AndyUK1 Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 A few days ago I drove my cadillac less than 2 miles (from a cold start ) and noticed small amount of steam coming from under the bonnet so pulled over immediately.Called out AA breakdown and it seems the top radiator hose was loose and the water/coolant was spraying over the top of the radiator. He re-attached the hose and topped up the water and let it run for about 15 minutes and said drive it home but get a garage to check out why the hose had come loose or blown off. The car has not been overheated and never has, I always keep a close eye on the temperature gauge. At the time of this happening the temperature was below 200 and after being topped up with water and run for 15 minutes was no more than 208. Took car to a local garage who after gently revving engine up said the top and bottom hose to radiator were hard and this signals head gasket failure?? I then drove it home less than 2 miles and the coolant had gone down in the radiator ( I topped it up before going to garage ), so it is loosing coolant. It is not overheating, the oil looks ok with no creamy deposits and it seems to drive ok. Is the garage diagnosis right or is there any other possible cause of this problem? Have owned the car for 10 years now in the UK so would hate to scrap it, but finding local garages in UK prepared to work on a cadillac is a problem as they have no experience of them at all!! Any advice would be most appreciated. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 4.9 engines are not known to bow head gaskets. Some can have an intake manifold gasket leak which would leak coolant into the oil but you stated there was not any coolant in the oil. Radiator hoses do not indicate the condition of headgaskets.... The 4.9 engine is a wet sleeve design with o-rings at the top and bottom of the cylinder sleeves to seal the combustion chamber from the cooling system. That is why the use of the cooling system sealer is required for those engines. You may have an external coolant leak if the level keeps going down. Do you smell coolant? Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyUK1 Posted April 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 I have checked the oil dip stick and took the oil filler cap off and the oil in there is totally clean. I was told by the mechanic that if there was gases/pressure entering the cooling system that would force the hose off the radiator and that together with hard hoses indicate failed head gaskets?? Up until this problem the coolant level was ok and I cant smell any coolant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted April 9, 2013 Report Share Posted April 9, 2013 That mechanic and his diagnosis reminds me of The Great Karnak: (Question in sealed envelope, head to forehead: What is the most lucrative repair?) The Great Karnak: "Head gasket failure!" Symptoms that would indicate head gasket failure include ongoing coolant loss, overheating - particularly intermittent overheating, and overheating on such situations as pulling hills at highway speeds. Things to check to determine overheating causes would include coolant leaks (!!!), sticking or bad thermostat, making sure that the antifreeze was at least 50-50 but less than 70% antifreeze, with 50% preferred, a leaking or bad radiator cap, a leak in a radiator (a cracked radiator tank will sometimes leak only when the engine is hot), clogged bypass, clogged radiator, clogged heater core, or kinked or collapsed heater or radiator hoses. Things to check to see if you do have head gasket leakage include bubbles in the radiator tank that smell like exhaust, a coolant smell in the tailpipe right after starting in the morning (or any other time, really), and coolant smell on the spark plugs. A definitive test is to test the coolant for excessive combustion products. Note that none of these involve feeling the radiator hose to see how hard it is. A radiator hose will be hard whenever the radiator has pressure in it, which is to say whenever the engine is warmed up and the radiator cap is working. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 10, 2013 Report Share Posted April 10, 2013 There are a bunch of coolant pipes that can corrode through. Ill post a photo later if I can find it. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted April 11, 2013 Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 A piece of advice from a former 91 Seville owner. Check out your radiator side tanks. They are plastic and known to crack. I bet there is a vertical 2-3 inches long crack across the ribs at the upper part of driver side tank on the side facing the grill. Check the passenger side too. Use a flushlight. The cracks open up as the temperature goes up. The radiator hoses are supposed to be hard and hot after thermostat opens. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted April 11, 2013 Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 To add - if the radiator tank is cracked, a radiator shop can replace the tank for less than half the cost of a new radiator if the core is not leaking. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 11, 2013 Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 I have looked all over for the scan of the coolant pipes on the 4.9 but was unable to find it. If you need it, Ill scan it from my 91 Seville manual. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyUK1 Posted April 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 Today I topped up the coolant and then took it for a 5 mile run.The temperature went up to 217 and then cooled down again and it went up and down as it should as I was in start/stop traffic.I stopped the car and looked underneath a few times but there was no coolant coming onto the road. After leaving it parked for several hours checked underneath the car and still no coolant leaks underneath car. On checking the coolant level it has gone down again by about an inch in radiator and overflow tank, Havent had achance to check the radiator side tanks yet for leaks, but would have thought if leak was anywhere in radiator it would drip onto road while car was running? I took to a place that fits radiators and he looked around, felt the top radiator hose and he said it felt very firm and pressurised. I then took it to another garage(Volkswagen specialist) who tried to test the gasses for head gasket but his kit wouldn't fit overflow tank to test but he also said the top hose was a lot harder than it should be and he thought the system was too pressurised. So it is losing coolant and the system is ( according to mechanics ) too pressurised. Any ideas where I should go from here?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted April 11, 2013 Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 Today I topped up the coolant and then took it for a 5 mile run.The temperature went up to 217 and then cooled down again and it went up and down as it should as I was in start/stop traffic.I stopped the car and looked underneath a few times but there was no coolant coming onto the road. After leaving it parked for several hours checked underneath the car and still no coolant leaks underneath car. On checking the coolant level it has gone down again by about an inch in radiator and overflow tank, Havent had achance to check the radiator side tanks yet for leaks, but would have thought if leak was anywhere in radiator it would drip onto road while car was running? I took to a place that fits radiators and he looked around, felt the top radiator hose and he said it felt very firm and pressurised. I then took it to another garage(Volkswagen specialist) who tried to test the gasses for head gasket but his kit wouldn't fit overflow tank to test but he also said the top hose was a lot harder than it should be and he thought the system was too pressurised. So it is losing coolant and the system is ( according to mechanics ) too pressurised. Any ideas where I should go from here?? Forget about the "hardness of the hoses" - they are supposed to be hard under pressure.... Diagnosing the cooling system by squeezing the hoses is ridiculous at best unless the hose is so weak that it bursts when squeezed or you see a giant hernia bulge in the hose...LOL. The top hose is probably the inlet and will be the hottest and under the most pressure. A split in the side tank of the radiator will seep enough coolant that it will vaporize. You might be able to see it leaking as the car cools down or look for whitish residue on the side tank. Get a cooling system pressure tester - In the US, they can be borrowed from the larger parts stores for just a deposit. With the car cold, pressurize the cooling system and then inspect the entire system for leaks. The 4.9 engine is NOT known for headgasket failures - it is completely different than the Northstar. Some have had intake gasket failures but I do not believe that is your issue since you do not see any coolant in the oil. Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyUK1 Posted April 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 Thanks Kevin (KHE) for your advice on this . I will try and get the cooling system pressure tested tomorrow if I can. The thing i'm unsure about is why did the radiator hose come off in the first place-if there is a leak in the system somewhere would that cause a pressure build up and would that force the hose off of the top of radiator? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 11, 2013 Report Share Posted April 11, 2013 Could have simply been a loose clamp that over time allowed the hose to 'walk'. Did you replace the clamp?, the old clamp could have been bad Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.