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Hello Everyone,

Thank you for keeping such fine conversation on your site. I joined years ago, but lost touch, and have been lurking from time to time. I bought an '04 Base Deville with 22,k last November. Immediately took it to Florida and have enjoyed it ever since. Today I noticed surging at 55 mph on flat ground. I checked the trans fluid and found it to be 4 quarts low! Yikes! I had to leave the car with my wife and head off to work. Are there any places I should suspect a leak? Are leaks at all common on this car? I will get under it tomorrow, so I am asking for a starting point. Thanks in advance!

Sincerely,

Ohio Jim

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I don't believe that leaks are at all common of a 4T80E.

Check the coolant for transmission fluid. If there is any there, you need a new radiator tank on the right side ASAP. Coolant in the transmission means a rebuild and is to be avoided like a beehive in the basement.

Transmission fluid is red so that leaks are easier to find. If you have pink stains or puddles on the garage floor, that can tell you where the transmission fluid is dripping, although it may flow there from another location. You may be able to track it from there. Places to look include the transmission cooling lines and fittings, the transmission oil pan, and the transmission side cover. Also check the torque converter drain and the half-axles.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Jim,

Thank you for the quick and complete reply. I am currently at work, however, I laid cardboard down before I left. I will check as you suggest. I pray no rebuild!

I will let you know what I find.

Thanks again!

Jim

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The nose knows if the tranny is OK. That and the OBD code readout. Check the codes after you get the fulid squared away and drive it.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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When I got home at 4am, I pulled the stick and found no fluid showing. I place a big sheet of cardboard under it and went to bed. When I pulled the car on ramps at 7am, there was quite a puddle of oil on the cardboard. I found one transmission pan bolt along the passenger side missing, and all the trans bolts along the back were barely finger tight! I know this happened withing the last 1000 miles because the pan was completely dry at the last oil change. I bought a new bolt and snugged all the loose bolts. The bolts along the front of the pan, and those halfway along the sides were still tight! Really seems like strange series of events. Thanks for the heads up on the codes, I had not thought of that... will do. I drove it and checked it and all seems fine. I had been plannig to pump out the trans fluid before my trip to Florida in July, so now I figure I should replace the trans gasket at the minimum. If I am not mistaken, the trans would have scavenger screens like the ones in my '99 STS. Is this true? Is the gasket cork or neopreme? RTV? Any other preventive measures you might suggest? I plan to replace all with Dexron VI.

Thanks for all the help!

Jim

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The transmission for the 2004 Deville is called the 4T80E just like the transmission in the 1999 model year Northstars but there were some changes. In particular the TCC actuation was changed to something called EC3 (electronically controlled converter clutch) which apparently was a new design (the TCC was always electronically controlled in the 4T80E). Since the pan, side cover, and apparatus inside them is all designed to support the functions in the power transmitting parts, those may have changed too. Anyone with experience with loose pan bolts and leaking on a 2004 4T80E?


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Cadillac Jim,

I went to Rock Auto for parts. Gasket Kit includes two scavenger screens. Do you normally replace those? I thought the screens just got rinsed? I see aftermarket parts, which do not interest me. The delco parts primarily list MH1 transmission. Some do say 4T80E4. Is the MH1 the same, or should I stay away from those parts? I planned to only change the fluid and pan gasket, however, I will do whatever else should be done while I have the pan off. Please advise your thoughts.

Thanks Jim

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MH1 is apparently another designation for the 4T80E and is the same transmission line. Again, make sure that the parts are for your year and model.

I believe that the scavenger screens are sometimes replaced when the transmission is serviced. That's not a DIY job that I do but there are people here that do their own service on the 4T80E. I have a 1997 FSM and transmission overhaul manual but again, I'm not sure how much detail from my books applies to the 2004 Deville 4T80E. One of them could give you better advice that I could. I would suggest that you get a service kit that includes new gaskets where you need them and follow the instructions that come with it.

Although there are often parts that are equivalent to AC/Delco and less expensive, you are doing the right thing to avoid the economy lines of parts, in my opinion.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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You can verify the GM part no. for the kit with any GM dealer. Rockauto usually lists the GM part no. so you can use the dealer provided part no. to match up with the correct part from Rockauto. The kit includes the scavenger screens and the retaining o-rings. The retaining o-rings get hard with heat and time. To replace them requires removal of the screens and as long as you have the old screens off, it makes sense to install the new ones from the kit. THe last time I changed the trans. fluid on one of my 4T-80s, the kit was cheaper than just buying the pan gasket alone. The OEM gasket is neither cork nor neoprene. It is a fiber type gasket that swells when transmission fluid contacts it and has steel bushings to assure the proper amount of crush when the pan bolts are tightened.

There is a torque sequence - I take the pan and use a Sharpie marker and write the number near the bolt holes - it makes it very easy to follow the correct sequence when laying on a creeper under the car. There are three values - initial, intermediate, and final - note the values are in INCH-POUNDS. Once the pan bolts are torqued, you can use some brake cleaner to remove the torqque sequence markings from the pan.

Many re-use the transmission pan gaskets - If it is not leaking after you snugged up the bolts, you might not need to go any further unless the car is due for a trans. fluid change.


Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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Thank you, KHE. I love Caddyinfo.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Come to think of I have yet to see one leak. Any Idea on how the bolts were loose?


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Kevin the oldtimer,

Thanks for the help. I will follow your suggestions.

GM Fan Forever,

That's the funny part. It makes me nervous to leave as is. I see the pan is listed on Rock Auto for $43... I am wondering if something is going on with the pan. No apparent marks from damage. I am certain there was no leak within the last month... Figured I should replace pan gasket, screens, and maybe pan while I am in there...

Jim

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you know. Sometimes weird things happen. have you had anything done to the car recently? not even trans, just in general


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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As long as the pan is not damaged, I wouldn't replace it - it might not even be available anymore and if it is, it will be expensive. Even if the areas by the holes are a little distorted, they can be flattened back with a block of wood and a hammer.


Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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When I got home at 4am, I pulled the stick and found no fluid showing. I place a big sheet of cardboard under it and went to bed. When I pulled the car on ramps at 7am, there was quite a puddle of oil on the cardboard.

I found one transmission pan bolt along the passenger side missing, and all the trans bolts along the back were barely finger tight!

I know this happened withing the last 1000 miles because the pan was completely dry at the last oil change.

I bought a new bolt and snugged all the loose bolts. The bolts along the front of the pan, and those halfway along the sides were still tight! Really seems like strange series of events. Thanks for the heads up on the codes, I had not thought of that... will do. I drove it and checked it and all seems fine. I had been plannig to pump out the trans fluid before my trip to Florida in July, so now I figure I should replace the trans gasket at the minimum. If I am not mistaken, the trans would have scavenger screens like the ones in my '99 STS. Is this true? Is the gasket cork or neopreme? RTV? Any other preventive measures you might suggest? I plan to replace all with Dexron VI.

Thanks for all the help!

Jim

Not trying to say bad things about where you got your oil changed...

But it is really odd that it started leaking right after you had the oil changed...

It "COULD" just be coincidence but then again, maybe not...


Posted Image

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Our trained and qualified service technicians are here to change your oil.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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idiots-2.jpg

Our trained and qualified service technicians are here to change your oil.

:lol: That's hilarious! Thanks, I needed a good laugh!


Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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idiots-2.jpg

Our trained and qualified service technicians are here to change your oil.

:lol: That's hilarious! Thanks, I needed a good laugh!

Are you making fun of me and my brother? (My brother is the one with the big ears.)


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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idiots-2.jpg

Our trained and qualified service technicians are here to change your oil.

That's hilarious! Thanks - I needed a good laugh.

There was a Valvoline commercial several years back where a hayseed said, "If you don't like that oil, we'll take it right back out your car!" and the customer said, "But then I wouldn't have any motor oil." and the hayseed said, "Well, fortunately, we sell oil here!" and laughed.


Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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idiots-2.jpg

Our trained and qualified service technicians are here to change your oil.

:lol: That's hilarious! Thanks, I needed a good laugh!

Are you making fun of me and my brother? (My brother is the one with the big ears.)

LOL!!!


Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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When I got home at 4am, I pulled the stick and found no fluid showing. I place a big sheet of cardboard under it and went to bed. When I pulled the car on ramps at 7am, there was quite a puddle of oil on the cardboard.

I found one transmission pan bolt along the passenger side missing, and all the trans bolts along the back were barely finger tight!

I know this happened withing the last 1000 miles because the pan was completely dry at the last oil change.

I bought a new bolt and snugged all the loose bolts. The bolts along the front of the pan, and those halfway along the sides were still tight! Really seems like strange series of events. Thanks for the heads up on the codes, I had not thought of that... will do. I drove it and checked it and all seems fine. I had been plannig to pump out the trans fluid before my trip to Florida in July, so now I figure I should replace the trans gasket at the minimum. If I am not mistaken, the trans would have scavenger screens like the ones in my '99 STS. Is this true? Is the gasket cork or neopreme? RTV? Any other preventive measures you might suggest? I plan to replace all with Dexron VI.

Thanks for all the help!

Jim

Not trying to say bad things about where you got your oil changed...

But it is really odd that it started leaking right after you had the oil changed...

It "COULD" just be coincidence but then again, maybe not...

Yah, I was thinkin' the same thing... 'cept I chagned the oil!! LOL

Ohio Jim

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I like the old commercial with the transmission shop being on the phone with the customer. The shop is telling the customer that they are working on the car right now, The monkeys were banging on the transmission in the background. LOL.


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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