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Need ride height sensor info for my fleetwood


CoupeDTS

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I would be curious on where the wire got rubbed through. My bet is it is somewhere between the compressor and the bulkhead connector where the wire enters the interior of the car. Glad you got it fixed though.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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yes I was worried other wires might be damaged too. But the wires from the sensor I found traveled all together to the compressor and release valve up front and the release works fine along with all the power wires going to the sensor so somehow its just that one wire. Didnt feel like tearing up the carpet and trim to find that wire so I said the heck with it and took 10 minutes to run a new wire lol.

Ive never had a problem like this on a car where it wasnt a bad part but a bad wire somewhere. Its really stubborn like yall said :(

I was worried I would ruin these newer shocks I have in there. They say not to run air shocks below 20psi because bottoming them out can damage them. Which is kind of stupid when you think about all the ways they could fail or bottom out but I went a couple weeks with the system not working and they seem to still work. Maybe monroe improved on that area.

Cant wait for my service manual to get in :ups:

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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  • 1 year later...

I realize this is an old post, but was hoping for some help with my 95 rear wheel drive Fleetwood. The ELS has the car completely maxed out (shocks fully extended), and won't exhaust to level the car back down. Compressor seems to work. Over time as the car sits (I only drive it on occasion) the shocks have come down slightly, but not completely. This is my first caddy, and first time to have an ELS system. I would like to keep it stock if possible. It's hard troubleshooting without a manual. The Chilton's manual at the auto parts store doesn't show this system. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Kenny

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I realize this is an old post, but was hoping for some help with my 95 rear wheel drive Fleetwood. The ELS has the car completely maxed out (shocks fully extended), and won't exhaust to level the car back down. Compressor seems to work. Over time as the car sits (I only drive it on occasion) the shocks have come down slightly, but not completely. This is my first caddy, and first time to have an ELS system. I would like to keep it stock if possible. It's hard troubleshooting without a manual. The Chilton's manual at the auto parts store doesn't show this system. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Kenny

The level sensor arm is adjustable, you could first inspect that. If you put 100lbs in the trunk the compressor should kick on, then take the weight out and you should hear it exhaust. If none of that works I can get you diagrams to start testing wires to see what signals are or aren't being sent

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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I had taken the sensor arm off, and moved up and down with no response (which would simulate putting weight in the trunk). Is the exhaust valve built into the compressor? Or is there a solenoid somewhere that I could check? I can't see much of the compressor area from under the hood. What's the best way to get to it? And, any diagrams would be appreciated..

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I had taken the sensor arm off, and moved up and down with no response (which would simulate putting weight in the trunk). Is the exhaust valve built into the compressor? Or is there a solenoid somewhere that I could check? I can't see much of the compressor area from under the hood. What's the best way to get to it? And, any diagrams would be appreciated..

The compressor is in the front of the car in the '94-'96 Fleetwoods - forward of the front tire - behind the chrome trim.

I have diagrams for the '93 car but the '93's were slightly different than the '94-'96.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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There is a plastic trim under the bumper that needs removed then the compressor assembly (with dump valve) is held up by 3 bolts and a couple wire harnesses. If you want to take it down to study it you can but there are a lot of wires running to it, you'll have to study the wire diagram to check if the dump is working.

Also moving the arm won't necessarily trigger the system. It has cycles of 15 seconds and other longer cycles to combat changing heights.

My guess would be your problem is like mine where a wire broke somewhere between sensor and compressor but yours is the dump wire and mine was the compressor kick on signal wire. Or the dump is bad. There is a relay for the compressor but I didn't see one for the dump, it shouldn't need much current to trigger.

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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Looks like the white wire from the sensor to the compressor controls the exhaust air. Ground that wire up by the compressor and see if it dumps.

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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According to the 1997 FSM, pages 8A-42-6 and 8A-43-2, all the ride height sensors are hooked up to the CVRSS module, which is located at the "Right hand rear of the passenger compartment, behind the rear seat, on the electronics bay." They all have an 8 Volt reference signal provided by the CVRSS module on the GRN/BLK wire, a ground on the BLK wire, and they provide a signal on a TAN/WHT wire.

Don't back-probe the connectors or you may damage either the sensor or the CVRSS module, but you can check for 8 Volts on the GRN/BLK wire and see if there are 0 Volts (ground) on the BLK wire. If you have a DVM that is rated for use with static-sensitive solid state circuits, you can check the voltage on the TAN/WHT wire as you move the sensor.

Ethe ELC for the Deville has a schematic on page 8A-42-4 and 05. Your Fleetwood may differ but probably not. The compressor and solenoid are controlled by the CVRSS module. The motor is controlled by a relay that is switched by the CVRSS module, and the solenoid is switched directly by the CVRSS module without a relay. The motor and relay get their power from the 30 Amp ELC Circuit Breaker, which is in the ELC Maxifuse Block. The ELC Maxifuse block is near the eleectronics bay behind the rear seat. The CVRSS module gets its power from two 10 Amp fuses, both labeled RSS FUSE, in the trunk compartment fuse block; one is always hot, the other is hot in run and off (but not in start, bulb test, lock, or accessory). Those voltages come from Maxifuses.

I just perused this thread and KennyD piggy-backed on a thread with an apparently identical problem. Nowhere do I see the OBD codes listed. If we have the OBD codes, we can quickly identify ride height, solenoid, and other electrical problems and issues that can be detected by the many OBD sensors on the car.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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My 96 d body fleetwood fsm doesn't say anything about a module, just lists the sensor and compressor assembly with relay and fuse along with dummy lights. The yellow wire from the sensor grounds and kicks on the relay for the compressor, the white wire grounds and signals the exhaust dump valve. The trouble shooting suggests the same thing I did, ground that white wire and listen for the exhaust solenoid to click, test it by the sensor and by the compressor to see if there is a short in the wire somewhere.

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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This implies to me that the Fleetwood uses a $1.75 microprocessor in the height sensors with $0.15 IGFETs to ground the solenoids. Works for me. Sorry, my FSM covers 1997 Seville/Eldorado/Deville.

The exhaust valve is built into the compressor (in the E/K/Deville) and is the solenoid. There is an air filter in the path too. If everything electrical checks out, the air exhaust path may be clogged. Look in the FSM for a way to clean the assembly.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Thanks for the input guys. The white wire sounds like the easiest, and first thing I would like to try. It may be Friday before I can get to it. I didn't know about the 15 second cycle thing...that would make a difference. I haven't had a chance to try and run the codes yet, but seems I read or heard someone having issues, and no codes, so I haven't tried to run them. I took the sensor apart, and looked inside....no obvious signs of a problem. Of course there's nothing mechanical inside...all electronics sealed up. I can't imagine that would be the problem. I'm hoping maybe just a broke wire somewhere as "Old Timer" mentioned. After that I'll dig deeper if necessary....I'm no electrician, so I'll need some more detailed assistance. I'll report back on my discoveries. Thanks again for the useful insight....

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If there's no module, there will be no code. However, it's always a good idea to run the OBD codes to make sure that you aren't missing something easy.

Codes are thrown when a program in a module finds a problem in the car. Codes rarely mean that there is a problem with the module. An example for the EK platform (my FSM, not the Fleetwood platform) for C1738, "ELC exhaust solenoid valve short to ground or open circuit" is thrown by the CVRSS module when the module measures the voltage at the terminal it uses to ground the solenoid to exhaust air from the rear shocks. If the solenoid is OFF, the voltage should be near battery voltage, but if it's at or near ground, a short or broken wire to the ground is likely and the module throws a code and puts it on the network. When the code is CURRENT, the CVRSS module will stop the leveling activity (the pump won't turn on so the rear end won't be hiked up!) and the dash light "Service ride control" will turn on. This is in the EK FSM page 3G-49, which ends with the paragraph

"Only electrical problems with the exhaust solenoid valve are flagged. Pneumatic blockage problems do not set a code, but the CVRSS control module shuts off the exhaust function if no progress is made, or if excessive run time occurs. Recovery is not attempted until ignition is cycled OFF and ON.

NOTE: Check for disconnected or damaged air lines and replace if found.

I do realize that your 1996 FSM for the Fleetwood does not mention a CVRSS module; I'm just using an example of how a code helps find a problem but isn't an indication that a module is the problem. Modules solve problems and make things simpler to maintain.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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No CVRSS module in a '93-'96 Fleetwood. The level sensor is a potentiometer from what I can remember. No codes will be set for the ELC system on that car.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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My 96 d body fleetwood fsm doesn't say anything about a module, just lists the sensor and compressor assembly with relay and fuse along with dummy lights. The yellow wire from the sensor grounds and kicks on the relay for the compressor, the white wire grounds and signals the exhaust dump valve. The trouble shooting suggests the same thing I did, ground that white wire and listen for the exhaust solenoid to click, test it by the sensor and by the compressor to see if there is a short in the wire somewhere.

I'm hoping for it to be something fairly simple like this......or like when the truck lid pulldown wasn't working and I just tapped on the motor while depressing the switch...been working ever since..lol If it's not raining tomorrow I'll give that white wire a test..

However, why would the compressor keep it jacked up? It seems like if the car is already riding high, the compressor would not get any signal to put any more air in. Yet, when I drove it the other day....it had bled down some from sitting about a week....and the compressor (during the drive) raised the car back up. It's not "maxed out" to where the shocks are fully extended, but it's way high....

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The compressor might be tripping on when it shouldn't, or not be tripping off. More likely the exhaust solenoid isn't turning on, or the exhaust air path is clogged, with clogging the more likely of the two.

But, if it bleeds down over several days and hikes up when you start the car and drive it, the problem is more likely with a height sensor.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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However, why would the compressor keep it jacked up? It seems like if the car is already riding high, the compressor would not get any signal to put any more air in. Yet, when I drove it the other day....it had bled down some from sitting about a week....and the compressor (during the drive) raised the car back up. It's not "maxed out" to where the shocks are fully extended, but it's way high....

A few seconds into the ignition cycle, the height sensor will command the compressor to run for a short duration (while energizing briefly the exhaust solenoid) to ensure the system operates at the minimum air pressure (assuming a massive leak does not exist). This feature was added to ELC height sensors sometime in the mid-'80s. If your exhaust solenoid is not functional, ELC pressure will increase in proportion to the number of ignition cycles, and the only relief will be through system leakage or the exhaust valve (150+ psi mechanical limit).

___________________________________________________

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However, why would the compressor keep it jacked up? It seems like if the car is already riding high, the compressor would not get any signal to put any more air in. Yet, when I drove it the other day....it had bled down some from sitting about a week....and the compressor (during the drive) raised the car back up. It's not "maxed out" to where the shocks are fully extended, but it's way high....

A few seconds into the ignition cycle, the height sensor will command the compressor to run for a short duration (while energizing briefly the exhaust solenoid) to ensure the system operates at the minimum air pressure (assuming a massive leak does not exist). This feature was added to ELC height sensors sometime in the mid-'80s. If your exhaust solenoid is not functional, ELC pressure will increase in proportion to the number of ignition cycles, and the only relief will be through system leakage or the exhaust valve (150+ psi mechanical limit).

Thanks Kevin, that's interesting. I finally got to mess with it a little today. So, I took the access panels off to see what I could see. I pulled the air line from the compressor and air released from the system, but the rear end didn't immediately go down. I pressed down on the back end, and bounced it a little, and the compressor turned on for like 5 seconds. I did this several times. The compressor seemed to never run more than 5 seconds at a time. At one point I just leaned on the rear end to keep the shocks depressed, and the compressor then seemed to run for quite a bit longer. I noticed at some point that it seemed the driver side of the car was slightly higher than the passenger side. I never did succeed in grounding either the white wire or the yellow wire, but I probably wasn't doing it right.

So, I still need to figure out how, and where to ground the exhaust wire, or otherwise test the exhaust valve which is definately not functioning. And, in light of what you said about the compressor turning on every time the ignition turns on, I'm wondering if the exhaust hasn't worked since I've had the car (in August 2012), and it just took it awhile to press it all the way up. The car is sitting lower now after playing with it for some time, but I didn't resolve anything. I may have a few different issues going on at the same time. Why would it seem like not as much air is crossing over to the passenger side? I didn't drive it to see if it levelled out. My only conclusions at this point are that the compressor runs, but the exhaust valve is not functioning. I wouldn't think the discharge line would be stopped up since all the air from the shocks seem to rush out when I disconnect the line. The intake lines look like they've seen better days.

Sorry this is wordy, and scattered, I just wanted to throw it all out there and see what your thoughts are.

Kenny

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You might need to disconnect systematically each air line fitting to check for blockages; after removing the line from the compressor, there should be no residual air pressure in any of the lines or shock bladders. It is also possible the height sensor arm is bent or out of adjustment. After verifying there's no residual air pressure in the rear shocks, measure the rear standing height while parked on a level surface, say from the ground to the lower edge of the rear fender skirt at the wheel centreline, at both sides. Does it have the FE1 or FE2 suspension?

___________________________________________________

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You might need to disconnect systematically each air line fitting to check for blockages; after removing the line from the compressor, there should be no residual air pressure in any of the lines or shock bladders. It is also possible the height sensor arm is bent or out of adjustment. After verifying there's no residual air pressure in the rear shocks, measure the rear standing height while parked on a level surface, say from the ground to the lower edge of the rear fender skirt at the wheel centreline, at both sides. Does it have the FE1 or FE2 suspension?

Not sure which suspension?? How can I tell that? And, I'm a little confused at why there shouldn't be any residual air pressure. If the compressor has the system full of air, and you disconnect the discharge line coming from the compressor, why wouldn't air be released?? The height sensor arm appears to be fine, and doesn't appear that it's adjustment has moved in any fashion. I'm assuming the only adjustments that can be made are by manually adjusting the arm connections?? I don't have any information on this system. The car is sitting just the way I left it last night...looking more like normal height, except for the slight difference in height from one side to the other. I'll start and drive the car later to see how it acts. Thanks for the insight. Any other comments, suggestions appreciated...

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You might need to disconnect systematically each air line fitting to check for blockages; after removing the line from the compressor, there should be no residual air pressure in any of the lines or shock bladders. It is also possible the height sensor arm is bent or out of adjustment. After verifying there's no residual air pressure in the rear shocks, measure the rear standing height while parked on a level surface, say from the ground to the lower edge of the rear fender skirt at the wheel centreline, at both sides. Does it have the FE1 or FE2 suspension?

Not sure which suspension?? How can I tell that?

There should be a code on the service parts label on the inside of the deck lid. Look for the three digid code FE1 or FE2. Unless the car has the trailer towing package with heavy duty ride package, it will most likely have the FE1 suspension.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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There should be a sticker with all your production options on the bottom side of your spare tire cover. I would take a picture of it and keep it handy on the computer for reference. Look through the option list for the suspension options FE1, FE2, or FE3. I think FE3, the "sport" suspension option, is only on the "T" models (STS, ETC, DTS, CTS, etc.) so you would have FE1 or FE2.

If the car is lopsided, then you probably have clogging in the tubing for the air bags on the rear shocks because, unless you have a seriously one-sided heavy load somewhere in the car, the rear shocks have a different air pressure in them.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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There should be a sticker with all your production options on the bottom side of your spare tire cover. I would take a picture of it and keep it handy on the computer for reference. Look through the option list for the suspension options FE1, FE2, or FE3. I think FE3, the "sport" suspension option, is only on the "T" models (STS, ETC, DTS, CTS, etc.) so you would have FE1 or FE2.

If the car is lopsided, then you probably have clogging in the tubing for the air bags on the rear shocks because, unless you have a seriously one-sided heavy load somewhere in the car, the rear shocks have a different air pressure in them.

The RWD '93-'96 Fleetwoods have the SPO sticker on the inside of the deck lid (trunk). The spare tire does not have a hard cover and there is no well for it to sit in. The spare is on a shelf towards the front of the trunk compartment and it is covered with a piece of carpet that has elastic at the underside to keep it in place.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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Oh.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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There is a flat wafer style connector that goes to the compressor assembly, mine hangs below the driverside of the compressor, it has maybe 6 wires connecting in a line, the thin white wire is the one you want to tap into and ground. You can use your multimeter probe wire and stick it into where the wire goes into the harness and then ground the other end. You should hear the exhaust solenoid atleast click or release air.

Another thought I'm having if your car sits so high the compressor only needs to turn on for 5 seconds to fill up is maybe someone replaced your springs with ones that are not used on air ride setups, like from a caprice. Fleetwood springs are soft and need the extra lift from the air shocks to sit level. Maybe it never gets low enough to need to exhaust. Testing the exhaust will be next step.

I have seen soooo many fleetwoods over many years so I use a way to judge how a fleetwood sits in the back whether its level or sagging from a broken level control. On the back wheels look at the top of the center cap and get your eyes level with it, then the fender skirt part that is closest to that top part of the center cap should be about an inch to 1.5" above the center cap. Seeing fleetwoods where the fender skirt is at the same level as the top of that center cap it is obvious the system has no air. Yours you say is sitting high so how much higher over the center cap would you say it is??

* 1966 Deville Convertible

* 2007 Escalade ESV Black on Black

* 1996 Fleetwood Brougham Black on Black V4P -Gone
* 1983 Coupe Deville Street/Show Lowrider -Gone

* 1970 Calais 4dr Hardtop GONE
* 2000 Deville DTS - Silver with Black Leather and SE grille GONE
* 1999 Seville STS - Pearl Red GONE

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