Battery Drain/Radio problem

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

So I've got two problems, mainly. I have a 1993 Sixty Special. There is a draw on the battery when the car is not running. I had the Alternater and battery tested (It is only a year old) and both are fine. I have been disconnecting the battery when not driving, and it has not died so far. The car will need a boost if I do not drive it or run the engine every 12-24 hours. This seems to be getting worse, which would indicate my battery is taking a beating for all the boosts I've given it. So, here's what I've done.

• I pulled the fuse for Air Suspension, suspecting it was draining my battery due to a leak in the line somewhere, and running more than it should. This did not fix my problem
• I pulled the fuse for the door lock relays, and the two front seat adjusters. I considered this feature kind of optional, and was willing to see if that system had a power draw. It did not fix the problem.
• Connected a volt meter to the positive cable and positive terminal to get the meter to read that I had a draw of 12.3 volts or so. Started pulling all fuses to see if that would go away, it did not.
• Suspecting I did something wrong, I did the same with the negative cable and negative post to much the same effect, the draw of around 12.3 volts remained the same.

Did I test the battery draw wrong?

I also noticed my security light blinks when opening 3 of my 4 doors. The passenger door it does not blink. I find this odd, and suspect it could be part of my problem.

Now, having said all that, yesterday my Radio will not turn on any more. I pulled out my iPod dock from the front seat cigerette lighter, and it left behind a little conductive piece of metal. When I tried fishing it out, it sparked all over the place at me. When I finally got it out, my radio would not turn on. The car beeps at me funny when I open the doors with the keys in it, and the security light doesn't come on when I open the doors now. I tried swapping the radio fuse (#4 I believe, 10Amp) with the spare #2 10 Amp, and nothing has changed. It seemed to me that when the radio didn't come on I just blew a fuse.

Any help is appreciated guys. I plan on taking the car into a mechanic as I know one I trust, and I just want to know the source of the problems before I bring it into him to fix it.

[Cadillac Jim]

The battery drain is in amps, not volts, and you need to have an ammeter check the drain. There are ammeters that clamp around a cable that may be able to measure small battery drain. Be careful on measuring battery drain. It varies for 0.050 Amperes or less when the car has been off and not touched or the fob buttons pushed for more than 10 minutes, to 1,000 Amps starting to turn over a hot engine.

The battery drain is a couple of Amps for a car that has just been turned off. There are at least three time delays, about 45 seconds for the headlights, the "inadvertent power" for the radio and such which turns off about about 10 minutes or when you open the car door, whichever comes first, and the "retained accessory power" (RAP) that powers the interior lights and such which turns off about 10 minutes after you turn off the car. The car's modules all go into the sleep mode after the RAP goes off, and the battery drain should be 0.050 Amps (50 milliamperes) or less.

You're doing the right thing by pulling fuses to locate the problem but you can't measure the battery drain in Volts, and you must let the car sit for at least 15 minutes to be sure that all the delayed power switches have timed out.

Something got popped when you shorted out the cigar lighter. It should have popped a fuse, and at lest one fuse is gone. Sometimes it's easy to see a bad fuse, sometimes not. You can check them with an Ohmmeter but once in a long while a fuse will be cracked and check good on an ohmmeter but won't work in the car. Fuses are cheap so I suggest that you get a box of them at an auto parts store and try known good fuses.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

I had a guy help me with the battery drain check, I'll ask him if what we used was a volt meter or amperage meter. As for the radio, could it have been any fuse? I did switch the radio one with a spare one, 10Amps I believe. And nothing changed.

*EDIT*

I just went out and checked my fuse map in the booklet again, and #2 was the 10Amp spare, and #4 was Radio. They were not blown. However, #11 controlled the multifunction chiming, cigar lighter, and radio. That one was blown, so #21 was a spare 20Amp and now my problem is fixed. I was just checking the wrong fuses.

Now back to working on that battery drain, hahaha. Thanks for all your help so far. I shall track down and amp meter

[Cadillac Jim]

Success comes with perseverance. Electrical problems can be puzzles to unravel but they are always simple once you find out what caused them.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

So I'm still living with the power drain. I have not tracked down an amperage meter. I'm honestly thinking I'm just going to buy a new battery soon and see what that does. I now have a battery charger that I just leave the battery charging when not driving it. Any extra help would be appreciated guys.

It also stalls out randomly when driving every few weeks. Not sure what's going on there.

[Texas Jim]

Amp meters are pretty cheap...

They start at less than 8 bucks and go up...

.

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_8?url=search-alias%3Dautomotive&field-keywords=volt+ohm+meter&sprefix=volt+ohm%2Caps%2C176&rh=n%3A15684181%2Ck%3Avolt+ohm+meter&ajr=0

[winterset]

Check around and under the fuse block for signs of corrosion, and dirt. For the random stalling, i would slightly move the 12v ignition / coil or distriburator cap wires to see if one has a weak connection. I suspect its a wireing problem due to age for both issues.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

I went and got another battery test, and the cranking amps were lower than what the battery said, but not by much. My car calls for a certain battery, and it was not what was in the car. I have replaced the battery and not had issues since, but I bet I will run into this problem again down the road, as I seriously suspect something is not turning off. But I have temporarily fixed it, due to a trip coming up and I don't particularly want the battery to die. I am keeping a battery in the trunk to boost off of if need be.

[Cadillac Jim]

If you can let the car sit for a week and it will still start, the car is OK. If not, you need to find whatever is draining the battery.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

For an update, I still haven't located the problem, but I found that my trunk release was disconnected for some reason. I put everything back together and no change.

Now, what I think is the real culprit is after reading my manual. The damned security system (This isn't the first car I've had where a security system has given me issues)

When My doors are unlocked and opened, the security light is flashing. The manual says that this is a reminder for you to set your security system. You do this by using your power locks to lock the doors. Once I do this, the security light goes solid. The manual tells me this means it is now armed. However, once I shut the doors, that light is supposed to turn off. Mine NEVER does. It stays on constantly. I do not think the light itself is killing my battery, but I do believe the fact that the car is "listening" to the signal of my door shutting to arm the security system is always "listening" thus draining my battery.

So to the fuse panel I go. Under my hood are some Maxi Fuses, and one is the security system. Wouldn't you know it, it is tied to the Ignition too! So if I pull it, the car won't start.

So does anyone know how to disable the security system completely. In my old 2001 Alero, it was as simple as pulling the radio, cutting some wires, and putting in a resistor to complete the circuit (Though that was for ignition problems) Would this job be similar? I've read that people have had issues with their Cadillac security system.

I am 90% sure this security system is my drain.

One thing I will try tonight, is when I get home from work, I will pull the maxi fuse for the ignition/SEcurity system and leave the battery connected to see what happens. If it doesn't die, then I would say that is my issue. But I kind of need that maxi fuse to be in the car, on the count that it turns my engine.

[Cadillac Jim]

This looks like it may be one of the switches that tells the car that a door is closed.

[rockfangd]

I think you are on to something.

The security light will go solid once all 4 doors and trunk are closed.

Is your trunk closing completely? I have a hunch the 2 issues may be related.

If it is not seeing the trunk as being closed it will never set the security. May be keeping the system awake and thus drawing all the time.

IIRC there is no way to bypass the Security unless it was not equipped. It is all controlled via the bcm and pzm, and IIRC the IPC

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

I did look in my trunk, and there was a wire not connected. Also a plastic piece that all assembles back together. It being apart however did not seem, to affect trunk release operation. So I threw it all back together, and still no change in trunk operation. Also no change in my security light situation. darn did I ever think that was the issue.

I have looked in the manual, and there is no door relay that I can find, either under the hood or in the fuse block. But I am darn sure that this is my power drain, and would love to just snip some wires to disable the security system. Maybe make it loop back. For example, my Alero would lock me out, due to a bad resistor in the ignition. I had snipped two wires, and places my own resistor in there, to complete the circuit, and trick the car. I bet something can be done like that with this car, to skip the door check for that security system to arm itself. Of course, Cadillac's have many more wires than an Alero.

In the spring I will go around and check all door sensors. Because like you pointed out, something is not right, the system is waiting for that sensor to be tripped to arm itself, and I think this is my issue.

(I don't want to try pulling that Maxi Fuse just yet, as it is still about -20 to -30 degrees Celsius where I live right now, don't want to be bothered with messing with the car too too much)

[rockfangd]

I really think you are in the right direction with the trunk. Maybe the switch itself is bad

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

I got around to checking all door switches. My passenger side only had one wire connected to it. Incidentally my dash was apart because I have a fan issue with my heater now. I ended up getting the 2nd wire out that little hole, but the way these door switches work is when there is no connection, it is simulated closed. I played with it a lot, but the only thing I can do it touch the two wires to make the car think the door is open. Does anyone know if these door switches are what the security system is tied to?

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

I am sure the culprit is my security system. I doesn't arm when it should (By locking the doors, then shutting the door) I even tried to set the system off, but to no avail. It does not work correctly. I have checked all door switches and the trunk. Everything seems to be working correctly. Dome lights, all the bells and whistles. Except for the security system.

I had a problem with an 01 Alero security systems, and I disabled it by cutting some wires behind the radio deck to the ignition, and installing my oqwn resistor bypassing the ignition interlock... I am wondering if I could do something similar here.

What I am asking for now, is there a way to to a hard reset on the security system? I remember the security system had locked me out once upon a time ago. I also had the alarm go off a while back, but I'm not sure when this system quit working correctly. I am starting to think maybe the system is grounded out somewhere...

Does anyone know where I can get a wiring diagram for this car?

[Cadillac Jim]

If you've got an aftermarket security system, that company is the one to go to for help with it.

The wiring diagram is in the factory shop manual. You should be able to get one on eBay. Make sure it covers your exact model: 1993 Sixty Special.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

Well I thought for sure this nailed it, I isolated the wires so the door would always sim closed. The car drove for about 1000 km without dying, but eventually did die again... I am still sure it is the security system, and I do not believe it is an aftermarket system.

[Cadillac Jim]

I think a more reliable fix could be had by bringing things back to working order, because the security system operates by a number of sensors and the computers in the car's modules. You can't modify the modules, and the sensors are simple. It's usually easier to fix them than to disable the system.

There are customization options in the car's modules that can be used to enable and disable some features. This information should be in the owner's manual.

I don't have a 1993 FSM so I don't have a definitive list of sensors. I would start with the OBD I codes and see what they tell us.

[kid_rock135@hotmail.com]

Thanks for all your help guys, but I finally had enough of hunting down the problem. Top it off with some leaky tires, a misfire up front, leaky gas tank, a roof that leaked in the rain. This car became too much to maintain. I sold it for parts. I'm now driving a boring Honda Civic...

[Bruce Nunnally]

8 hours ago, kid_rock135@hotmail.com said:

Thanks for all your help guys, but I finally had enough of hunting down the problem. Top it off with some leaky tires, a misfire up front, leaky gas tank, a roof that leaked in the rain. This car became too much to maintain. I sold it for parts. I'm now driving a boring Honda Civic...

That just puts you between Cadillacs.  Thanks for the update.

[barczy01]

being you battery has died often. You need to complete an idle relearn procedure.