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96 concours transmission leaks


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I have a 1996 concours, and a few weeks ago I noticed it was leaving an oil spot under the front end of the car. I checked the oil / trans fluid regularly, and within about 3 weeks of the first signs of problems (oil spots on the pavement) the shifting was off, running up to high rpm's before dropping into the next gear. I took it to a friend who is an instructor at vo tech. He swapped out the oil cooler and lines, but when I got it back, it leaks trans fluid like a sieve. I have it at a local transmission shop, mechanic immediately told me (once I let him know it was a Northstar engine) that these cars are known to have problems with the transmission case cracking, and it can't be welded because it is aluminum. replacement / rebuild of trans estimated at $4,500. I have over 150k miles on it, and while I do like the car, and nothing else is wrong with it, I don't want to spend that kind of $ on transmission repairs. Unless I put a quart of trans fluid in every morning though, the shifting is terrible, and it is basically un driveable. My question is, has anyone had experience with the trans case cracking? If so, could it be fixed short of replacing and or rebuilding the trans? My vo tech buddy told me trans repairs were beyond his abilities, which is why I have it in the shop. I had been hoping it was a simple gasket or line replacement to solve the problem. I am still holding out hope the mechanic will call and tell me there was just a loose connection somewhere.

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I have a 1996 concours, and a few weeks ago I noticed it was leaving an oil spot under the front end of the car. I checked the oil / trans fluid regularly, and within about 3 weeks of the first signs of problems (oil spots on the pavement) the shifting was off, running up to high rpm's before dropping into the next gear. I took it to a friend who is an instructor at vo tech. He swapped out the oil cooler and lines, but when I got it back, it leaks trans fluid like a sieve. I have it at a local transmission shop, mechanic immediately told me (once I let him know it was a Northstar engine) that these cars are known to have problems with the transmission case cracking, and it can't be welded because it is aluminum. replacement / rebuild of trans estimated at $4,500. I have over 150k miles on it, and while I do like the car, and nothing else is wrong with it, I don't want to spend that kind of $ on transmission repairs. Unless I put a quart of trans fluid in every morning though, the shifting is terrible, and it is basically un driveable. My question is, has anyone had experience with the trans case cracking? If so, could it be fixed short of replacing and or rebuilding the trans? My vo tech buddy told me trans repairs were beyond his abilities, which is why I have it in the shop. I had been hoping it was a simple gasket or line replacement to solve the problem. I am still holding out hope the mechanic will call and tell me there was just a loose connection somewhere.

WHOA!!!! did the "mechanic" at th transmission shop even LOOK to see what was leaking, or did he just come off the wall with this "case cracking" diagnosis?

1. You had a small drip.

2. You took it to a VO Tech school.

3. They changed out the oil cooler and lines.

4. Now it is leaking badly

I will bet that the kids at the VO Tech school didn't install an "O" ring on one of the transmission oil cooler lines!

My first recommendation is drive, get towed or push your car away from the transmission crook ASAP! Places that make snap diagnosis like that give good shops a bad name.

How low was the transmission fluid when it started it's shifting problems? Hopefully low fluid is what caused that.

In the past, GM had some issues with "case porosity". That was usually cured with epoxy. Really bad ones had the cases replaced. Usually that problem showed up in the first couple of hundred miles or less.

If these cases are prone to cracking, then I haven't heard of it.

Get the source of the leak identified. Possibly you could take it back to the VO Tech school. They may want to do a better job this time. The chances that they left a simple "O" ring out are pretty good.

Good Luck,

Britt

Britt
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WHOA!!!! did the "mechanic" at th transmission shop even LOOK to see what was leaking, or did he just come off the wall with this "case cracking" diagnosis?

1. You had a small drip.

2. You took it to a VO Tech school.

3. They changed out the oil cooler and lines.

4. Now it is leaking badly

I will bet that the kids at the VO Tech school didn't install an "O" ring on one of the transmission oil cooler lines!

My first recommendation is drive, get towed or push your car away from the transmission crook ASAP! Places that make snap diagnosis like that give good shops a bad name.

How low was the transmission fluid when it started it's shifting problems? Hopefully low fluid is what caused that.

In the past, GM had some issues with "case porosity". That was usually cured with epoxy. Really bad ones had the cases replaced. Usually that problem showed up in the first couple of hundred miles or less.

If these cases are prone to cracking, then I haven't heard of it.

Get the source of the leak identified. Possibly you could take it back to the VO Tech school. They may want to do a better job this time. The chances that they left a simple "O" ring out are pretty good.

Good Luck,

Britt

The fluid level was so low the dip stick came out clean when the shifting issues first came up, and filling the fluid resulted in better shifting (driveable at least), but wherever it was leaking, it was hitting something hot and burning off which made for lots of smoke when stopped. The transmission shop mechanic offered his opinion on the possibility the case was cracked over the phone, so obviously no benefit of actually looking at it first. I guess he made that comment just to give me a heads up that if it was a cracked case causing the leak, the expense to repair that was probably more costly than the car is worth. He is looking at it today, no charge for diagnosis. I would have taken it back to the vo tech school to have them look over their work, but it is the end of the school year, and with half days, prom, etc., I have not been able to get my guy there on the phone this week. I hope you are right, with the o-ring possibly being the culprit. What really bugs me is the vo tech guys had the car over 2 weeks, and fixed the silly stuff, like the stuck window and minor issues, but didn't get the big problem fixed - so, now if I have to junk it, it goes to the junk yard with a few new parts in it that i never would have bothered laying out the $ for had they correctly diagnosed the transmission problem first (assuming it is something major). Thanks for your reply and insights - seems there is in fact some other method for fixing a cracked case other than replacing it (epoxy). Here's my real dumb question - any chance at all that any of those products the auto parts stores sell - transmission sealer junk that goes in the fluid - actually work?

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WHOA!!!! did the "mechanic" at th transmission shop even LOOK to see what was leaking, or did he just come off the wall with this "case cracking" diagnosis?

1. You had a small drip.

2. You took it to a VO Tech school.

3. They changed out the oil cooler and lines.

4. Now it is leaking badly

I will bet that the kids at the VO Tech school didn't install an "O" ring on one of the transmission oil cooler lines!

My first recommendation is drive, get towed or push your car away from the transmission crook ASAP! Places that make snap diagnosis like that give good shops a bad name.

How low was the transmission fluid when it started it's shifting problems? Hopefully low fluid is what caused that.

In the past, GM had some issues with "case porosity". That was usually cured with epoxy. Really bad ones had the cases replaced. Usually that problem showed up in the first couple of hundred miles or less.

If these cases are prone to cracking, then I haven't heard of it.

Get the source of the leak identified. Possibly you could take it back to the VO Tech school. They may want to do a better job this time. The chances that they left a simple "O" ring out are pretty good.

Good Luck,

Britt

The fluid level was so low the dip stick came out clean when the shifting issues first came up, and filling the fluid resulted in better shifting (driveable at least), but wherever it was leaking, it was hitting something hot and burning off which made for lots of smoke when stopped. The transmission shop mechanic offered his opinion on the possibility the case was cracked over the phone, so obviously no benefit of actually looking at it first. I guess he made that comment just to give me a heads up that if it was a cracked case causing the leak, the expense to repair that was probably more costly than the car is worth. He is looking at it today, no charge for diagnosis. I would have taken it back to the vo tech school to have them look over their work, but it is the end of the school year, and with half days, prom, etc., I have not been able to get my guy there on the phone this week. I hope you are right, with the o-ring possibly being the culprit. What really bugs me is the vo tech guys had the car over 2 weeks, and fixed the silly stuff, like the stuck window and minor issues, but didn't get the big problem fixed - so, now if I have to junk it, it goes to the junk yard with a few new parts in it that i never would have bothered laying out the $ for had they correctly diagnosed the transmission problem first (assuming it is something major). Thanks for your reply and insights - seems there is in fact some other method for fixing a cracked case other than replacing it (epoxy). Here's my real dumb question - any chance at all that any of those products the auto parts stores sell - transmission sealer junk that goes in the fluid - actually work?

I would stay away from the transmission sealers. All that they do is cause a chemical reaction with the seals that causes them to swell slightly. Sometimes it works,,,,,,,,, for a while. But for a car that is to be a keeper, I wouldn't recommend it.

One possibility would be a used transmission from a Caddy that was hit in the rear. But the install price is what is costly on these cars.

Hopefully, the transmission shop is honest, and will find that the leak is from a missing "O" ring. Don't let them jerk the transmission out without your permission!

Best of Luck,

Britt

Britt
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The transmission oil cooler is built into the left (looking from the driver's seat) radiator end tank and is is not changeable without dismantling the radiator tank, which is not a vo-tech job. There is a cooler in front of the A/C condenser, but it is a power steering fluid cooler. I would hope that your friend did not cross-plumb these lines.

Clearly your friend installed the major transmission fluid leak.

If the transmission was operating fine when you started, then, unless it is damaged by driving with the fluid too low or too long a tow job with the wheels on the ground, the transmission itself is unlikely to require a repair. Most 4T80E transmission repairs are solenoid replacements which are not too expensive, and are a DIY job for lots of people here, and at least one is likely to chime in if that emerges as something to look at after you get the leak fixed.

If the tranny shop is talking totaled transmission for a friend-installed leak, get your car and yourself as far away form that shop ASAP.

Your first and likely only problem is to find and fix the friend-installed leak. I would start by phoning your friend and ask if he really did mess with the transmission oil cooler and what he did, and ask him what could be causing a new massive leak; he may be able to fix it in a few minutes, or, if he doesn't have a clue, then that's valuable information too. The most likely cause of a friend-installed transmission fluid leak is a mission O ring or loose connection, as navion says.

If you find it necessary and appropriate to drive the car, use another car to go by an auto parts store and pick up a case of transmission fluid and keep it full while you're driving, stopping every block or two if necessary.

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-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
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Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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The transmission oil cooler is built into the left (looking from the driver's seat) radiator end tank and is is not changeable without dismantling the radiator tank, which is not a vo-tech job. There is a cooler in front of the A/C condenser, but it is a power steering fluid cooler. I would hope that your friend did not cross-plumb these lines.

Clearly your friend installed the major transmission fluid leak.

If the transmission was operating fine when you started, then, unless it is damaged by driving with the fluid too low or too long a tow job with the wheels on the ground, the transmission itself is unlikely to require a repair. Most 4T80E transmission repairs are solenoid replacements which are not too expensive, and are a DIY job for lots of people here, and at least one is likely to chime in if that emerges as something to look at after you get the leak fixed.

If the tranny shop is talking totaled transmission for a friend-installed leak, get your car and yourself as far away form that shop ASAP.

Your first and likely only problem is to find and fix the friend-installed leak. I would start by phoning your friend and ask if he really did mess with the transmission oil cooler and what he did, and ask him what could be causing a new massive leak; he may be able to fix it in a few minutes, or, if he doesn't have a clue, then that's valuable information too. The most likely cause of a friend-installed transmission fluid leak is a mission O ring or loose connection, as navion says.

If you find it necessary and appropriate to drive the car, use another car to go by an auto parts store and pick up a case of transmission fluid and keep it full while you're driving, stopping every block or two if necessary.

I do keep a half dozen bottles of trans fluid in the trunk, and pour one in every morning to get me where I am going - other than what I guess is typical for a transmission low on fluid, it seems to work fine - high rpm's and problems shifting coincide with the fluid getting low at the end of the day, and improve when it's filled in the morning, so I am assuming low fluid is the sole transmission problem.

I am pretty certain that the vo tech guy got so sick of messing with my car, he's just not returning my calls at all now, so bringing it back to him is going to be a pain. The routine with vo tech here is they look at the car, decide what parts they need, call the order into the parts store, then the parts store calls me to get payment information. A transmission oil cooler and cooler lines were ordered, paid for and delivered to vo tech. Vo tech guy said he was not equipped to work on any interior parts of the trans, so I don't know how he was able to replace the oil cooler. I would have to assume he did replace it though. I don't know why he replaced it, especially considering it leaks worse than ever now.

I am still waiting for the transmission shop mechanic to call me and give me his opinion. Unless he tells me it is something cheap and easy, my plan is to pick up the car, top off the trans fluid, and take the car either back to vo tech or someplace else entirely. Plan "C" is to enter it into the next demolition derby I can find! The leak isn't so bad I need to pull over to fill it, but it is bad enough a nice sized (frisbee sized) stain is under the front end every morning, and it needs 1 or 2 quarts to bring it back up to where it should be. I also get a nice misting of oily film all over the back of the car from whatever is leaking underneath blowing back out the tail end of the car when i drive it. No more smoke though - which I guess is a sign that the Vo tech guy must have fixed some part that leaked before and dripped onto something under the hood that gets hot - it smoked like a banshee before he worked on it.

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If you keep driving it with low fluid you will eventually have a problem. Take it to a good mechanic that knows your car preferrably the dealer

I am a firm believer that you get what you pay for, personally, I would have avoided the VO Tech shop.. There is a tranny cooler in the radiator, an oil cooler and power steering cooler in front of the radiator. The cooler lines run from the tranny to the radiator. Not sure if the cooler lines need o-rings or if they are a compression fitting, but that is the first place I would look. HOPEFULLY they did not DAMAGE the tranny case, LEARNING on your car..

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Forget the big bill. You have a mechanic-installed leak. You shouldn't be thinking end-of-car-life because of a transmission fluid leak. The vo-tech people replaced your transmission cooler lines and then the major leak appeared. Thus the leak is at the oil line fittings. This is a very simple job that can be done in a few minutes. The service station where you get your oil changed can probably fix the oil leak if it is the fittings for the cooler lines, which it almost certainly is.

The more knowledgeable the mechanic is about things like how gently to torque O-ring transmission oil line fittings, the better off you are. The worst thing you are looking at is the vo-tech guy busting a fitting, in which case you need a new radiator, not a new transmission. Your best and most conservative advice is from BodybyFisher. If you take it to a good dealer service department or another good mechanic, you will come away with a good car that doesn't have transmission leaks in a short time with very little money spent.

The transmission oil cooler is internal to the left radiator tank. The radiator cannot be disassembled and reassembled successfully without special equipment for rebuilding plastic-tank radiators (the tank seal is crimped with a rubber molding, which can't be done successfully by hand). Ego, unless your radiator leaks too badly to drive the car, or unless they replaced your radiator, they didn't replace your transmission oil cooler. In any case I can't understand why they would want to. The coolers don't leak; they fittings are another matter, but you just need a couple of O rings to fix that.

Vo-tech project cars are for junkers. I would never take a daily driver to a vo-tech school. The odds of having a drivable, reliable car after a vo-tech session are slim to none. By going there, you are basically donating your car to science.

CTS-V_LateralGs_6-2018_tiny.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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