scott y Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 Maybe this car's not such a good idea.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 ditto to the comments above, aholes remove the thermostat, doing so will make matters worse. Please stay on track with this, we are helping as much as possible, ignore the aholes behind the curtin (the so called knowledgeable mechanics and parts guys), please be patient, we are VERY knowledgable regarding the NS and you do not appear to have head gasket problems. FIX THE LEAK first, replace the stat and see what happens Check the purge line for flow Use 50/50 dexcool to water (distilled is best), dont buy premix its a RIP OFF Use the cooling supplement Use an AC Delco stat Let the system stabilize, see if it looses coolant or overheats, then we go further Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 Roger that. I DO appreciate any and all input, advice and suggestions you have all given me. I ordered the GM thermostat, thermostat housing, assorted gaskets required, will be here this week. Updates as I have them. Again, THANK YOU all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 update: The thermostat housing cover came, and I ordered the "missing" thermostat and gasket also, and put it all in and now am just waiting on the arrival of the coolant surge/overflow tank which will be here tomorrow. Then I will fill it with the correct water/antifreeze mix and set out on a local drive where I am not more than a few miles from home if it starts acting up again. I did also blow out the purge line with an air hose and there was a "concerning amount" (read: some, more than I would have anticipated) of oily black sludge in the hose but it didn't appear to be plugged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 explain how you blew out the purge line. we have been instructed NEVER to use air to blow out the purge line. the choke point is NOT the purge line itself but its the bolt with a HOLE in it. Disconnect the line from the bolt with a hole in it, take that bolt OUT, and clean the bolt, NEVER use AIR, the LINE is NOT the problem, the BOLT with the HOLE in it by the TB is the problem, Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 well, its too late now, i already did, i guess we will see if it impacts the cooling system or temperatures after the fact. its hard to know everything you are supposed to do on a vehicle you haven't worked on before, its all a learning curve, rising rapidly. regardless, i appreciate the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 well, its too late now, i already did, i guess we will see if it impacts the cooling system or temperatures after the fact. its hard to know everything you are supposed to do on a vehicle you haven't worked on before, its all a learning curve, rising rapidly. regardless, i appreciate the info. Explain what you did, you disconnected both sides and blew it out with air?, if you did, that is OK If you blew air into the passenger side without disconnecting the driver side connection at the TB cooling loop, that is bad If you did not remove the "bolt with a hole in it" and clean it out, do so. You have NOT commented on whether you did or whether you understand what I am referring to, when I say "bolt with a hole in it", please advise Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 I disconnected the line on both sides of the engine, the line that is running OVER the engine and disconnected it at the surge tank AND TB area, and blew air into that. with the surge tank off, completely disconnected and all other lines open, I put the air nozzle into where the aforementioned line connects and gave a short burst and it blew water out the other (passenger) side. i reblew air thru the first line and looked to see if i could see daylight thru it. I couldn't, studied it, teested it with airline again and it clearly was blowing air thru it. I reattached it and that was it. I do know what bolt you mean but I wont say that I know where it is or how to clean it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 Ok, when you remove the hose off of the TB circuit, you remove it from the 'bolt with a hole in it".... Remove that hose, then using a 15mm wrench, remove that bolt, and clean out the center of that bolt (orfice if you will)... let us know if that was clogged... Mike Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 1) i cannot find ANY 15 mm bolt near where the purge line goes into the tb. i need a photo or diagram. 2) how much dex cool (gallons) does the 1997 Cadillac Deville with the 4.6 Northstar take? (not liters, gallons) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 Here is a photo of the area, this is from a 96, I dont think it changed much for 97. See the red circle to the right of the upper radiator hose connection. That is where the purge line connects to the TB preheater to stop icing, disconnect that hose, and behind that is a bolt that much come out., you will notice that that hose is attached to the nipple of that bolt. Now, yours may not be identical but that is what you are looking for. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 ok. I pulled the hose off that bolt and water came gushing out of the filled system, I ran a thick copper wire thru it and it did not increase in volume so I am guessing its fine. I am going to start the car and let it sit in the driveway idling on a fresh spot so I can id leaks for a few and then drive it if it seems pressure tight and the temp isnt shooting up. more info after the test run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 well, it did ok sitting in the driveway, idled fine for 10 min so I took it on a 5 mile trip around the lake. by the time I got to the other side of the lake it was climbing into the 233 and up. I got home and it was 244 but it was by the Grace of God. On the passenger front side it is either leaking from the furthest forward (of the car) pulley area or the radiator, I cant tell yet. When I stop it is running straight out from the passengers end of the radiator. Running. Not dripping. There is a lot of steam which is to be expected but it seems like either the radiator is bad or ? I cant see any specific leaks at this point. am i frustrated? hell yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 the problem with sticking things into that orfice is that you dislodge it and then it gets stuck again. You need to PULL that bolt out and LOOK AT IT CLOSELY. I had this stuck into a car I inspected, it was in deep and caused overheating. That hole is the air release of the system and if it clogs the water pump will cavitate because of air Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 8, 2010 Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 well, it did ok sitting in the driveway, idled fine for 10 min so I took it on a 5 mile trip around the lake. by the time I got to the other side of the lake it was climbing into the 233 and up. I got home and it was 244 but it was by the Grace of God. On the passenger front side it is either leaking from the furthest forward (of the car) pulley area or the radiator, I cant tell yet. When I stop it is running straight out from the passengers end of the radiator. Running. Not dripping. There is a lot of steam which is to be expected but it seems like either the radiator is bad or ? I cant see any specific leaks at this point. am i frustrated? hell yes. Relax you need to pin point your leak Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 8, 2010 I understand that the bolt needs to come out, however the reason it hasn't been out before and may not be out for a while is that someone rounded it off, so I went with the second best option and when I pulled the hose off, water came rushing out and when I inserted the wire nothing changed. I tried putting a pair of vice grips on it, I tried penetrating oil, I did everything other than take a torch to it, which, I dont have. It wouldnt budge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 9, 2010 Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 I understand that the bolt needs to come out, however the reason it hasn't been out before and may not be out for a while is that someone rounded it off, so I went with the second best option and when I pulled the hose off, it came rushing out and when I inserted the wire nothing changed. I tried putting a pair of vice grips on it, I tried penetrating oil, I did everything other than take a torch to it, which, I dont have. It wouldnt budge. That needs to come out, find a way, get a new one from a scrap yard, but it needs to come out. You said WHEN I INSERTED A WIRE water gushed out, if it was CLEAR, water would have gushed out BEFORE you stuck the wire in.... get it out and clean it and replace that bolt..... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 You aren't reading what I write. I said that water came out of it when I p ulled the hose off, and the flow didn't change after I ran the wire in and out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 9, 2010 Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 You aren't reading what I write. I said that water came out of it when I p ulled the hose off, and the flow didn't change after I ran the wire in and out. I get lazy once in a while, episodes like this usually cures the laziness, sorry I get obsessed with overheating problems to fix them if you know what I mean If you can get someone to pressurize your coolant system or borrow or buy a cooling system pressurizer it will help locate that leak you are experiencing Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 I do understand. I fell asleep early tonite and woke up thinking about it, as in, where IS that leak... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 9, 2010 Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 I do understand. I fell asleep early tonite and woke up thinking about it, as in, where IS that leak... lol At least I am not obsessing alone, Find that leak, no doubt that is causing your problem, coolant loss and no pressure it will boil at a lower temp. The radiator side tanks are plastic and they crack, you can get a decent aftermarket radiator at a reasonable price if you need one. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 Without going into boring details, I have a bad neck and its making my finding the leak tough. I know its on the front passengers side and its not leaking when its not under pressure, only when its running, it seems. I do need to find a pressurizing system so I can find it easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 Ok. I filled the surge tank with just water and watched, and after filling it full, a slow but steady drip started at the very bottom of the passenger side bracket UNDER the radiator. In studying the radiator, the bolts that hold it in are there but the radiator is not firmly bolted in, due to the plastic breaking off and the bolts are still in the appropriate holes, meaning that the radiator is moving while the vehicle is running or driving and with the plastic frame, my best guess is that its seen better days. I am ordering another one, oh well, at least it will have mostly new coolant system parts if I ever find the final leak. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 9, 2010 Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 You'll never know if your overheating problem will go away until you find all the leaks. Make sure you balance your coolant 50/50 and use the cooling supplement when you replace the radiator Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagneMan Posted October 9, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2010 Have any of you had supremely positive or negative experiences with the $60 Caddy radiators on ebay? Rock has them for $100+, is there a difference and if so, what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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