Could GM be stupid?

[BodybyFisher]

Why do I see a Japanese car manufacturer hyping rainsense windshield wipers?

Yesterday, I was SO happy to see the heated wiper fluid hyped on the Buick.. but overall? Why doesn't GM point out what features and products it has in a spectacular way? Why don't I see them talk about their features?

Here is one that bothers me but how stupid is this? If GM decided, that it was MORE cost effective to NOT timesert the Northstar from the factory because it would last through the warranty, that is stuck on stupid! SO many more people see a Cadillac AFTER the initial owner! The NS has a reputation that the head-bolts pull. THAT fact is picked up by the general public and it hurts sales and hurts their reputation. What could it cost to do at the time of casting $100? This ENGINE needs timeserting from the factory! If you think I am being hard on GM here is a mechanic that works for caddy... shiden_kai (Ian), see what he has to say:

http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=1032&st=15

I feel the exact same way as Ian, here are his words:

No matter what anyone says, it's a bean counter decision to not have

timeserted the engines right from the factory. It's probably a

bit of a numbers game. What percentage will fail within the

warranty period?

My problem with that is that Cadillac stakes a large

percentage of their reputation on that engine, so why

not just go the extra mile and eliminate one weak

point on the engine.

The more you work on this engine, the more that

you see what a fine piece of machinery it is. A work

of art, really.

Another thing I would do if I were GM is put this incredible engine into EVERY kind of race it could. Put the NS into Nascar/Indy/F1 if you could! TELL the PUBLIC that the engine comes BULLET PROOF TIMESERTED and run the actual NS in endurance races, 24 hour races! And win! Both the 4.4 and 4.6. I would kick the worlds *smurf* in every race I could, with this engine. They are half-assed at promoting themselves and their great products! Why can a company like this > http://www.chrfab.com develop the NS to produce incredible power but GM does not for racing purposes? Take off the TUX GM and put on the overalls and boxing gloves, this is NO TIME to play it conservative! They need to promote themselves WAY better!

The race the CTS, but is it me or if you really didn't LOOK for it, would you know, that they raced? They should PUT that CTS thoughbred in their commecials...

[tjtjwdad]

No kiddin' about those rain sense wipers. You know until recent years Cadillac did piss poor marketing. Had I know about how good a Northstar Engine is I'd of bought one years ago. As it was it took a buddy of mine to point that out. The same goes for their innovations.

On the time-sert issue. Well, perception is a powerful thing. I agree with your reference that GM should just fix the darn time-sert issue and be done with it. Unless they need the repair work for revenue (Which I seriously doubt), which is then pedaled away by a lackluster reputation.

Jim

[BodybyFisher]

Unless they need the repair work for revenue (Which I seriously doubt), which is then pedaled away by a lackluster reputation.

Jim

I doubt they plan future repairs intentionally. But look at the PROBLEMS GM creates not ELIMINATING this problem from the factory for whatever it costs...

I recently said that the mechanic that does the major surgery at my local dealer (case halfs and head gaskets) is a malcontent and that he bad mouths the NS.... Here is shiden_kai again with a good explanation as to why! Totally eliminate the problems!

http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=2609&hl=

There is a good reason that tech's don't have good things to say about the Northstar. Most mechanics in dealerships work under the flat rate system. Once you understand how that works, the last thing that you want to be working on is the Northstar engine. In our dealership, I happen to be the only tech who can make better then straight time when working on these engines. This is under warranty times which are considerably less then "customer pay" times.

Even I, who can make money working on the Northstar engine, would rather not work on it. Here's why: I just did a re-ring on a 1999 Seville. It pays 18.3 hrs to do this job. I did it in 14.5 hrs...so I made 4 hrs on 18 hrs. But if I replace intake manifold gaskets on 3100 v-6 engines, I can make 3 hrs on 4.8 hrs. And it's a lot less wear and tear on the body.

GM wants people to think the Northstar is great engine? Might help if they started paying proper times so that we can do the job right while maintaining our paycheck. As soon as you start cutting into the paycheck, techs begin to resent this, and soon will do almost anything to avoid these types of jobs.

[jschunke]

Hype will only get you so far. For example,

when was the last time you saw Seiko advertise?

Answer: Never. But chances are everyone reading

this thread has had at least one. Sometimes

all you have to do is build a quality, refined,

durable product and the public will take notice.

Just saw that commercial myself and that Buick

sure does look refined. Can't wait to see the RWD

Buick, if they ever get around to it after upgrading

the SUVs.

[tjtjwdad]

Even I, who can make money working on the Northstar engine, would rather not work on it. Here's why: I just did a re-ring on a 1999 Seville. It pays 18.3 hrs to do this job. I did it in 14.5 hrs...so I made 4 hrs on 18 hrs. But if I replace intake manifold gaskets on 3100 v-6 engines, I can make 3 hrs on 4.8 hrs. And it's a lot less wear and tear on the body.

I never really thought about it. I work on semi-conductor equipment and get paid a flat hourly wage (O/T after 10 hours/40 hours week) rate wether I bust my hump (on a busy day) or sit around and sing Kumbayi (on a real slack day)

If the projects they're assigned affects their paycheck then I can certainly see his point. If that's the case I don't see why that would be a "GM" problem since dealers are independently owned.

Jim

[KHE]

I don't see why that would be a "GM" problem since dealers are independently owned.

Jim

Jim,

I think the tech was referring to warranty repairs - GM has a book rate for various repairs. When a dealership submits a claim to be reimbursed for warranty work GM pays the rate according the the schedule.

[tjtjwdad]

So it is a dealership bottom line issue I take it.

I took it as the tech's salary was affected by what ever work assignment he/she has. Hopefully the guy/gal who works on Northstars gets the same paid in the same mannes as the person who sweeps out the place.

Jim

[Ranger]

I took it as the tech's salary was affected by what ever work assignment he/she has.

Jim

It does. If it takes the mechanic 22 hrs. to do the job, he only gets paid for 18. If he does it in 14, he gets paid for 18 and moves on to another job while still getting paid for the last 4 hrs. That's how they make money, by beating the clock.

[tjtjwdad]

Interesting! No wonder that guy bad mouths Northstars (if there a PITA to work on) if your loosing money. I understand that is how the dealer charges for the repair(s), I was unaware that is how they paid the tech's.

How are unscheduled contingences taken into play? An example; a broken off stud, requiring drilling and re-tapping. Is this figured into the into the labor guide?

Jim

[BodybyFisher]

This has been a good discussion.

Why can't Cadillac sponsor racing that is very visible. A few years ago, I can remember my excitement when the Aurora engine was at Indy. Here is an interesting article. http://www.lubbockonline.com/news/052597/new.htm

Did the Aurora engine not do well at indy? According to this article engines at Indy are 4.0 liter engines, I wonder if that is why the 4.0 Aurora engine was built. I am aware that the engine used at Indy was day and night from the production version, but I am sure the basic concept was the same. Am I wrong?

Anyway, it would be the most amazing thing if a junior Northstar crossed the finish line, 1, 2 and 3 wouldn't it? That is building excitement. Chalk it up to Marketing. I would imagine it would be possible for the Northstar to fall flat on its face. So I guess it's better to leave risky things to Honda and Toyota:

http://www.indy500.com/news/story.php?story_id=5674

This hurts:

This will be the first Indianapolis 500 in which Penske Racing has used Honda engines. The team used Honda power in the 2000 and 2001 CART seasons, with retired Penske driver Gil de Ferran, the 2003 Indianapolis 500 winner, capturing the series title both years

“We’re thrilled to have Team Penske back in the Honda fold,” said Robert Clarke, president of Honda Performance Development. “With the departure of General Motors from the IndyCar Series, we had expected to expand our lineup in 2006, and adding Team Penske is certainly an impressive way to begin.”

I guess if they pulled Chevy out, they certainly won't put Northstar's in. I had forgotten that GM sponsored engines at Indy and Nascar. It must be tough to justify racing, with the bleeding that is taking place. This is worse than I thought! Congress is worried about baseball but the country is bleeding, who is going to stand up and level the playing field?

[tjtjwdad]

I guess if they pulled Chevy out, they certainly won't put Northstar's in. I had forgotten that GM sponsored engines at Indy and Nascar. It must be tough to justify racing, with the bleeding that is taking place.

This is worse than I thought! Congress is worried about baseball but the country is bleeding, who is going to stand up and level the playing field?

Mike,

I remember when the factories pulled out of NASCAR in 1971, and in came RJ Reynolds. I also remember the downward spiral of US cars for a long time. I feel the racing program has had a positive impact on the cars we drive and i would hate to see them pull out. I hope it doesn’t come to pass but it's almost like deja vu all over again with all the racket I'm hearing about these hybrids. Tell me it isn’t so!

As far as leveling the playing field, just once I wish politicians would put the country first instead of chasing votes in the caucus room. It's not just the auto industry that's in trouble; the airline industry isn’t much better and the semi-conductor industry is heading over seas.

I’m not an economist but the as I said the other day NAFTA, CAFTA & SCREWYA all mean pretty much the same with the changing of the American job market and our standard of living.

Jim