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Dear Listers, 

Warning on dash indicates "Check Security System" on wife's 2000 Deville.  120K on the car, 20K on the new engine.

Can anyone suggest what I can  ask son to check before  taking the car to the dealer.  Dealer Svc. Advisor said to get the car in ASAP as this issue could shut the car down without warning.  He also suggested using a different ignition key, stating wife's key may be bad.

If I have to seek help, I think a dealer would be more familiar with this  problem, and  better prepared to do the diagnostics with his equipment than my local Indy.

This sudden and unexpected development leaves me with only one vehicle.  Therefor, replies to my email address are welcome and would be more expeditious.

Thanks much for any assistance or suggestions offered

Steve SMihaly137@aol.com

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Replaced the battery back in Jan. and have had no alerts until now.

Yesterday started car with #1 key; message Check "Security" appeared.  

 
Today, started car with #2 key.  Msg stated "Check "Theft"  vs.
Check "Security".
 
Pulled following codes, which I have no way to decipher:
 
IPMB 0429
 
IRCU 1016
 
PCM 386
 
VTD  B  1009
 
VTD  B   2734
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Last night I started the car twice, using a different key each time. NO codes appeared:-P.  Also, the 'Check Engine Soon' light, which has been present for almost two years is no longer lit.   Previous codes indicated a mis-fire on Cyluinder #4.  My son has changed out the #4 plug and boot, and both front and rear coils. Unfortunately, the message appears again after a 30 - 40 minute drive, or even a few days later; all of this at the recommendation of several mechanics.  The most recent tech I spoke with shared that he's had the same problem on his car, and has decided to just live with it until he gets a hard hit and the car stops!
 
I plan to drive the car again today, not too far from home, and see what happens.  Getting to the battery under the rear seat is a real physical challenge for me, so that will have to wait for my son to visit  with us.
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you say coils were replaced.

Were they oem? complete units?

Those 4 coil pack units were a common problem.

If they have both been replaced I almost suggest swapping them around and seeing if the misfire follows with the coil.

It is not good to continue to drive with misfiring as it is harsh on the cats, and not good on the cylinders or engine for that matter

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Put about 40 miles on the car yesterday, 3/17/2017 after clearing all codes through the instrument panel. The "Check Engine Soon" light returned after driving the car about 10 miles:-(.  No other codes have appeared ref. Security or Theft system! Hopefully resetting the system has now corrected those problems?
F Y I:  I've listed a few previous incidents and history ref. the Crankcase Position Sensors (CPS) in this car:
5/10/12 –  Mileage = 96,000 NOTE:  Code P 0 3 8 6. 
Per Cadillac dealer, CPS's not covered under warranty on new engine which was earlier dealer installed on 3/2010 @ 85K to resolve oil leak.
Dealer est. cost to replace both CPS's = $450.00 and they recommended replace both A & B Crankcase Position Sensors!
5/14/12 – Indy mechanic replaced both Crankcase Position Sensors.  Total cost: Parts $95. Labor: $25.
10/27/13 – Check Engine light on again.   Indy mechanic checked wiring connections and light is now off. 
10/30/13  -  Mileage @ 104,989:  Indy replaced both upper Crankcase Position Sensor again;  AC Delco Part # 21 213 1578 and lower Crankcase Position Sensors; AC Delco  Part # 21 213 1579 with OEM parts from www.RockAuto.com.  Parts cost:  approx. $101.73. Labor $40.00; took one hour. Dealer est. to do this job was approx. $325.00 and I don't think that included parts?  
Very hard to reach these sensors; requires small hands and long ratchet extension(s)!  Took car to Auto zone to have Code reset to zero after these parts were installed to clear "Service Engine Soon" message!
NOTE:  Indy later calibrated the CPS's when the Check Engine Light reappeared about a month later.
5/16/14 – A "Misfire" Code appeared.  After replacing spark plug boot and spark plug, cylinder #4, CPS Code resolved on # 4 cylinder.
10/1/14 – CPS Code reappears and Indy installed new front coil.  Did not resolve problem.
3//18/2017-Code remains on as of 3/18/2017!
 
 
 
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I think the wiring was probably compromised in the engine swap and a wire was pulled / damaged, Have someone replace both connectors and check the harness and wiring for damage. The weather-pak connectors are hard to tell if the connector and or wiring is damaged. Do you happen to remember what you were doing at the time the light came on at the 10 mile mark? Were you accelerating, cornering hard or at cruise speed?

THERE IS ALWAYS ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB RIGHT - THERE IS NEVER ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB AGAIN !!!

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New engine installed by dealer in March, 2010.  First time Crank Case Position Sensors were replaced was May, 2012. Second time wasn't until Oct., 2013.   Wiring and connections were checked during these instances and I suspect a wiring problem would have shown up sooner? 

New coil that was installed  in Oct., 2014 was OEM!

 

Re. 'Remember' what I doing when light came on after driving 10 miles???

Not too long ago I finally found my set of car keys that I 'accidentally' left inside the freezer while storing frozen foods from the grocery!       Hell to turn 40 . . . . twice!

 

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Thanks, I now have another place to look for the set of missing keys to the Harley :)

Sounds like you are convinced there is nothing wrong with the wiring. You went 2 years between the first time it was replaced and the engine swap, now you have a constant problem. Still sounds like a wiring problem or sensor as  P0386 means the crankshaft position sensor has produced excessive voltage that exceeds the manufacturer's specifications. You drove it 10 miles without a malfunction after clearing the codes so something is driving the voltage up.

Maybe Indy missed something.....

Potential causes of a P0386 code include:

* Bad crank sensor

* Broken reluctor ring (missing teeth, debris lodged in ring)

* Reluctor ring dislodged/stripped from it's stationary location

* Wiring harness chafing causing short

* Wiring open in CKP circuit
 

Edited by OldCadTech

THERE IS ALWAYS ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB RIGHT - THERE IS NEVER ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB AGAIN !!!

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Finally found this, Indy may be able to help you with this......

Subject:
Intermittent Engine Idle Instability, Hard/No Restart or Decel Stalls, SES Lamp Illuminated, DTCs P0335, P0336, P0385, P0386 or P1599 May Be Set:

Models: 
2000-2001 Cadillac DeVille, Eldorado, Seville
2001 Oldsmobile Aurora with 4.0L or 4.6L Engine (VINs C, Y, 9 - RPOs L47, LD8, L37)

Condition

Some owners may comment on an intermittent engine idle speed stability concern, hard or no restart condition or a decel engine stall. This may also be accompanied by a Service Engine Soon light being illuminated. Upon investigation, the PCM may indicate one of the following DTC codes: P0335, P0336, P0385, P0386 or P1599.

Cause

The above conditions may be caused by multiple concerns with the crank sensor or the PCM.

Correction

If the vehicle has any of the crank sensor codes P0335, P0336, P0385, or P0386 set, then the following should be done:

Inspect both of the crank sensor terminals for signs of poor connection or corrosion of both crank sensors. Pin drag test all four terminals.

^ Inspect the crank sensor circuit wires for signs of damage.

^ Inspect the crank sensor circuits at the PCM for poor connections. The crank sensor terminals should also be drag tested.

^ Remove the crank sensors and check for any debris on the sensor.

^ Verify crank sensor location (A on the bottom and B on the top) and verify that the sensor circuit wires are in the correct cavities.

^ Inspect the date code on the sensor. If it is before 0276, replace the crank shaft sensor and perform case learn.

^ If the date code is past 0276, verify the PCM grounds. A voltage drop test should be less than 20 mV.

^ If the PCM ground circuit verification is acceptable, then follow published PCM diagnostics. If the vehicle has an idle or decel stall, or near stall concern and only has DTC P1599 set, then the following should be done:

^ Verify the system power and ground connections for the PCM.

^ Verify crank sensor location (A on the bottom and B on the top) and verify that the sensor circuit wires are in the correct cavities in the harness.

^ Remove the crank sensors and check for any debris on the sensor.

^ Verify that the fuel pressure regulator is not leaking fuel past the diaphragm.

^ Perform the injector balance drop test and verify even pressure drops on all injectors.

^ Inspect and clean the EGR passages, as necessary.

^ Inspect and clean the IAC passages, as necessary

THERE IS ALWAYS ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB RIGHT - THERE IS NEVER ENOUGH TIME TO DO THE JOB AGAIN !!!

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Gentlemen,

Somewhere along the line I must have mistakenly projected the idea that I possess a  much higher level of mechanical ability and knowledge than I really do.  Many of the tests suggested, ie. balance drop, PCM Ground Circuity Verification, verification of the fuel pressure regulator, are 'foreign terms' to me.   

 

Rather than continue to impose on the time of the kind Listers that have shared their knowledge and tried to assist with a solution I'm going to drop back, 'try' to forget about the 'Ck Engine Soon' and PCM 0386 Code, and hope the Security & Theft messages do not present again.  I do have the 2007 DTS Performance model to fall back on for now.  Although, the wife would definitely prefer to  have access to her own car.

Should the problem persist that is causing the 'Check Engine Soon' light to remain on, (and the car keeps running) I'm already looking down the road to the sad day when it becomes necessary to upgrade, and replace the vehicle.  Due to our age, disabilities and low miles driven per year my wife and I both qualify to have the State Emmissions Test waived.  (Wierd Emissions Test regulations here in MD)!  I've accepted that disability (and possibly even old, (older) age), will be with us till the end of time!  When/if we do ever exceed the  the mileage limitation, (2500 per year), the car will not pass the Emissions test, and we'll have only 15 days to have necessary repairs made to the vehicle before the State suspends the registration:(By that time I expect the repairs will cost more than the value of the vehicle and I'll have a beautiful 2000 Diamond White, Tan Canvass Top Deville in great shape cosmetically, with relatively low mileage on the engine, that will get dropped off at the salvage yard.

Thanks once again for all the help, and I'll be sure to run a "Post" on any future developments.

Steve in MD

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