Goodbye and Thanks

[newbold1]

Thank you Scotty! That was exactly my point and it really is what caused me to go another direction. Although the other problems were not serious they were a pain in the rear. Who wants to take a new car into the shop over and over again? I posted on this board my original comments regarding the differential problem on October 11, 2004. I bought the car in July 2004. So... for 4 months my car was doing pretty good. For 6 months I have had the chornic whining and a bunch of other annoying little problems that kept making me return to the dealer for warranty and/or recall work. When you are on a first name basis with every tech guy at the dealership it seems obvious that you are there a bit too often.

Randy_W --- Can you honestly say that you think I had no reason to finally be fed up? Would you really continue to be loyal to a car and/or brand if you paid $42K and then had the issues I had with my car? Through it all I never had cross words with the dealership and tried my best to work with them instead of against them. Everyone at the dealership was nice as could be but still I was getting no place. As far as being a Yuppie... the CTS was my first new car in years. In order to afford it I bought a 96 SLS used in 99 and then kept it until 2004 so I could finally trade it for a new car. Before my 96 SLS I drove a 93 Mazda Protege' which I kept for 6 years. SO please... give me a break. I am not accustomed to spending that kind of money and when I finally did it I really expected to be able to enjoy the car rather than continuously deal with problems. I really don't know why it even matters to you. What do you care what kind of car I buy? How does this affect you in the slightest? Also the BMW 330Ci has 225hp and does 0-60 in 6.9 seconds when using steptronic shifting and 7.5 seconds in automatic. That really isn't all that far off from what the 1993 - 1999 STS can do. I don't think that is half bad. But... what makes you think that I choose my cars based on speed anyway? Maybe that is important to you but to me that is only a secondary consideration. Go attack someone else because after this post I'm not going to bother to respond to your insults.

As far as my bragging on BMW... the jury is still out. I only have 400 miles on it at this point so its a bit early for me to know whether this car is any better or not. I am just happy with it so far. But then... who isn't thrilled during the first week after buying any new car? All I know is that there was no way that I was going to trade the CTS for another Cadillac because that would have been foolish. My wife would have thought I was nuts. I definately wasn't keeping the CTS any longer. Enough was enough... so I liked the BMW and went that way. No offense to anyone... I just thought I would like it and I just couldn't bring myself to buy another Cadillac right now.

Jadcock --- I also liked the depreciation on the Cadillacs because I usually buy used too. But, I really wanted a new car with a warranty and in that case the depreciation on the Caddy is rough. I knew that going into it but I liked Cadillac so much that I was willing to lose the money on the depreciation in order to have a nice new CTS. But, of course, I won't do that twice in a row.

[Randy_W]

Randy_W --- Can you honestly say that you think I had no reason to finally be fed up? Would you really continue to be loyal to a car and/or brand if you paid $42K and then had the issues I had with my car? Through it all I never had cross words with the dealership and tried my best to work with them instead of against them. Everyone at the dealership was nice as could be but still I was getting no place. As far as being a Yuppie... the CTS was my first new car in years. In order to afford it I bought a 96 SLS used in 99 and then kept it until 2004 so I could finally trade it for a new car. Before my 96 SLS I drove a 93 Mazda Protege' which I kept for 6 years. SO please... give me a break. I am not accustomed to spending that kind of money and when I finally did it I really expected to be able to enjoy the car rather than continuously deal with problems. I really don't know why it even matters to you. What do you care what kind of car I buy? How does this affect you in the slightest? Also the BMW 330Ci has 225hp and does 0-60 in 6.9 seconds when using steptronic shifting and 7.5 seconds in automatic. That really isn't all that far off from what the 1993 - 1999 STS can do. I don't think that is half bad. But... what makes you think that I choose my cars based on speed anyway? Maybe that is important to you but to me that is only a secondary consideration. Go attack someone else because after this post I'm not going to bother to respond to your insults.

It looks like they appreciate your Caddy bashing over at BMWBOARD a lot more than the Caddy forums do, you appear to be right at home there! Don't let the door hit ya, where the good Lord split ya. Shnell!

[JasonA]

Jadcock --- I also liked the depreciation on the Cadillacs because I usually buy used too. But, I really wanted a new car with a warranty and in that case the depreciation on the Caddy is rough. I knew that going into it but I liked Cadillac so much that I was willing to lose the money on the depreciation in order to have a nice new CTS. But, of course, I won't do that twice in a row.

It's interesting...a coworker recently purchased a Ford F-150 new (it was about a year ago I guess). He's wanting to trade it on a Honda Element for gas mileage. Problem is, only a year into his purchase, he owes more on the truck than the trade value is worth!

Don't let the comments from some speak for everyone here. I'm sure most of us wish you well in your new endeavor, Cadillac or otherwise. I do. It's sad to see someone getting treated like you have, but after my parents going through the same thing with their once-preferred Jeep brand, I understand how you feel. Come back an' see us sometime.

[Regis]

Don't let the comments from some speak for everyone here.  I'm sure most of us wish you well in your new endeavor, Cadillac or otherwise.  I do.  It's sad to see someone getting treated like you have, but after my parents going through the same thing with their once-preferred Jeep brand, I understand how you feel.  Come back an' see us sometime.

Nicely put Jason. I guess some people need to be smacked upside the head more than others to understand or appreciate why newbold1 made the decision he did. He's been nothing but a gentleman through his ordeal and if anyone has the "right" to bash Cadillac I suppose he does. But he hasn't (nothing unreasonable) and to his credit has made some positive comments. I tip my hat to him and ,as Jason said, would hope he visits us now and then.

[Oldgamer]

Good Luck newbold1. Visit us sometimes and give us honest report of your opinion about your new car .

Talking about reliability and depreciation: same as jadcock I like depreciation too (when I am a buyer ). Depreciation is a function of a lot of variables, and reliability just one of them.

People who work in a researching of a reliability know that the most of fails happened in a first months and then grow again just after years. That's why first buyer not just pays much more, but has more chance of trouble in a first year than buyer who bought a 2 years old car.

I bought my 94 car in 98 at Reedman, PA and it was like a brand new, with this leather smell and everything (47K at that time) and I bought it for less than half price. Frankly, I drive car not to often, now it just 70K, but still... I spent just $45 for new battery in 2002 and $75 for used PCM for all that time. I did changed front brake pads once. Of course I changed oil and coolant. Yes, I have now a couple of codes: one for RF wheel position sensor (and I think everybody had it ) and other for exhaust valve of air ride compressor. But car runs fine and I will take a time. A lot of depends of how we react for this kind of fails. I guess I have these codes for years. It's very possible that if I went to the dealer when I first noticed it (just because of having computer) I have had much more trouble now.

Computer is a *smurf* for GM and heaven for owners who like to care of car themselves.

I believe that if we didn't have computer with all these disturbing messages we believe our cars much more reliable.

[Scotty]

http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.p...highlight=330Ci

[ted tcb]

Reading the BMW posts, Newbold seems fair in his assesment of his CTS experience ... no bashing, just the facts in a concise manner.

The folks on the BMW board seem to be generous in their help and acceptance ... I really didn't see people jumping on the "bash the domestics" bandwagon. To be fair, they really go after a different clientale.

A very close friend used to manage Budd's BMW in Oakville. When he gave me a tour of his facility, I noticed the service bays were huge, well lit, and absolutely surgically clean.

I asked my friend what they were doing on a 7series, and he told me an oil service.

When I asked what's the diff between an oil service and oil change, he told me, " about a hundred bucks"

His opinion on cars was that USA cars didn't count for anything, Japanese cars were soft and mushy, Benz's were bloated old men's cars, and Audi's were VW's that wanted to grow up to be BMW's.

He now manages a Toyota store ... gotta love karma.

[Scotty]

I agree also, there was no bashing. Enthusiasm about having a new car is expected. He had some problems and its unfortunate. On the other hand Bruce has had two CTS's and has had no problems to speak of.

newbold1 seemed to be upset with the PCM recall and the other recalls but those things don't bother me, they are things that show up or develop in production models that need to be fixed or improved. Again, rather than make it a huge issue, GM should find a way to make serial recalls more palatable, but I guess safety recalls need to be done pronto.

I still think the dealer and GM could have been more responsive to his differential issue, loaner car, acknowledge the problem, replace it and inform the owner that its a temporary fix until the problem is isolated/fixed and we will replace it free of charge.... BEND OVER when something is wrong...

[JasonA]

A very close friend used to manage Budd's BMW in Oakville. When he gave me a tour of his facility, I noticed the service bays were huge, well lit, and absolutely surgically clean.

That reminds me of the best car dealership I've ever been to, Harvey's GM in Radford, VA. Their service department is wide open for everyone to see, the garage floor is completely clean and free of grease or oil, and the whole room is lit like a showroom. It seemed to be about 100 yards long, with probably 20 service bays, 10 on a side. It really was beautiful.

I contrast that to the Dodge/Chrysler dealerships I've recently had the displeasure of visiting (if you're interested, see here: http://forum.chryslerminivan.net/showthrea...7&page=1&pp=10). The service bays are virtually hidden from view, and there's a little yuppie "lounge" with coffee and donuts and a TV, etc. Fine for soccer moms who get screwed on oil changes every 3000 miles...what about someone who's actually interested in what's going on back there...or needs to verify the work of the technican because he or she can't properly install a tire?

I judge a dealership by the condition/availability of their service area. If you can't easily get to it, and it seems like they're trying to hide it, it may be for good reason.

[Scotty]

I judge a dealership by the condition/availability of their service area.  If you can't easily get to it, and it seems like they're trying to hide it, it may be for good reason.

Its funny you say that, next to the parts department at my local Caddy dealer, separate and apart from the main service area, is an area where they do major work, ie dropping out cradles, case half, head gaskets. Everytime I go there, I see Northstars in hundreds of pieces being worked on....

I suggested to the general manager that they move this location away from public view as its pretty scary to look at. On top of that the mechanics have a lousy attitude about the NS and make negative statements... I didnt think it was good for sales... ESPECIALLY of used vehicles....

[ted tcb]

A very close friend used to manage Budd's BMW in Oakville. When he gave me a tour of his facility, I noticed the service bays were huge, well lit, and absolutely surgically clean.

That reminds me of the best car dealership I've ever been to, Harvey's GM in Radford, VA. Their service department is wide open for everyone to see, the garage floor is completely clean and free of grease or oil, and the whole room is lit like a showroom. It seemed to be about 100 yards long, with probably 20 service bays, 10 on a side. It really was beautiful.

I contrast that to the Dodge/Chrysler dealerships I've recently had the displeasure of visiting (if you're interested, see here: http://forum.chryslerminivan.net/showthrea...7&page=1&pp=10). The service bays are virtually hidden from view, and there's a little yuppie "lounge" with coffee and donuts and a TV, etc. Fine for soccer moms who get screwed on oil changes every 3000 miles...what about someone who's actually interested in what's going on back there...or needs to verify the work of the technican because he or she can't properly install a tire?

I judge a dealership by the condition/availability of their service area. If you can't easily get to it, and it seems like they're trying to hide it, it may be for good reason.

Too bad ... you need to be forum member to view your thread.

[acklac7]

If you can't easily get to it, and it seems like they're trying to hide it, it may be for good reason.

Reminds me of the old Stealership...Not only was half the bay hidden....There was a HUGE sign hanging above the intrance (to the bay) that read something like " For legal reasons we can't allow anyone besides authorized Service technicians to go beyond this point".......Sure..."Legal Reasons"

[cdndeville]

Hey newbold1,

Good choice on the bimmer...very nice ride. I wouldnt keep it more than 5 years though if I were you. They start to develop general maintainance issues that do get costly.

The #1 rule in getting a Caddy is buying used, they are known for the fact that they are the best value for money. I would never blow $42K on a brand new Caddy, just wait 5-6 years and buy 1 of a granny with low miles for less than $10K.

Enjoy the new car and drive it like u stole it

[Randy_W]

BMW quality? http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16713

How about this? http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16730

http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16730

Bad wheel bearing at 5k! http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16675

This is the real quality!!! http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16071

Sounds just like what I hear about Cadillacs sometimes. I guess those Bimmers ain't so perfect, in fact I don't see any difference in the complaint dept. than I do on any other forum. That last link is a real honey! Check it out before you accuse me of bias.

[acklac7]

Good finds Randy ....As far as the interior goes there isn't much to complain about on my Caddy. Had to replace the rearview mirror, thats about it. Oh there is one interior problem that I have seen a number of times....But haven't heard much about (on this board) is the darn plastic retainer clip that locks the cupholders in place....Mine was broken when I bought, so was my buddy's....Anyone know if you can purchase just the clip?

[newbold1]

Thanks again everyone! I have no problem with Cadillac in general. The guys at the dealership seemed to really want to help me. The problem was that they had their hands tied by the District guy. Anyway, I thought I would try something else. And, the BMW seemed like a good choice. I realize that every make and model out there has its own fair share of problems. There is no "perfect" choice available. So far the BMW has been fun to drive, handles well, and it really does seem like an upgrade from the CTS. BUT... the CTS is almost $10K less too so it makes sense. The STS I test drove seemed very much on par with the BMW in terms of the interior quality and the quiteness / smoothness in driving. AND... go figure... they cost about the same.

In an effort to be honest I will say that during my trip to Atlanta something did happen that was distrubing. My sister and I took the car out later than night after I made it to Atlanta. I put the car into the "manual" Steptronic mode and was going pretty quick through the gears. Well... after we stopped to switch drivers the "service engine soon" light came on and the car seemed to be idling really rough. I shut the car off, turned it back on, and everything was fine again. It never happened again over the next 400 miles of driving. So... I am not sure what that was all about but it did freak me out. It was almost like the computer was somehow confused and had the timing all off. Restarting the engine seemed to reset everything. Never had that happen before.

Anyway, I am not sure what I did to set Randy W off so much. And, yes, I have started posting on the BMW Board. Of course, why wouldn't I do that? I like to participate with a group of people that have the car I drive. Its often a great help. I definately gained a great deal from being a participant of this board. I truly appreciate Bruce for maintaining this site over all the years. GM should be paying him for all that he does in support of Cadillac! Maybe my enthusiasm on the BMW Board was a bit much but hey... I have a new car and its always exciting in the beginning. I am surprised that Randy W bothered to hunt for my posts on the BMW Board. There aren't too many people that interest me enough to try so hard to try to discredit them. Geez...

I will let you know what happens with the BMW and if I start having trouble I won't try to conceal it in order to save face. But... I will try to limit my posts about the BMW because lets face it... this is a Caddy board. I wish all of you had a BMW as a second car because you all are a great group of people to chat with.

Listen, no hard feelings Randy W. I just wish I knew what I did to set you off so much. I'm really not the type of person that looks to flame others or to outright bash them. I wish you would give me a break and at least understand my point of view even if you don't happen to agree with it.

[msilva954]

Awsome car...we have a silver one...in the shop all the time...when your driving it you completely forget about those type of things though...but then it all goes bad...

lol dont mean to scare you, thats just BMW's

[Scotty]

Good Luck, Mike

[Chris]

But haven't heard much about (on this board) is the darn plastic retainer clip that locks the cupholders in place....Mine was broken when I bought, so was my buddy's....Anyone know if you can purchase just the clip?

I have the same problem... clip is broken but GM Dealer wants $130 for teh whole armrest assembly.

Good luck with the BMW, newbold1, my friend just got an M3 and it is darn fun to zip around in

[JasonA]

Maybe my enthusiasm on the BMW Board was a bit much but hey... I have a new car and its always exciting in the beginning.

Car boards are mostly populated, by definition, with enthusiasts of the brand. Seeing someone write in that they had trouble with another brand and are now switching to the marque the board supports is what they live for! They salivate over a new prospect. I wouldn't expect the enthusiasm here to be any different if someone wrote in with a post like, "my BMW kept giving me trouble and I had to ditch it for a Cadillac." I'm sure we'd exceed our allowed bandwidth then.

[Randy_W]

Listen, no hard feelings Randy W. I just wish I knew what I did to set you off so much. I'm really not the type of person that looks to flame others or to outright bash them. I wish you would give me a break and at least understand my point of view even if you don't happen to agree with it.

Newbold 1, I really didn't hunt you up. It was an accident, that I found you. I use BMWboard a lot to show people that BMW's are just cars like all the rest and have thier problems as well. I really wasn't after your person, just your choice in cars. I really hope you don't have major problems. Come back to the Caddy boards if something breaks so we can laugh at, er, I mean laugh with you!

[newbold1]

Thanks Randy W. You probably noticed in my earlier post that I did have a quick scare with the "service engine soon" light. It was very brief and didn't occur again the whole way home from Atlanta but it sure did freak me out. I was thinking... "here we go again". On the one hand I wonder what caused it. On the other hand I hope it doesn't happen again. Maybe I am just jinxed when it comes to cars.

[Scotty]

Thanks Randy W. You probably noticed in my earlier post that I did have a quick scare with the "service engine soon" light. It was very brief and didn't occur again the whole way home from Atlanta but it sure did freak me out. I was thinking... "here we go again". On the one hand I wonder what caused it. On the other hand I hope it doesn't happen again. Maybe I am just jinxed when it comes to cars.

Can you call up the codes on that BMW like the Caddy to see what code was set?

[msilva954]

Thanks Randy W.  You probably noticed in my earlier post that I did have a quick scare with the "service engine soon" light.  It was very brief and didn't occur again the whole way home from Atlanta but it sure did freak me out.  I was thinking... "here we go again".    On the one hand I wonder what caused it.  On the other hand I hope it doesn't happen again.  Maybe I am just jinxed when it comes to cars.   

Can you call up the codes on that BMW like the Caddy to see what code was set?

nope...and they charge 100 to reset the computer outa warrenty...lol sucks

[newbold1]

I would think that I could just hook up my EZ-Scan 4000 scan tool. The EZ-Scan 4000 is CAN-compliant and as on my CTS I would think that I could pull the codes with it. It was nice that on my 1996 SLS I could pull codes right off the car using the AC buttons. BUT... the 2004 CTS doesn't have that feature. So... I did some research, found this scan tool for a couple hundred bucks, and it seemed to do the trick. I haven't tried it on the BMW yet but probably will just to see if there is a code set in history. Seems like a fluke thing that occurred because it only happened very briefly and not again in 400+ miles.