maydog Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Greetings, Today a nice couple purchased my 97 STS. I told them about all the work I have done in fixing things up and how road worthy it is. They asked about the trans and I said it was pretty much bulletproof. An hour later I get a call and they said the trans overheat message cam on and they stopped. They drove again after a few minuted and it came back. A third time the trans lost 4th gear. I am no jerk and agreed to take the car back to look at it. I met up with them, gave them back their money, took the title and limped it home in 3 going 45 on the interstate. I drove 30 miles without overheat. I tried to shift into 4th a few times, it would only engage downhill. As soon as the load was increased it would go back into third. I checked the trans fluid, it was full and did not smell burnt. There is a code 218 stored. I had replaced the radiator on the car a week ago and have only done short trips (15) since. What would happen if the trans cooler became plugged? Could this be the issue? Or does it sound like a shift solenoid thing? Please help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Couldn't tell you what your problem is....However something smells a little fishy....This happened an HOUR after they got the keys?......How long does it take to install a new Trans?..I would check and make sure the VIN on the trans. matches your car.....It does seems a little far fetched that someone would try and con you by buying your car, installing there old damaged tranny,then telling you something was wrong.... but stranger things have happened. In regards to the trans overheat message....When my tranny went south 3 things happened all at once....The "trans overheat" message came up, the SES light came on, and she made a mighty groan and shifted into second gear. The trans was waaay low on fluid (my fault) and that is why it overheated & failed. I pulled over and checked the fluid, it was smoking out of the top and smelled like it had been burned to death.....I did drain all of the fluid and re-fill it.....And it ran ok...but eventually got much worse in 3rd-4th gear....However the fluid never got burnt after the initial failure....Which makes me wonder..... A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Couldn't tell you what your problem is....However something smells a little fishy....This happened an HOUR after they got the keys?......How long does it take to install a new Trans?..I would check and make sure the VIN on the trans. matches your car.....It does seems a little far fetched that someone would try and con you by buying your car, installing there old damaged tranny,then telling you something was wrong.... but stranger things have happened. In regards to the trans overheat message....When my tranny went south 3 things happened all at once....The "trans overheat" message came up, the SES light came on, and she made a mighty groan and shifted into second gear. The trans was waaay low on fluid (my fault) and that is why it overheated & failed. I pulled over and checked the fluid, it was smoking out of the top and smelled like it had been burned to death.....I did drain all of the fluid and re-fill it.....And it ran ok...but eventually got much worse in 3rd-4th gear....However the fluid never got burnt after the initial failure....Which makes me wonder..... acklac7, The scenario with tranny swap sounds fantastic. First, I believe one should be kind of a bank robber to arange such thing within an hour, second they saw the owner knew his car very well so he would notice any change... The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted June 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 I dont suspect the trans swap theory, that would be really fast and I think that they spent most of the time limping the car back. I pulled all the codes today, they are: 218 - trans overheat 1552 1255 533 1552 1558 2476 Alldata does not have descriptions for all of them, any help here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 Maydog, Since you have just changed the radiator, my suspicions would be that the transmission oil cooler was plugged or restricted somehow. The loss of fourth gear makes me suspect that one of the solenoids failed due to the overheat condition. That is just a guess. If you have an air compressor, I would disconnect the transmission cooler lines and attempt to blow through the cooler in both directions. (This will be messy, but it may also remove what ever is plugging or restricting the cooler, if there is in fact a problem.) As an alternative, you could disconnect the top line, and while watching the cooler and the line, have someone momentarily start the car (for only a couple of seconds) while you watch to see if fluid comes out of the cooler. If I am correct the top line is the return, so oil should come out of the cooler fitting. If no oil comes out, then disconnect the bottom line and repeat the process. If you have oil then, it will prove that the cooler is plugged. Also look for a kinked or pinched cooler hose. Possibly you placed something in the cooler lines to keep dirt out while the radiator was out, & then forgot to remove it? (Been there, done that. ) I don't have a 97 manual, so I can't help on the codes. If anyone knows of someone who can R&R a 4T80-E in under an hour I will buy them a case of any beer that they desire! Good Luck, Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted June 26, 2005 Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 If anyone knows of someone who can R&R a 4T80-E in under an hour I will buy them a case of any beer that they desire! Ok...so it's going to take a little more than an hour to R&R a Tranny .....I did note that it was a little far fetched......But man that is some bad luck! A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted June 26, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2005 I have not gotten too far into the troubleshoot yet, but I did disconnect the top trans cooler line to measure the fitting. There was no trans fluid present? I do remember that when I was replaceing the radiator, that I started the engine for a few seconds without the top cooler line on - it was a slippery messy situation. I connected the hose and added some trans fluid ( I do not remember having to add that much.) Could it be possible that the pump is not primed? I am going to bypass the cooler for a minute or two and use some clear tubing to check for flow. Now I am also wondering about wether or not I jammed something into the bottom tube to keep it from making a mess. I plan on checking all this out tonight. I hope they did not fry the tranny. Thanks, I will keep you posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted tcb Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Hopefully its a shift solenoid at a cost of a few hundred. Rotten luck, but nice to see you had the integrity to reverse the deal. Not everyone would see it that way on a priveate sale. 1989 FWD Fleetwood, Silver 1995 STS Crimson Pearl on Black leather 1997 STS Diamond White 1999 STS Crimson Pearl 2001 STS Silver 2003 STS, Crimson Pearl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted June 27, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Well, after two minutes of inspection, I found the lower transaxle hose kinked. It had turned when I was tightening the connection. Flow is now restored, but the trans is fubar. It will not shift into fourth, shifts very slowly and slips badly under load. They must have beat the piss out of the car when it overheated, because I drove 30 miles at 45 miles an hour in 3rd gear with no overheat. The explanation they gave me yesterday was, "the overheat message came on and we pulled over, we tried a few times and finally we couldn't get into fourth gear." (rough quote) Now I am mad, yes I did a poor repair in installing the radiator and yes I was partially responsible for the problem - but I never would have fried the trans. Thanks for the support, I did feel sorry for them at the time. After thinking about the situation, I do not see how they couldn't have been abusing the car to get to the point of loosing a gear. Can this be fixed, do you think it is the trans mechanical parts or just solenoids? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 If anyone knows of someone who can R&R a 4T80-E in under an hour I will buy them a case of any beer that they desire! Yeah, I'd have to discard the tranny swap theory also, but stranger things have happened. Back in the '70s rental car agencies stopped renting "Muscle Cars" when they developed a bad habit of being returned with clunker motors under the hood. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topcat9pet Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 On some models the 218 code and the code for the T On some models the 218 code and the code for the TCC-761 I think, will disable 4th gear. Usually when the shift solenoids go, the transmission won't shift out of 1st gear and you're left with low and reverse. I just had a '96 Deville that wouldn't shiftout of first, installed a shift kit and now I get an ocassional overtemp warning and the 218 code, and sometimes the code for the TCCsolenoid stuck off. Sometimes I only get one code or the other and at other times I get both at the same time. The transmission works fine and does not show any signs of overheating. I'm going to change the transmission this coming week-tired of chasing the problems. Cleatus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 How do you like your trans? ...Well done? Here are a few pictures of the contents of the pan. Lots of debris in the corner and Melted plastic pieces in there as well. Is it even worthwhile to try to replace the solenoids? Do you think that I can get at least 2nd gear back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Hall Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Sorry to say but it looks pretty bad to me. It appears that the tranny has been severely over heated. All of that material on that one side of the pan is chunks of clutch material. If you were to take the tranny apart, you would find a clutch or two where all the frictional material has fallen off of the steel plate. Sorry for the bad news but most likely, it will need to be completely overhauled and likely some hard parts replaced due to loss of oiling. This is how the inside of the transmission pan of my Allante looked before I overhauled it. Loss of oiling was the the demise of that transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 If anyone is interested in a project car, please email or messenger me at maydog@hotmail.com. I can also be contacted via skype, username maydog. Here is part of my original Ad http://maydog.dyndns.org/www/www2/97sts/19...llacSeville.htm My Webpage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maydog Posted July 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2005 Well it is on ebay now http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAP...ssPageName=WDVW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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