DTS_driver Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 i was at a gas station idleing and just out of no where i hear a very very loud clunking noies and i see smoke, so i turn it off the engine right away. i got out the car and i looked at the concrete right under the engine and all i saw was a puddle of oil and bits and pieces of metal. This is out of a 2000 DTS with 66k on it, how much am i looking at for a fix to this problem, am I looking at a new engine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTS_driver Posted March 13, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 The caddy is sitting at the gas station as of now, will get it towed to a shop monday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 DTS Driver, What a BUMMER!! All that I can say is that I hope that you have an extended warranty! If a rod punched a hole in the pan, then the chances of the engine being salvageable are slim to none. As we have recently seen, a new replacement engine is approaching $9000.00 I don't know what the blue book price is on your car, but putting that much into it would be a personal call on your part. I hate to suggest it, but an alternative would be a used engine from a low milage wreck that was hit in the rear. I'm surprised that it dropped a rod while at idle. Has the engine had any work done on it? Let us know what the diagnosis is. Good Luck, (you'll need it) Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 This is an odd problem you must have cracked a rod, I think these are forged rods if I recall. Post a photo if you can. If this was common as we performed our WOTs we would be dropping the bottom out of these NS's on a regular basis..let alone idling at the curb... Please post a photo if you can see it.. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 I have seen catastophic block damage before on the NS resulting from hydrolocking the engine, I wonder if an injector stuck open and dumped fuel in the chamber and blew out the bottom end? Or maybe coolant rushed the cylinder from a bad head gasket or crack. Was it raining did you go through any deep puddles? How was the engine running right before this? Was the check engine light on? Think about this, I have seen a situation where a tech was cleaning the throttle body and upper engine with upper engine cleaner, he used too much, it pooled in the intake, as soon as he pulled away from the curb giving it some gas, it sucked the cleaner into a cylinder hydrolocking the engine and the side of the engine blew out from a rod. No more spraying anything into the TB for me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob D Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 Gotta agree with Mr Scott. About the only way to bust a con rod through the block on a Northstar engine is from hydrolock. Some type of instantly excessive fluid in a cylinder...coolant, fuel, ingested H2o or cleaner. Ouch. '93 STS.. opened, dropped, wide...fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 13, 2005 Report Share Posted March 13, 2005 GMTA Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTS_driver Posted March 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Im not so sure exactly on what caused the rod to come out like that. the very sad thing is, is that i bought this car with 57k on it last October i got about 66k on it now, I got it from the cadillac dealer. there is no warranty as of now, it came with a 30 day warranty when i bought it, i just want to know by any chance if the dealer maybe can take care of this problem, i paid to much for this car and this is the 2nd mechanical problem ive had since buying this car, the first was when the throttle got stuck at WOT, cadillac took care of that though it happend durring the 30 day warrenty. This car also did have some work done before I bought it, I had this car on a lift before at a shop for tires and right around the oil pan where it meets the engine i saw this red jelly type material, maybe this is a gasket or something which makes me think that this car had some engine work done before i bought it. also when i went back there this morning to see the car at the gas station the clerk gave me a cup with the metal parts that fell out, ive also noticed that there is some aluminum in there. This is my 2nd cadillac ive bought and i hope its not the last. I will get some photos as soon as i can. also there was no rain nor did i go over a puddle or anything. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 This car also did have some work done before I bought it, I had this car on a lift before at a shop for tires and right around the oil pan where it meets the engine i saw this red jelly type material, maybe this is a gasket or something which makes me think that this car had some engine work done before i bought it. That's not necessarily good news. I doubt Cadillac would replace the engine for you if they can see that work has been done on the engine before (outside the dealership). Did they provide a Carfax when you bought it, so you might be able to see how many owners it had before you? I don't lose sleep over what Carfax may or may not say, but it can provide some clues as to what's happened in the past given a particular set of circumstances (like a busted engine). Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTS_driver Posted March 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 well im pretty sure the work done on this car was from the dealer cause i bought this car when it was just over the warranty. i didnt get a carfax when i got it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 You might start with the dealer and see if they have any records on what was done to the car that might give an indication as to what caused the failure. Then if you get no satisfaction from the dealer call Cadillac Assistance their number is in your owners manual and see if they have any records and see if they will help. The problem might have started when you said it stuck at WOT. In any case you will probably have to determine the cause before anyone might take responsibility. You have an uphill battle though. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Please post a picture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmpafford Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Forgive my skepticism, but his is beginning to sound like another "Pat". Used Caddy, out of warranty, mysterious defect in engine, can't provide more details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Please post a picture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regis Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Definitely! Let's see some photos. I've never even heard of a rod pushing through in idle. Not even those well built Yugos can do that. Pics Pics Pics (rubbing hands together). "Burns" rubber " I've never considered myself to be all that conservative, but it seems the more liberal some people get the more conservative I become. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAT38915 Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 Dts, i can tell you exactly how much an engine cost for your car..would you believe $8,620.00.. the reason i know i have a deville, with 35,000 miles on it and that is what a new engine cost.. Good Luck.. and as you can tell im the one they are calling a troll on here, as my name is pat, and i was just slurred in a post prior to this one..good luck to you.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAT38915 Posted March 14, 2005 Report Share Posted March 14, 2005 also Dts, you might contact your attorney general, this is one thing that i have done and he has assured me that something will be done about this..general motors is picking up 1/2 the expense and the attorney said, with the proper documentation he can get the other half paid for..ive gone around and around with everyone about my car..as a consumer you do have rights, so if nothing else , get on the computer and do as much posting as you can...you might go to bad business bureau and post there, also the lemon law...and also i have a forum going if you want to email me i can give you the location..im getting some help there also..we have our rights, ive exercised mine all the way to the corporate headquarters, you have to do that to get the attention you need..Call cadillac assistance , start there..then the attorney general, customer complaints, the department of transportation, and numerous other places will listen to you..good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob D Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 ...and also i have a forum going if you want to email me i can give you the location.. QUOTE (PAT38915 @ Mar 7 2005, 10:28 AM) > i have another forum going, so dosent matter if i post here or not...i have my own personal web site, and im using it against general motors in every way possible< Care to share it's location with us Pat...? Pat, I’m curious. I’ve asked politely once before for you to share the location of the forum you’ve created for us all to look at, and you ignored the request. Since you have chosen to share this forum and post at free will, why don’t you extend the courtesy to everyone here and reciprocate? '93 STS.. opened, dropped, wide...fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STYES Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 As for the post claiming that this "sounds like another pat", I've got news for you. If MY caddy blows up at 66k, I will sound like Mike Tyson at a news conference! I'll blow more smoke out my rear than GODZILLA! If your engine lasted 100,000 miles less than what we all know it should have, you would be mad as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regis Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 As for the post claiming that this "sounds like another pat", I've got news for you. If MY caddy blows up at 66k, I will sound like Mike Tyson at a news conference! I'll blow more smoke out my rear than GODZILLA! If your engine lasted 100,000 miles less than what we all know it should have, you would be mad as well. Styes, I think "sounds like another Pat" might possibly be closer to the truth then anyone might be willing to admit. It shouldn't take a Sherlock Holmes to figure out why eyebrows are going up. Same car, same year, same general problem, same typing style, same grammar, one goes offline and shortly after the other is on but never the sametime (simple proxy usage)....... a little early to get excited but definitely has my attention.... as well as others. If Bruce would allow me, I would love to scroll through the log.... just to be 100% sure. "Burns" rubber " I've never considered myself to be all that conservative, but it seems the more liberal some people get the more conservative I become. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maremrak Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I never heard of engine dieing on idle by itself, and believe me I have a lot of car experience. The engine can be blown only under heavy load. I did it once on my VW Beatle, back in 1987. It is very hard to believe that any modern engine can just die on 650 RPM, sitting in Park. It would have to make a lot of noise first, and the temp would rise to the boiling point. Northstar have many safety features, and at that point it could shot down 4 cyl to cool the engine down. We are talking about one of the 10 best engines that this country ever designed. Even if the pistons or rings were broken, the engine can stil run on idle, with a lot of noice though. 1960 Sedan De Ville (sold) 1970 Coupe De Ville (sold) 1987 Mazda RX-7 (sold) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry94 Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I never heard of engine dieing on idle by itself, and believe me I have a lot of car experience. The engine can be blown only under heavy load. I did it once on my VW Beatle, back in 1987. It is very hard to believe that any modern engine can just die on 650 RPM, sitting in Park. It would have to make a lot of noise first, and the temp would rise to the boiling point. Northstar have many safety features, and at that point it could shot down 4 cyl to cool the engine down. We are talking about one of the 10 best engines that this country ever designed. Even if the pistons or rings were broken, the engine can stil run on idle, with a lot of noice though. FYI - Many years ago my neighbor was warming up his '74 Olds (Olds 350) in his driveway. His oil was very low and # 1 rod journal starved for oil. The engine just stopped when the rod bearing seized to the crank. (This was at fast idle) It did not break the rod. There was actually no damage done to the engine. The crank was removed and #1 journal was cleaned and a new bearing was installed. The engine ran for several years after. I don't know of any condition that would cause such a destructive condition at idle. If the source is found, I would be very interested in knowing the cause. Barry 2008 STS V82016 Colorado Z711970 Corvette LT-1 Coupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topcat9pet Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 Jasper engines is building the '93-'99 N*s. They come as long blocks with the necessary gaskets and seals to finish the installation. I believe the retail price is about $5800 and they come with a 3 year warranty, if installed by a licensed shop. Engines direct are also building the earlier N*'S for less money, but they don't have the reputation that Jasper has. I don't know of of anyone who builds the 2000 up engine. There is a N* listed on ebay listed as an '03 DeVille drop-out. Item # 7961135857. very low reserve. I think the BIN price was in the Mid 2's. I saw my first RWD N* listed on ebay last week. It didn't sell. I guess most of those engines are still under warranty I have a '75 GMC class A motor home with the Oldsmobile 455 FWD setup. at a convention a few years ago one of our "regulars" drove up in his car. He and A friend had just finished putting a rebuilt engine in his coach and in the rush to get the engine installed so he could make it to the convention he didn't notice that they had twisted the throttle cable housing. When they took it out for a test hop the throttle stuck WOT and the eng. puked. Said he should have another new engine waiting by the time he got home from the convention. You learn A lot at the school of Hard Knocks,but the tution is a Bear !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted March 15, 2005 Report Share Posted March 15, 2005 I just spoke to this guy today he contacted me via AIM, the car is at the dealer. He plans to contact the former owner to see if any engine work was needed or done when they traded it in, they currently have an 05 DTS. He has 20 inch tires on the 2000 DTS. I asked him to post pictures of the car and damage, Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted March 16, 2005 Report Share Posted March 16, 2005 I don't know of any condition that would cause such a destructive condition at idle. I would agree -- do the internal engine parts even have enough inertia at idle to completely push through an engine BLOCK and fall out on the ground? Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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