Having my 92 Deville Converted to R134a

[PAUL T]

I got a price on having my 92 Deville converted to R134a. A local shop quoted me around $275.00, is this a good price? I did not ask what was involved but I trust the shop guy to not do me wrong. The last charge of R12 lasted one year, so I know there is a small leak somewhere. Since I am going to have to break it down to fix the leak the shop owner suggested that I just have it converted.

I also ordered a compressor for my 94 Concours today. What can I expect to pay to have it installed and charged, barring there are no metal shavings in the orfice tube? I plan on getting a new accumulator and orfice tube to be installed also.

[KHE]

Paul,

You might want to reconsider converting to R-134a as the price is skyrocketing and is almost approaching the cost of R-12. A 30 lb. cylinder of R-134a is running about $350 now and I missed a 30 lb. cylinder of R-12 on ebay a couple of weeks ago - it sold for $330....I bought a 30 lb. cylinder a year ago at Sams Club for $57....

Hopefully, the price comes back down once DuPont's manufacturing facility comes back online........

Many shops want to use a lesser amount of R-134a than what is specified for R-12 and that will set the low refrigerant code.

If it were my car, I'd just have the leak fixed and have it charged with R-12.

On the '94 Concours, I would estimate $250 - $300 for the compressor install, etc.

[OynxSTS]

STOP!

DO NOT do this!

I had my 91 Truck converted to R134A and the process was not worth it.

First R134A is nowhere near the coolant that R12 is(was)... You will immediately feel ripped off now that your AC doesn’t blow cold... It only blows "cool"

R134A factory systems work at different pressures and volumes than R12… No matter how much you spend it won’t work as well as your R12 system did.

If they don’t sell R12 in your state anymore drive to a state that still sells it and/or look at a different coolant substitute other than R134A… Good Luck

PS if the $275 includes fixing the leak and guaranteeing their work for 12 or so months than this is a fair price…

[Klr Ontherd]

I would have stuck with the R12 if I had a choice, but up here in Ontariario its no longer legal. Not sure if its a Canada wide thing, but I think so.

Any how.....

Just had mine converted the day before last. OynxSTS is correct in saying it doesnt blow as colled as R12. It does do the job though and cools down the car quite quickly. It wont create frost on your upper lip mind you, but it is a bit more than cool.

The actuall conversion kit is quite inexpensive. Only $68 here.

(Im Using Canadian Prices)

Its the labour for the install that will get ya.

I was quoted a MAX of $400 for the kit and install. Probably closer to $350.

(That Would Have Been The Max With Tax. And The Other Tax)

So if you do the conversion between our dollars, your quote is quite reasonable.

Should also mention that I went with the GM canister (Accumulator ?). Was told that the after market ones are like a pop can. Way too thin. Was about $35 more than the aftermarket.

Mind you though, I was also informed that it could cost even more. Still had to find out if there was an actuall leak, or if the freon had dissipated over time. If no leaks then good. If there were leaks, then depending what and where, would designate the amount of extra cost.

Turned out I did have a leak. Believe it was in the condensor. So it did cost more.

At least I was informed of the possibility.

And when it was discovered, I was able to take my car home to think about the extra cost. With no charge for the time he took to take everything apart, and then put back together.

Was also given the option of changing all seals etc.....Apparently there are 2 different conversion kits available. One is half assed and the other is more thorough. I went with the other. The cost difference was negligible.

Here is the break down of what was done and the costs.

(Remember That This Is In Canadian Currency!!)

Parts:

1) 91376-RETROFIT KIT AND OIL..........$69.99

1) 15-1571-ACCUMULATOR..................$144.00

1) 632241-CONDENSOR.......................$188.88

2.25) R-134-REFRIGERANT...................$16.66 (Im assuming 2.25 is lbs or metric equivilant)

TOTAL PARTS COST.............................$440.36

Labour, And Descripton:

R134 CONVERSION: REPLACE LOW SIDE FITTING, SEALS AND ORIFICE TUBE......$68.00

REPLACE ACCUMULATOR.......................$34.00

REPLACE A/C CONDENSOR....................$156.40

EVACUATE AND RECHARGE: FILL SYSTEM WITH SYNTHETIC OIL......$81.60

TOTAL LABOUR COST............................$340.00

SUBTOTAL............................................$780.36

GST 7%................................................$54.63

PST 8%................................................$62.43

TOTAL..................................................$897.42

Hope that helps.

[KHE]

In the US, it is illegal to manufacture R-12 but you can still buy it if you're certified by the EPA. It costs $25 to take the exam and then you receive a card and you can buy R-12.

Is R-12 truely illegal in Canada? If you're close to the border, any A/C shop would be able to charge your car with R-12...

[OynxSTS]

The laws in Canada are similar to the States... You can't make it... But if you have it you can use it... it is not hard to find a shop that will charge R12... But like the US this varies Province to Province....

Most shops will push the conversion to R134a since they can make more money at this and it makes the customer feel "greener"

[KHE]

The laws in Canada are similar to the States... You can't make it... But if you have it you can use it... it is not hard to find a shop that will charge R12... But like the US this varies Province to Province....

Most shops will push the conversion to R134a since they can make more money at this and it makes the customer feel "greener"

OK that makes sense - it's not "illegal" per se just some shops push the conversion....same as in the states. I would not convert a R-12 car to R-134a these days as the price of R-134a is almost the same as R-12....why bother with all the hassle???

[bigjayzway]

You can go to A&A discount auto parts in Hamilton Ontario, and get a can of refrigerant, that is compatible with R134a, and R12....Yes it works, I have R134, and the wife has R12, and I topped them both up, with the same can, and it works awesome.... With the hose and the can of refrigerant it was less than $30.00.

R12 is not illegal in Canada! As well R134a is 1/4 the price of R12 up here!

This stuff A&A sells is really neet, as it works with both systems, and it has no problems....I used it last year, and it does NOT need to be done again this year! It seals small leaks too!!!!

[KHE]

You can go to A&A discount auto parts in Hamilton Ontario, and get a can of refrigerant, that is compatible with R134a, and R12....Yes it works, I have R134, and the wife has R12, and I topped them both up, with the same can, and it works awesome.... With the hose and the can of refrigerant it was less than $30.00.

R12 is not illegal in Canada! As well R134a is 1/4 the price of R12 up here!

This stuff A&A sells is really neet, as it works with both systems, and it has no problems....I used it last year, and it does NOT need to be done again this year! It seals small leaks too!!!!

DuPont shut down a R-134a plant to perform preventive maintenance. The PM work took longer than expected and the supply was affected driving the price through the roof.

Mixing refrigerants is a no-no -that is illegal unless it is a SNAP approved alternative refrigerant. Sealers are not recommended as they rarely work long term and will screw up someone's recovery equipment...

[PAUL T]

I am going to look around for another shop that has R12 and see if I can get it sealed and refilled with it. I know it does not cool as quick as R134a and I am a little leary of the conversion. Thanks for the info guys.

[Klr Ontherd]

Did some askin around.

What I understand is;

Refrigerants may not be:

-vented to atmosphere

-used to pressure test or locate leaks

-refrigerant must be recovered from a system before it is opened up or discarded

And The Big One

-systems with leaks must be repaired

Think that applies to basicly all of Canada.

No doubt there are places that will re-charge you anyways, but that is taking a big risk on there part.

Here's a couple of good links:

This one is retorofits.

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/at_000507.htm

This is repairs (back a couple years)

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/030625.htm

[msilva954]

hmm...while I didnt do it myself, there is a sticker on my 92' devilles fusebox under the hood that states it was fully converted in 2000'....my A/C is WAAAAY colder then our 97 mustang and 2001 BMW 3series.....by far too...we have never owned a car with AC that is so fast to cool off and get so cold.....

in the end Im assuming its really based on the expertise of the installer