the worst engines of all time:

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/features/0408phr_worst/

The 4.9 is a work horse. Don't listen to mechanics assinine statements, mechanics can be some of the most opinionated people in the world. Just tell him to fix the SOB..

I just spoke with the mechanic, he said the 4.9 was known for occasional head gasket problems but he said he thinks that my car is actually experiencing an electrical problem, perhaps the fan is not coming on all the time. I explained to him that yesterday I did notice that when the fan came on it didn't sound right, sort of wimpy sounding, he thinks it might be the fan and he's going to let me know.

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Terrific, Good Luck, I'll keep my fingers crossed

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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Terrific, Good Luck, I'll keep my fingers crossed

Well yes, it could well be the fan causing the overheat, but what about the smell of antifreeze? I hope they find the leak if there is one.

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Terrific, Good Luck, I'll keep my fingers crossed

Well yes, it could well be the fan causing the overheat, but what about the smell of antifreeze? I hope they find the leak if there is one.

Marika, you may have two separate problems: fan plus leak. Besides, a bad fan can make the coolant boil and get out of surge tank. Ask them to pressure test even if the fan is bad.

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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Terrific, Good Luck, I'll keep my fingers crossed

Well yes, it could well be the fan causing the overheat, but what about the smell of antifreeze? I hope they find the leak if there is one.

Marika, you may have two separate problems: fan plus leak. Besides, a bad fan can make the coolant boil and get out of surge tank. Ask them to pressure test even if the fan is bad.

They would be pretty stupid and inept to not pressure test ..... oh god, help me, my heart can't take this :blink:

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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I REALLY hope that they do a good job, this will be a second STRIKE for them and their will be no third after the last debacle.

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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OK. I just dropped off the car at the "second opinion" mechanic. Everyone say a pray for the old greyhound and hope that it's nothing too serious.

By the way, driving there, no problems either.

They gave me a Toyota Camry loaner car. Oh Gosh!! I felt so vulnerable and terrified in that thing while I was driving home. :lol::lol:

One thing that the second opinion mechanic told me that no one else has ever said is that the 4.9 engine is a lemon, and that it's essentially a 4100, only larger. Oh dear. Well, I only authorized his work up to $250 so that would only diagnose the problem and not go beyond that. When I find out what's wrong, I'll take it from there. I'll have to borrow money to get it fixed.

Sounds like mechanic #2 doesn't know his a$$ from third base either..... Ask him what his opinion is of the 4.5 engine. If he trashes it as well, let him know that JD Powers rated it the most reliable engine after 10 years of service in a 1988 Sedan DeVille.

The 4.1 engine was not a bad engine - it was underpowered by today's standards as it was designed and developed during the fuel crunch of the late 1970s. One problem was owners not changing the coolant on a regular basis and not using the coolant supplement sealer (sound familiar???). The use of the supplement was mandatory in the 4.1/4.5/4.9 engines. The other problem was improper service techniques from mechanics - the HT4100 simply could not be worked on as if it were a small block Chevy engine but many mechanics did and when the repair failed, the 4100 engine got the blame.

My Dad had a 1985 Fleetwood Brougham with the HT-4100 engine and it had 190,000 miles on it when he sold it. The guy who bought it put at least 50,000 more miles on it. A buddy of mine had a 1984 Coupe DeVille and he sold it with 172,000 miles on it - neither car had to have any work done to the engine other than oil/coolant changes and ocassional spark plug changes. Another thing to consider is that if it were such a bad engine, it would not have lasted 6 years in the lineup....

The 4.9 engine was a stroked 4.5 and incorporated the latest gasketing technology.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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Just got off the phone with the mechanic. He's going to pressure test the cooling system but he really believes there's nothing leaking. He said I'm smelling antifreeze because a load of it splashed all over the engine when it blew out of the surge tank and it's burning off. I told him to humor me and just test the system for leaks just to be sure.

He thinks it's the fan and that its either not spinning or not spinning fast enough. He said this car's fan system has 3 separate relays and they all have to be tested. But he's really giving me the feeling that I shouldn't panic and he says there's nothing wrong with the engine as far as he can tell. I hope he's right.

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Just spoke with the mechanic. They can't find anything wrong. Whatever was causing it to overheat once in a while is not showing up now. :(

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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How soon after the water pump/tensioner job did it boil over? Its possible that the system was not stabilizing and was low in coolant causing the boil overs, just a thought

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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How soon after the water pump/tensioner job did it boil over? Its possible that the system was not stabilizing and was low in coolant causing the boil overs, just a thought

About 1 week or so later. I was stunned to say the least when it happened.

Just got the car back, the mechanic said he could find nothing wrong. No Leaks, nothing electrical either. If it happens again, I'll just take it back to him and hopefully by that time, whatever it is that's failing, will show it's ugly face finally. He had the car over 3 hours in the bay and yet he felt bad because he could not isolate the problem so he only charged me $75. I thanked him.

Edit: someday I'll learn how to write, and type, and button my shirt, and tie my shoes.....LOL!!!

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Well no news is good news. Its possible that the car was never stabilized from the water pump job, maybe the cap poppet valve stuck and didnt pull coolant in when the engine cooled and you had air in the system. That you lost heat was a clue that the coolant was low. Maybe the people that did the water pump messed up the coolant concentration, and when it boiled over putting more coolant in cured that... At least you dont seem to have any more problems

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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Well no news is good news. Its possible that the car was never stabilized from the water pump job, maybe the cap poppet valve stuck and didnt pull coolant in when the engine cooled and you had air in the system. That you lost heat was a clue that the coolant was low. Maybe the people that did the water pump messed up the coolant concentration, and when it boiled over putting more coolant in cured that... At least you dont seem to have any more problems

It of course also leaves me feeling a bit on edge. Murphy's Law seems to be very much a part of my life. Oh well, I guess in this case it's truly "wait and see". :(

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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yeah, it sounds like what i said earlier, the system wasn't bled thoroughly after the coolant change. if the system holds pressure, you should be fine.

one note about the smell of coolant inside the car: two winter seasons ago, i had the same problem with the coolant odor inside the car. it turned out i was the problem. i had been adding small amounts of coolant mix to keep the coolant at a specific level in the surge tank. stopped adding the mix and the smell was gone.

one tip i will pass on: when it's hot outside and i'm in a high temp condition, stuck in traffic or really hot weather, i leave the dic on the coolant temp setting and keep an eye on it. a little bit of insurance.

jackg

90 seville 100k

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One post it sounds exactly like a head gasket. The next, no where near it. Count your blessings, cross your fingers, keep an eye on it and be thankful that you found a mechanic who is honest and did not try to take advantage of you.

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One post it sounds exactly like a head gasket. The next, no where near it. Count your blessings, cross your fingers, keep an eye on it and be thankful that you found a mechanic who is honest and did not try to take advantage of you.

Yeah, the mechanic that I saw today was apparently honest. The previous one wanted to sell me a rebuilt engine for $5,500. There should be jail sentences for people like this.

I'll just keep an eye on the car, it's all I can do at this point.

How soon after the water pump/tensioner job did it boil over? Its possible that the system was not stabilizing and was low in coolant causing the boil overs, just a thought

About 1 week or so later. I was stunned to say the least when it happened.

Just got the car back, the mechanic said he could find nothing wrong. No Leaks, nothing electrical either. If it happens again, I'll just take it back to him and hopefully by that time, whatever it is that's failing, will show it's ugly face finally. He had the car over 3 hours in the bay and yet he felt bad because he could not isolate the problem so he only charged me $75. I thanked him.

Edit: someday I'll learn how to write, and type, and button my shirt, and tie my shoes.....LOL!!!

I think I'll buy a new radiator cap for that car, just to assure myself that it's new. Anyone know which one I have to get for that 4.9?

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Marika,

I bought my Seville 6 years ago with 77.000 miles on the clock in Clifton, NJ. Some parts were replaced by me. Nothing major. No mechanic ever touched my car! The maintenance costs me some 200-300 bucks per year including two sets of tires. Perhaps I could reduce maintenance costs skipping some replacements, but you know it is better to be safe than sorry. I buy only OEM parts and do all the job myself. From time to time I have to rent a hoist.

If nothing happens to tranny (the weakest part of 4.9 powertrain) I can double the current mileage since I take pretty good care of the car. THANKS TO ALL GREAT MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD! If not this forum I would most likely not enjoy my Cadillac for six trouble-free years.

Your car has a lot of life in her. You have done radiator hoses, tranny cooling lines, brake lines, a door lock, water pump... Some time down the road you will need to replace some suspension parts, radio, driver window motor, EGR valve, probably radiator, hub bearing.... and that's it. ENJOY!

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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Marika,

I bought my Seville 6 years ago with 77.000 miles on the clock in Clifton, NJ. Some parts were replaced by me. Nothing major. No mechanic ever touched my car! The maintenance costs me some 200-300 bucks per year including two sets of tires. Perhaps I could reduce maintenance costs skipping some replacements, but you know it is better to be safe than sorry. I buy only OEM parts and do all the job myself. From time to time I have to rent a hoist.

If nothing happens to tranny (the weakest part of 4.9 powertrain) I can double the current mileage since I take pretty good care of the car. THANKS TO ALL GREAT MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD! If not this forum I would most likely not enjoy my Cadillac for six trouble-free years.

Your car has a lot of life in her. You have done radiator hoses, tranny cooling lines, brake lines, a door lock, water pump... Some time down the road you will need to replace some suspension parts, radio, driver window motor, EGR valve, probably radiator, hub bearing.... and that's it. ENJOY!

I definately want to keep the car, there's no doubt about that. You forgot to mention the TWO driver side door locks, which I've done already and yes, the driver's side window motor was replaced as well already. :lol: One hub bearing was replaced when I first bought the car, the rest seem fine so far.

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Ok, it happened again this morning.

It was pretty cold last night and it was raining.

After starting the car this morning, I drove away. The temperature rose normally and I had heat starting at 106F. After about 8~10 minutes of driving, I noticed that the heat started to blow cold. I looked down at the temp gauge and it was rapidly rising, showing 234F. I pulled over and popped the hood and low and behold, the fan was roaring away under the hood trying desperately to cool the radiator. No such luck, the temp kept rising. I put my foot on the gas and gently raised the RPM's and BINGO, the temperature started to instantly drop but the heat was still not coming back. I put the car in drive and started moving, all the while watching the temperature gauge which was now showing 189F. As I was driving, I stepped on the gas again and low and behold the heat started to come up.

After this episode, the car ran normal again.

I'm convinced something is getting stuck or clogged and that the cold weather might have something to do with it.

HELP!!! If we solve this one guys, we will be the 21st century version of Sherlock Holmes. :lol::blink:

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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Marika, I would change the thermostat, maybe the one that was installed was defective or the wrong unit. This certainly sounds like a stat that is sticking. Mike

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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Marika, I would change the thermostat, maybe the one that was installed was defective or the wrong unit. This certainly sounds like a stat that is sticking. Mike

The same mechanic who told me I need a new engine is the same mechanic who installed that thermostat about 1 week ago. Are we starting to see a pattern here? I'm starting to think this guy is deliberately ripping me off.

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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OK, this morning she overheated again but this time it was stuck for good and I got the Engine Hot, Idle Engine message. I didn't get the "turn off the engine" message so I drove home, wasn't too far, and shut her off.

However, this time, something different happened. CODES!!!

Here they are:

E015 (History) Open Coolant Temperature Sensor

E073 (History) Intermittent Coolant Temperature Sensor Signal

E098 (History) P/N to D/R in ISC Range Problem

A050 (Current) HVAC - Coolant Temperature Too High

OK, guys, what am I looking at here??

If you really want to make people safe drivers again then simply remove all the safety features from cars. No more seat belts, ABS brakes, traction control, air bags or stability control. No more anything. You'll see how quickly people will slow down and once again learn to drive like "normal" humans.

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OK, this morning she overheated again but this time it was stuck for good and I got the Engine Hot, Idle Engine message. I didn't get the "turn off the engine" message so I drove home, wasn't too far, and shut her off.

However, this time, something different happened. CODES!!!

Here they are:

E015 (History) Open Coolant Temperature Sensor

E073 (History) Intermittent Coolant Temperature Sensor Signal

E098 (History) P/N to D/R in ISC Range Problem

A050 (Current) HVAC - Coolant Temperature Too High

OK, guys, what am I looking at here??

A bad coolant temperature sensor or a bad connection to one. As I recall, it is right on the thermostat housing.

Probably your mechanic disconnected it or something and did not connect properly.

If the ECM did not get correct data from the sensor, you would get a lot of problems including fans not turning on when needed. Try to reconnect the connector for now.

The saddest thing in life is wasted talent

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This is a good sign for the problems you are having. As Adallak stated have a look at the connector, the intermittant code came up, so it's either a bad connector or the coolant temp sensor is acting up... This is what Richters was looking for.

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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