steveo412 Posted October 10, 2010 Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 hi all,i have a problem ,i seen in a post that bobbyfisher had,i think i have the same problem,here is what he said, The Northstar head gasket rarely leaks externally, so your leak is suspect. If you are standing looking over the driver side fender, the water pump is installed in a crossover that attaches to both heads in FOUR places with seals. THOSE seals go bad and you will get a coolant leak at those FOUR locations, it will run down the side of the block, and can run down the crossover to drip off of it. ,,i cant find the leak its runing down the tanny and just driping underneth any help would be good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 10, 2010 Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 The best way to find a leak that is not easily traceable is to pressurize the cooling system. You can use a dye in it also to help find the leak. Try SEARS to see if you can find a pressurizer. If your water pump is sealed at the body seal and its not leaking at the shaft, a leak can be caused by the crossover seals, the 6 inch by pass / heater hose by the stat, the two green hoses, the heater pipes, the TB preheater circuit, the stat seal, tank, heater hoses, radiator end tanks, radiator hoses, alternator cooler if equipped, and cap if not holding pressure Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 it all started with a overheat,,,i got it home after a couple hours of stop and go,,and found out i had a leak in my coolant res,,i put in a new and a new thermastat,and cap,,started it up and ran fine,but was losing coolant,,i got under it and looked every where ,and i couldnt see where its coming from,its runing down the tranny,,so i need to get a presser tester?and die?,and give that a try,,,,i think the water pump seal is leaking and the cover,,thanks bobby for any input Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 10, 2010 Report Share Posted October 10, 2010 What side of the car are you seeing the leak on? Are you sure you tighted the hoses at the bottom of the new tank? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 hey bobby,,its the driver side,,nothing leaks from the res,,i think its the water pump housing or the crossover,,it looks like its by the head or around the housing,,im thinking i shound just replace the water pump and gaskets and see if that works out,,,should be under 100 for all parts,,whatcha think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 11, 2010 Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 Don't throw parts at it. There is no reason to replace the water pump if its not leaking, but you could just replace the water pump body seal, that will save some cash. My guess is that you are leaking at the crossover seals, for some reason, I cant find my thread on my crossover job, maybe it was purged The crossover job is a hard job Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 your a good man,,your allways helping out thanks,,i will do what u said and just do the housing,i think thats what it is,can i get that gasket at napa or do i need anything special?,,thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 11, 2010 Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 Its not likely that your local parts house will sell this seal, you will probably need the dealer to get one, but try You might try adding the cooling supplement tablets also after replacing the body seal, to see what happens, it might slow the seal leak if you have one Remember you will need a water pump R&R tool Here are photos of the crossover and my damaged seals from a 96, I was not leaking badly, I just smelled coolant and ran a little warmer than spec Old seals Crossover, note water pump location bad seal face of crossover connection, you can see the supplement tablet collected seal damage Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 looks like im in for a hall,,im a layed off welder so i think i have the time,,i will try the tabs first,the leak is pretty bad,,its not puring out but its driping good,,do them seals bolt in the head?cause i think thats where im seeing it, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 11, 2010 Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 looks like im in for a hall,,im a layed off welder so i think i have the time,,i will try the tabs first,the leak is pretty bad,,its not puring out but its driping good,,do them seals bolt in the head?cause i think thats where im seeing it, Those 4 seals, go between the crossover that I show you above and the two heads If you look closely, you will see that there are 8 bolt holes in the crossover, 4 on each side. The two lower bolts on the rear head are a bear to get at and you might get them from below The problem with doing this job is that there is an electrical conduit that must be moved, not fun Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 yup thats where its leaking right at the head,im allmost mechanically inclined so i think i will be ok,,can u give me a list of stuff i need please if u could,, them pics are helping me thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 11, 2010 Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 I need to locate my thread on this, for some reason, I can not search back more than two years, that will be helpful. Let me think about this a bit. I actually detached and moved the electrical conduit that wraps around the front of the engine and connects to the relay center You might also need to remove (after marking its location) the PRNDL selector switch, its in the way of the lower bolts You have a 94, its probably very different than my 96, do you have a factory service manual? Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 11, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2010 yes i have one,i ordered the 4 gaskets from the dealer,,i also got the water pump and the 2 other gaskets i needed,i could start tearing it down right?i can send some photos if that helps,i would just like to have steps to do,so i know whats next lol,,,any input is good thanks guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 hey,,im down to the electrical wires that are blocking the lower bolts,its been a total of 3 hours so far,,its not as bad as it sounded,but im not done yet lol,i just went out and bought a hanes book,there nice to have,,i will post my progress,, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 hey,,im down to the electrical wires that are blocking the lower bolts,its been a total of 3 hours so far,,its not as bad as it sounded,but im not done yet lol,i just went out and bought a hanes book,there nice to have,,i will post my progress,, Return the Haines book its a little more than fireplace kindling and a total waste of money Do you have a Factory Service Manual? Don't count your chickens before they are hatched, I didn't say the job was impossible, I said it was tough. As an example, Cadillac charges about $750 for this job, you know the cost of the seals right?, the remainder is labor at their $100 per hour rates. I removed that conduit with the PCM and relay modules attached and laid it on the fender, at the time I was lowering my carriage to do side pan tranny work, have fun Here are the two heater pipes that wrap around the rear of the engine, you may need to disconnect the 'green' hoses that attach to them. Those are silicone hoses that cost about $16, so keep them in place they resist heat better than rubber Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 This was my engine compartment when I was done with the job, it looked beautiful, I replaced the dogbones, crossover seals, cleaned my TB, replaced my heater pipes, cleaned every relay contact and module, the TCC solenoid, Pressure solenoid, ISS sensor, tranny filters and associated seals/gaskets, side pan seal, tranny mount, ball joint, oil level sensor, oil pressure switch, control arm bushings and strut rod bushings in one job My throttle body looked beautiful after soaking and polishing it This is a scary photo, my neighbor didnt think my car would ever run again after seeing the PCM on top of the fender and this, The pump is visible right there, we have had a member replace his pump due to whining, slow engagement, etc This is the main drive chain, the ISS sensor is circled Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 your right it gets tougher as i go bodybyfisher,,i returned the book,,does the throttle body have to come off,cause i didnt get that gasket,what should i clean these parts with?thanks steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 i ran into a problem,,what do i do with the fuel lines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 your right it gets tougher as i go bodybyfisher,,i returned the book,,does the throttle body have to come off,cause i didnt get that gasket,what should i clean these parts with?thanks steve I can not remember if the TB HAD to come off, I wanted to thoroughly clean mine, so I pulled it off. Here is what the seal behind it looks like, keep in mind that mine was a 96, yours is undoubtedly different, I know you have an ISC motor. Notice the black primordial goo in the intake, that is normal, its condensed EGR gases Closeup Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 i ran into a problem,,what do i do with the fuel lines? Use a proper quick disconnect tool, detach them and put them to the side. OBVIOUSLY DO NOT turn the key on, you will spew fuel!!! You should have the battery disconnected I have this set http://www.etoolcart...etlis37000.aspx Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 ok,,but im not sure where i disconect them at, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 This is difficult, because I don't know the 94, but I do believe you have quick disconnect fitting Follow the fuel line from the fuel rail, it runs downward under the drivers seat area, you will find a quick disconnect fitting, use the tool to disconnect it. Maybe someone with a 94 will chime in, Ill look in my 95 manual Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 ok i found them,,i got the napa tool for ac and fuel lines and it didnt work,,its to thick,,so i will go up the street tomorrow and get a different set,thanks steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 ok i found them,,i got the napa tool for ac and fuel lines and it didnt work,,its to thick,,so i will go up the street tomorrow and get a different set,thanks steve See if you can get a nice set, like the one I linked you to above Sears has them Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveo412 Posted October 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 ok,fuel lines done,,i still got the green hoses to do,then i will unbolt the crossover,my progress will be posted,,i cant thank u enough bodybyfish,,your allways there to help,,,,,,steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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