BodybyFisher Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 Ok, so I guess it's my turn to have cooling system problems. I drove about 20 miles to get my car inspected, didn't pay to much attention to my temp running about 212-215 thinking, it was 85 to 90 out. The car sat and idled for about 30 minutes while it was being inspected, all ok Coming home, I notice at 60 to 75 I am running 215 to 217, hmm, that is odd, cool air blowing through the radiator and all.. THEN, I hit traffic, not extended traffic either, and hit 231. The good thing was that it dropped back down to 217, so the rise was not uncontrollable. I did some creative navigating to get home as fast as possible. Lifted the hood, and nothing, its still cooling down, I want to check the coolant level. It does look like its leaking at the tank. About a week ago, I mentioned that I have a coolant smell. I noticed that my surge tank is leaking at the purge line nipple. I have not gotten a low coolant message, so I have kind of ignored it. Thermostat is one year old Heater pipes are one year old Green Hoses are one year old Fans running Upper and Lower hose one year old Radiator 1.5 years old Crossover gaskets one year old Heater hoses one year old Coolant changed one year ago Cap new one year ago Both tensioners less than two years old WP belt one year old Serp belt 1.5 years old WP 1.5 years old I must have lost coolant, but not enough to turn on LOW COOLANT message, and I must be losing system pressure. My fans were not blazing away, as I thought they should have been. No codes. I will be replacing the tank either with a junk yard tank or new tank if I can not find one in the scrap yard. Will call tomorrow to see how much a new tank is, I am within a long walk to a Caddy dealer. This will be an interesting case, if my temps are high because of a pressure leak at the tank. More to come. MrEldo97 I will say it for you, "check the coolant for combustion gases" there saved you some gloom and doom typing... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 Mike: Take several deep breaths. I'm surprised you would be alarmed about seeing a coolant temperature of 231 degrees. You observed the fans toggling into high speed which reduced the coolant temperature to 217 degrees. Exactly what I would expect on a hot and possibly humid summer day in traffic. Of course you should repair any leaks you identify. A heavy dose of Bar's Leaks powder (or your choice of product) can buy you some time do the repairs. Coolant temperature of 231 degrees is nowhere close to the danger point. In fact, coolant temperatures above 212 degrees are desirable to promote evaporation of crankcase contaminants. Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 Thanks Jim, I understand what you are saying but, these temps are unusual for me in any ambient temp, something has changed to cause this, it was only 88 out, typically at 60 I drop to 199 -205. I will advise. If this is due to my tank leaking pressure and some coolant, this will be a good thing to see.. As you know I have been running cool cool cool from all of the work I did, these temps are sudden. I was afraid I would blow the surge tank in traffic, that is why my blood pressure rose.. lol.. Thanks Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommysls Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 I hope what I have isn't catchy. Hopefully it's just your tank. Hows your heater core? Tommysls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 I hope what I have isn't catchy. Hopefully it's just your tank. Hows your heater core? Tommysls Thanks Tommy, I am sure its my tank, as you can see, I have replaced everything except my tank and heater core. The tank has a leak for about a month or two, I have been smelling coolant. I am about to go outside and see where the coolant level is, now that its cooled down. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, Pressure loss will affect rather the boiling point than the cooling ability of your system (unless you reached that boiling point). I would not worry because of a couple extra degrees. Replace that tank. Oh boy, your Deville keeps you busy! The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, Pressure loss will affect rather the boiling point than the cooling ability of your system (unless you reached that boiling point). I would not worry because of a couple extra degrees. Replace that tank. Oh boy, your Deville keeps you busy! It's not a vehicle its a hobby... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, Pressure loss will affect rather the boiling point than the cooling ability of your system (unless you reached that boiling point). I would not worry because of a couple extra degrees. Replace that tank. Oh boy, your Deville keeps you busy! It's not a vehicle its a hobby... A lot of hobby for the money! lol The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, Pressure loss will affect rather the boiling point than the cooling ability of your system (unless you reached that boiling point). I would not worry because of a couple extra degrees. Replace that tank. Oh boy, your Deville keeps you busy! It's not a vehicle its a hobby... A lot of hobby for the money! lol Hey, its better than a boat!, now there is an expensive hobby.. most people these days sit on them at their dock as they are too expensive to operate. It keeps me out of trouble, I could be into worse things I suppose.. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kens96 Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, I think your on the right track with the tank and system pressure. Recenlty had a simillar issue with the Eldo. Found out that the right side of the radiator that I replaced 14 months ago was steaming out dexcool under pressure in a small spot where the plastic side and core meet. Thought I was smelling coolant and I thought I would see wisps of steam coming from the passenger side fender but there was never any coolant puddling up on the frame or residual anywhere. Also noticed that I could remove the cap and not hear the pressure release while the engine was warm. Took about 5000 miles between dexcool topoffs before I got a low coolant message and like you the temp gauge would run up while in traffic. Drove me nuts! Had visions of having to do a timesert job. Just recently found it by having my wife revving the engine up and down with the AC off and carboard in front of the radiator to get the car as hot as we could. Finally saw where the leak was misting from. There was a bulge in the plastic side of the radiator and when hot enough it would seperate from the core, mist dexcool, then close up. Radiator was replaced under warrranty and I installed it about a month ago with fresh dexcool and 3 tabs. Haven't lost a drop since and sitting dead center on the temp gauge in traffic with outside temp in the high 90's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, I think your on the right track with the tank and system pressure. Recenlty had a simillar issue with the Eldo. Found out that the right side of the radiator that I replaced 14 months ago was steaming out dexcool under pressure in a small spot where the plastic side and core meet. Thought I was smelling coolant and I thought I would see wisps of steam coming from the passenger side fender but there was never any coolant puddling up on the frame or residual anywhere. Also noticed that I could remove the cap and not hear the pressure release while the engine was warm. Took about 5000 miles between dexcool topoffs before I got a low coolant message and like you the temp gauge would run up while in traffic. Drove me nuts! Had visions of having to do a timesert job. Just recently found it by having my wife revving the engine up and down with the AC off and carboard in front of the radiator to get the car as hot as we could. Finally saw where the leak was misting from. There was a bulge in the plastic side of the radiator and when hot enough it would seperate from the core, mist dexcool, then close up. Radiator was replaced under warrranty and I installed it about a month ago with fresh dexcool and 3 tabs. Haven't lost a drop since and sitting dead center on the temp gauge in traffic with outside temp in the high 90's. Thanks for confirming that Ken, I was hoping that i would run hotter due to system pressure loss. But I am NOT sure why that happens, but I was hoping that is what was going on. Adallak, raised a good issue, and scared me a bit, but your reply here makes me feel better. Ill post when I replace the tank on Friday. Anyone know what I new tank sells for?, someone recently mentioned over $100.. Thanks Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Well I just went out and confirmed that my coolant is low, I don't see any in the tank... Time for a tank, it has white stains down the side below the purge line nipple.. Thx What I don't understand is why the low coolant light did not come on... Ill have to disconnect the connector to see if maybe something is wrong with the sensor also, if the coolant is low enough to affect my temp, i would think the low coolant light should be on.. hmmm Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, I am surprised that you didn't have problems when you replaced the lines to the heater core. On my '94 SLS the da#m plastic nipples disintegrated as I was loosening the clamps! Plastic radiator, surge and heater tanks may be cost effective, but they sure don't last. Possibly your '96 heater core had metal tanks and nipples. I was dreading replacing the heater core, but was pleasantly surprised at the ease that job was to accomplish. With the exception of the heater hoses, everything was done from inside. I had to remove the glove box, but I was done and refilling the cooling system in less than an hour! The replacement heater core was less than $30.00 and had METAL tanks and nipples! Having a FSM is essential to these projects. Good Luck with your tank replacement. Hopefully that is all that is wrong. Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, I am surprised that you didn't have problems when you replaced the lines to the heater core. On my '94 SLS the da#m plastic nipples disintegrated as I was loosening the clamps! Plastic radiator, surge and heater tanks may be cost effective, but they sure don't last. Possibly your '96 heater core had metal tanks and nipples. I was dreading replacing the heater core, but was pleasantly surprised at the ease that job was to accomplish. With the exception of the heater hoses, everything was done from inside. I had to remove the glove box, but I was done and refilling the cooling system in less than an hour! The replacement heater core was less than $30.00 and had METAL tanks and nipples! Having a FSM is essential to these projects. Good Luck with your tank replacement. Hopefully that is all that is wrong. Britt The heater core connections were brass if I recall, I used a zip knife to cut the hoses so its a good thing they were brass, I didn't even know they came in plastic. Ill be more careful in the future using a zip knife Thanks Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Mike, When my '97 developed the hairline crack at the nipple, I never overheated, but I DID get a low coolant message, which likewise put my blood pressure right through the roof. I'd bet money you have failed level sensor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Well they want $120 for it at the dealer, I can't wait for gmotors or rockauto (they don't list it anyway), so I am off to buy it before they close. Thanks Ranger, I think you are right, maybe my sensor is not showing low coolant.. That is a scary type of failure if you ask me... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydone Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 hey mike i just went through this a few months ago my old tank was cracked at the nipple one member chimed back and fixed his with a little bit of jb weld i didnt find out until after i put in a new tank or i might of tried it no problems since looks like im getting that 99 with 27000 miles wondering what problems ill have with a garage queen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted July 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Thank Johnny, Regis also said for me to use JB Weld also, I am fixed on buying a new tank, this 12 year old tank owes me nothing and from what I understand, they go bad quite often. I would be afraid of a catastophic failure at some point on the Garden State Parkway at 1 AM. Well I went to the dealer and they had TWO tanks and BOTH were damaged Off to another dealer in the morning to get one. Well it took about 3/4 of a gallon, no doubt this is why I was running hot, oddly my low coolant message never showed.. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Thank Johnny, Regis also said for me to use JB Weld also, I am fixed on buying a new tank, this 12 year old tank owes me nothing and from what I understand, they go bad quite often. I would be afraid of a catastophic failure at some point on the Garden State Parkway at 1 AM. Well I went to the dealer and they had TWO tanks and BOTH were damaged Off to another dealer in the morning to get one. Well it took about 3/4 of a gallon, no doubt this is why I was running hot, oddly my low coolant message never showed.. Mike, those missing 3/4 gal of coolant made your engine to run hoter, not the loss of pressure, which by itself affects only the boiling point. The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted August 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Thanks Adallak that is what I would normally think, you are correct, but I was not getting a low coolant message because I think my low coolant sensor is shorted or stuck, so since I did not appear to have low coolant I was drawing at straws to try to understand the temp increase. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted August 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Things are not looking too good so far, my temps were really high today going to get the new tank, I got it for $105, just by asking, nice. I blew off going to the scrap yard. My temps were running higher than I normally experience, especially after adding 3/4 of a gallon of Dexcool last night. I hit 233 a few times in 94 degree heat and while I was running 50 I was at 222. I smelled the exhaust and I am not sure if I smell any coolant, Ill try again later. I am waiting for it to cool down to replace the tank. I really hope its not my turn for the head gasket problem. Of course I will check all of the usual suspects and remove the bolt with a hole to check. Unless I lost a LOT of coolant and 3/4 gallon was not enough, I am very concerned. There is only one possibility, I need a front engine mount, the engine cocks back on acceleration sometimes, maybe that rocking back, opens a slight crack at purge nipple. I am not feeling good about this.. Here is the new tank Top View Bottom View, white connector is the level switch, when I shake the tank, I can hear the float move. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Shortly after I replaced my cracked surge tank in the 97 Deville I had a leak in the connection between the crossover and the metal lines that go around the back of the engine. A few turns of the clamp screw and all is well so far. I am suspecting head gasket problems on my 94 Concours so I robbed it's surge tank for the 97. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Mike, It looks like the low coolant sensor is a part of the tank. Hopefully this will cure two problems at once! Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted August 1, 2008 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Mike, It looks like the low coolant sensor is a part of the tank. Hopefully this will cure two problems at once! Britt I have my fingers crossed... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 Hey guys, just for the record I was the one who tried the JB Weld (maybe someone else as well). I did a real good prep job and let it cure for 24 hrs. It held for a few years, but eventually let go. I would not recommend that fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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