Bruce Nunnally Posted December 6, 2004 Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 For 2005 the new GTO gets the LS2 400 hp engine from the C6 Corvette. The 2005 CTS-V keeps the LS6 400 hp engine from the Z06 C5 Corvette. The 2005 GTO automatic runs 0-60 in 4.6 seconds while the 6 speed runs 0-60 in 4.7 seconds;the ¼ mile for automatic is 13.0 seconds and the ¼ mile for the 6 speed is 13.1 seconds. These are numbers GM will publish in the catalogs and web site. A4 Base MSRP = $32,295 + $700 Destination+ $1,300 Gas Guzzler Tax =$34,295 The CTS-V does 0-60 mph in 4.6s and the quarter in 13.1s with Cadillac driving; somewhat worse (5.1s to 5.3s) in the buff magazines due to wheel hop. The 2004 GTO had wheel hop issues as well, but seems to manage to drive through them somewhat better? From what I have read, the wheel hop seems magnified by the things Cadillac did to make the drive train quieter, and more refined. These are probably a good trade, as you want a Cadillac performance car to still drive like a Cadillac. The 2005 GTO weighs 3,725 lbs; the 2005 CTS-V 3,850 lbs. The GTO only has 2 doors, but actually has 1" more rear leg room than the CTS-V. The CTS-V base MSRP is $49,995 plus destination. $17,500 more (50%+) than the 2005 GTO. The CTS-V will have some new engine in it's next iteration. I would have thought the 500+ hp LS7 when the next Z06 C6 Corvette comes along, but rumors are something unique instead. My solution? The CTS-V is a all-out engine brakes and suspension add on to the most expensive CTS variant. How about a simple engine/suspension option for those of us who just want the LS6 V8 and not the whole package? A $35K LS6 or LS2 CTS would be a nice affordable car. Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cetheri Posted December 6, 2004 Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 My local Cadillac dealer has a beautiful black CTS-V in their showroom (almost $54,000.00). Looks like a lot of fun. I saw the CTS-V tested on Car and Driver Television this morning and saw the wheel-hop problem demonstrated. I wondered if there maybe a way to remedy the wheel-hop somewhat with some wider rubber in the rear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Nunnally Posted December 6, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 This kit claims to reduce CTS-V wheel hop by 75%: http://www.eadperformance.com/catalog/prod...&products_id=77 Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted December 6, 2004 Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 I love the new GTO -- especially the '05 with the cosmetic changes. The installation of another 50 horse never hurts either. I'm surprised at all the type I read about the GTO having bland, everyday styling, and it doesn't hark back to the original at all. Hello...the original GTO was an option on a Tempest, wasn't it? Or Le Mans. Those cars were the Cavaliers and Malibus of their day. The whole notion of a muscle machine is to drop a big V8 engine to a plebian car for the ultimate sleeper. In my reckoning, the new GTO is EXACTLY what the old GTO is...something that looks like a Cavalier but with the balls of a Corvette. It's also ironic that American enthusiasts literally drool over the Holden cars that Australia gets, and complain endlessly that if only they would bring 'um here, we'd buy 'um. This is your chance, America. Not only did they bring it here, they put every bit of an LS2 V8 under the hood. Snatch 'um up while you have the chance, because of we (America) let this GTO expire, I doubt we'll EVER see another Holden here. Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjtjwdad Posted December 6, 2004 Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 I agree with you Jason. If I had more stalls I'd grab me one of those GTO's. It be a good compliment to my Trans Am. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonA Posted December 6, 2004 Report Share Posted December 6, 2004 If I had more stalls I'd grab me one of those GTO's. Me too...but add "money" to "stalls". I only have two stalls now, and not a lot of extra money. If I could add a GTO, the Nissan truck would for sure be relegated to driveway parking, but getting the GTO is the hurdle I'm faced with. At this stage in my life (25 y.o.), more domestic things are cropping up in the automotive world (like buying a minivan to taxi future young'uns around). Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond) "When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cadillac_caddy_sts Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 Theres a dealer near me with a new GTO and its been there for some time the sales men said no one likes the exterior styling of it LOL! I dont blame them! I would much rather a CTS-V what zbout you guys??? Defending Northstar perf a qtr mile at a time!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Caddy Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 Ya me too! I agree with you on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67coupedeville Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 $1,300 Gas Guzzler Tax Is that everywhere in the states? I do not think we have anything like that up here in Canada...eh! Spence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 $1,300 Gas Guzzler Tax Is that everywhere in the states? I do not think we have anything like that up here in Canada...eh! Spence The tax is assessed by the Environmental Protection Agency and applies to all new passenger cars sold into the US domestic market. Trucks and truck based vehicles are exempt (which explains part of the popularity of so-called SUVs). The manufacturer pays the tax and passes it along to the original buyer. The amount of tax is based on fuel economy numbers determined in laboratory tests for fuel consumption. According to a New York Times article (Feb. 29, 2004), only two US domestic "cars" are penalized by the tax: the standard transmission GTO and the Dodge Viper. GAS GUZZLER TAX Unadjusted MPG(combined)* Tax at least 22.5 No tax at least 21.5, but less than 22.5 $1000 at least 20.5, but less than 21.5 $1300 at least 19.5, but less than 20.5 $1700 at least 18.5, but less than 19.5 $2100 at least 17.5, but less than 18.5 $2600 at least 16.5, but less than 17.5 $3000 at least 15.5, but less than 16.5 $3700 at least 14.5, but less than 15.5 $4500 at least 13.5, but less than 14.5 $5400 at least 12.5, but less than 13.5 $6400 less than 12.5 $7700 Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
67coupedeville Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 Say an American buys a GTO in Canada and takes it to the US, do you still get hit with the tax when you take it back or would you save it? I know $1300 on a $30,000 car is not the end of the world but at the end of the year having another $1300 is night and day. Just my $0.02 Spence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgr7 Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 Here in California the CTS-V has the $1300 or it might have been $1200 can't remember, but it does have one. I was looking at one here and it was on the sticker price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted January 31, 2005 Report Share Posted January 31, 2005 While I realize that Cadillac's official position on this wheel hop issue is that its the compromise you pay for a 'Cadillac" ride what ever that means in a performance car, why do that allow this to happen? The wheel hop appears to be a negative if you ask me. It only allows other manufactures to use it against them, it allows the press to look down on them in print and I am sure it hurts sales. The bottom line, its a negative anyway you look at it. With all of the advanced active computerized gobbly gook that they have on these cars are you going to tell me that they can't control this wheel hop actively via the struts when the demand for power exceeds a certain level... Let me ask you straight out, if you had no allegiance to Cadillac and you were looking at a Cadillac CTS or CTS-V with the wheel hop or a similar class BMW or AUDI (with the magazine article sitting in their desk drawer just waiting to present the wheel hop problem to the unsure buyer) what would you do? Realize that the BMW and AUDI have incredibly powerful engines in their lineups also. My father used to say, do it right or don't do it at all. I say compete to win! So I say develop it, and install it as a recall on all CTS's producted to this point, get in the game and have some balls. I visited another site the other day, and they were very upset about this wheel hop issue, its not good..... They need to develop and install some sort of computerized active dampening mechanism that is activated at the point the suspension needs more support to deliver the power to the ground, PERIOD! If you don't come to play, don't get on the court, or you will get hurt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OynxSTS Posted February 1, 2005 Report Share Posted February 1, 2005 $1,300 Gas Guzzler Tax Is that everywhere in the states? I do not think we have anything like that up here in Canada...eh! Spence Some Provinces have a vehicle luxury tax… which increases the sales tax on high end stuff… But unless GM has changed its position for 2005 there will never be a GTO sold new north of the boarder… To bad, I know at least 5 Hosers who would be willing to drink American beer for the rest of their days for a chance to own one of these Holdens. Easin' down the highway in a new Cadillac, I had a fine fox in front, I had three more in the back ZZTOP, I'm Bad I'm Nationwide Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminus Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 I love the new GTO -- especially the '05 with the cosmetic changes. The installation of another 50 horse never hurts either. I'm surprised at all the type I read about the GTO having bland, everyday styling, and it doesn't hark back to the original at all. Hello...the original GTO was an option on a Tempest, wasn't it? Or Le Mans. Those cars were the Cavaliers and Malibus of their day. The whole notion of a muscle machine is to drop a big V8 engine to a plebian car for the ultimate sleeper. In my reckoning, the new GTO is EXACTLY what the old GTO is...something that looks like a Cavalier but with the balls of a Corvette. Good post, jadcock. And you're right, it was an option package on the LeMans for the first 2, and last 3 years of production. But, when you're a certified, die-hard classic GTO freak like I am, and GM announces the return of a glorious icon whose very name stirs the automotive passions of the soul, you expect a little more than a quick re-badging of an Australian jellybean. Dont get me wrong, I do like the car. It's got nearly everything a guy could ask for; 350 horsepower (04 model) witheasily tuneable and proven aftermarket engine enhancements, 6speed manual transmission, independent rear suspension (drool!), great fuel economy per HP, the only retro styling cues it needs IMO (hood scoops in 05!) and a very reasonable sticker price. The only thing it lacks is character, outward distinction from the other mass produced jellybeans. It is, after all, the "New and Improved Pontiac GTO!", and many people appreciate more than just performance when buying a performance car. They expect to get noticed. 95 Eldo---Sold! 05 STS4-WooHoo!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STYES Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 Scotty your point is well taken regarding the Audi and BMW, but facts are facts. Neither BMW or Audi can match the CTS-V in performance for the price, not even close! The CTS-V is not perfect, but it was Caddy's first "punch of the fight" and it was a good one! Wheel hop from a Caddy! It's about time we had that problem instead of "FWD"! Buy a cheap set of meats for the rear, and smoke them before launch, and lower the PSI! Am I the only real drag racer here? Thank God Caddy came back to the fight!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 Scotty your point is well taken regarding the Audi and BMW, but facts are facts. Neither BMW or Audi can match the CTS-V in performance for the price, not even close! The CTS-V is not perfect, but it was Caddy's first "punch of the fight" and it was a good one! Wheel hop from a Caddy! It's about time we had that problem instead of "FWD"! Buy a cheap set of meats for the rear, and smoke them before launch, and lower the PSI! Am I the only real drag racer here? Thank God Caddy came back to the fight!!! Oh I agree 100% but they are leaving themselves a flaw that can be exploited by the competition not to mention a serious flaw that the press has jumped on. If you don't think its being discussed see this thread: http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30436 and http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30065 I am glad that Cadillac is working so hard also. Doesn't the 400 HP V start at $50K, you are right that neither BMW or AUDI has a car that powerful in that price range, like 2005 545i Powered by a 4.4-liter, 325-hp V-8 engine with Valvetronic starting at $55,000 and the Audi A6 a 4.2 V8 with 335 hp and 310 lb-ft of torque at $51,000. It looks like the wheel hop issue is being worked on, its just that after all of the Nurenberg testing, its shocking that a flaw such as this would survive the testing... I have a CTS DVD describing the rigorous testing done.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 http://www.cadillac.com/under5/under5.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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