woody Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Hello All, I had the car back to my mechanic after the head gasket repair cost a couple of months ago. He had to replace the oil cooler hose connected to the radiator. I mentioned to him I was having the same noise I had before the sway bar links and rubber bushings were replaced almost 1yr to the day. We checked them out and there is no play at all in them. He also hooked up some very cool noise detection head phones with clips to both links under the car and at the top of the strut mounts. He drove the car and did notice some noise from the passenger side front but nothing severe. The struts do have 124,000 on them. There is no sign of leakage or movement on them. I would hate to just start replacing items as my wife is still recovering from the shock of the head gasket repair. I was going to replace the struts with Arnott later in the summer. It pains me to drive it this way. Any help as always is greatly appreciated. Woody PS: It also doesn't help with all the car swallowing holes in the great state on Michigan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Very hard to diagnose here, it could be a bad strut, strut mount, strut bar bushing, stabilizer bar LINKS (could be loose) and even bad control arm bushing. Does this happen over bumps? My guess is that your strut rod bushings are shot allowing your strut rod to hit the frame, Regis recently had problems with his, but even worse, the strut rod connecting rivets were loose on the lower control arm. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Mike, It is happening over bumps. Like stated the year old links are secure. I was afraid it my be strut related. Does anyone have a schematic or pic? I assume this is a seperate repair from the actual strut? What all should be replaced if and when I do the struts? Ballpark for parts? Thanks, Woody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 OK typically a banging over bumps is stabilizer links or the stabilizer bar bushings, but you replaced them. Did this happen before the head gasket job? If it did not, have them check to make sure the stabilizer link is tight, they are tricky to tighten. The strut rod bushing is the BLUE bushing in this photo, to replace it the lower control arm has to come off. At that time, the ball joint is easily replaced if it appears warn, I replaced mine. I can't guarantee that your control arm looks identical to this, have a look at yours, but the strut rod bushing wears and allows the bar to hit the frame, also consider that the ball joint is banging.. Here is a view of it in place with a new ball joint boot Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Thanks I will have a look. I was hoping to wait a bit to replace the struts. Do you think I should let them go if there are no signs of going bad? Woody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 Thanks I will have a look. I was hoping to wait a bit to replace the struts. Do you think I should let them go if there are no signs of going bad? Woody If you are SURE they are bad, replace them asap, bad struts allow the spring to take a beating and you will damage the spring. When I bought my car, the struts were shot at that point, in addition I could not load people and luggage in my car without it ending up on the ground. Going into curb cuts and driveways it bottomed out. Speed bumps were dangerous to go over. If you are not experiencing bad spring problems replace the struts asap. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 I am sure they are not bad and will have to look at the other options first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 OK typically a banging over bumps is stabilizer links or the stabilizer bar bushings, but you replaced them. Did this happen before the head gasket job? If it did not, have them check to make sure the stabilizer link is tight, they are tricky to tighten. The strut rod bushing is the BLUE bushing in this photo, to replace it the lower control arm has to come off. At that time, the ball joint is easily replaced if it appears warn, I replaced mine. I can't guarantee that your control arm looks identical to this, have a look at yours, but the strut rod bushing wears and allows the bar to hit the frame, also consider that the ball joint is banging.. How easy is it to remove the lower control arm? It looks like I'm going to have to replace the right side ball joint so if removing the control arm makes the job easier then that's what I'll do. I've replaced ball joints without taking the control arm off and it's somewhat of a pain because jack stands are required and the car has to be raised high enough to make room for the drill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 OK typically a banging over bumps is stabilizer links or the stabilizer bar bushings, but you replaced them. Did this happen before the head gasket job? If it did not, have them check to make sure the stabilizer link is tight, they are tricky to tighten. The strut rod bushing is the BLUE bushing in this photo, to replace it the lower control arm has to come off. At that time, the ball joint is easily replaced if it appears warn, I replaced mine. I can't guarantee that your control arm looks identical to this, have a look at yours, but the strut rod bushing wears and allows the bar to hit the frame, also consider that the ball joint is banging.. How easy is it to remove the lower control arm? It looks like I'm going to have to replace the right side ball joint so if removing the control arm makes the job easier then that's what I'll do. I've replaced ball joints without taking the control arm off and it's somewhat of a pain because jack stands are required and the car has to be raised high enough to make room for the drill. Mac, its not bad, get the wheel up, let it hang, use a jack stand on the frame for safety reasons. Detach pull the caliper, rotor, detach the stablilzer link, remove the strut rod nut in the front of the carriage, break loose the ball joint (the hardest part), you can use a fork, but you might need to replace the ball joint boot if you rip it. The procedure to drill out the three ball joint rivets is in the manual. DO NOT lift the strut -assemble, you must NOT dislodge the inner tri-pod axle joint. Replace the strut rod bushings when you do the job, Mike Take it off, don't try to drill it in place, if you have a vice, its better, PLUS you want to replace the strut rod bushings with POLY..... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Mac, its not bad, get the wheel up, let it hang, use a jack stand on the frame for safety reasons. Detach pull the caliper, rotor, detach the stablilzer link, remove the strut rod nut in the front of the carriage, break loose the ball joint (the hardest part), you can use a fork, but you might need to replace the ball joint boot if you rip it. The procedure to drill out the three ball joint rivets is in the manual. DO NOT lift the strut -assemble, you must NOT dislodge the inner tri-pod axle joint. Replace the strut rod bushings when you do the job, Mike Take it off, don't try to drill it in place, if you have a vice, its better, PLUS you want to replace the strut rod bushings with POLY..... I'm going to remove the lower control arm when I service the ball joint. I'll buy new cobalt bits--on for a pilot hole and the final bit will be 7/16 rather than 1/2 because I would rather go slightly smaller and pop the rivets out. I also have new control arm bushings, which are ACDelco but they're better than the originals. Actually, they could be polyurethane because that's how hard they are. I'll make sure I don't over-extend the Tri-Pot joints by over-extending the shaft. Thanks for the input. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 You will need to have the control arm bushings pressed in by a GOOD machine shop that is not a DIY job unless you have a press and the proper bushing drivers. What ever you do, make sure you replace the strut rod bushings with POLY, the blue bushings in my photo above, see if you can buy them at NAPA, Rockauto or Energysuspension.com, you will thank me later, when you see how sharp the directional control of your steering becomes.. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 You will need to have the control arm bushings pressed in by a GOOD machine shop that is not a DIY job unless you have a press and the proper bushing drivers. What ever you do, make sure you replace the strut rod bushings with POLY, the blue bushings in my photo above, see if you can buy them at NAPA, Rockauto or Energysuspension.com, you will thank me later, when you see how sharp the directional control of your steering becomes.. Oops, I meant the strut rod bushings rather than the control arm bushings. This is what I was referring to when I said I have ACDelco bushings. I won't replace the control arm bushings unless I feel play in the control arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 You will need to have the control arm bushings pressed in by a GOOD machine shop that is not a DIY job unless you have a press and the proper bushing drivers. What ever you do, make sure you replace the strut rod bushings with POLY, the blue bushings in my photo above, see if you can buy them at NAPA, Rockauto or Energysuspension.com, you will thank me later, when you see how sharp the directional control of your steering becomes.. Oops, I meant the strut rod bushings rather than the control arm bushings. This is what I was referring to when I said I have ACDelco bushings. I won't replace the control arm bushings unless I feel play in the control arm. OH, OK.... please consider getting poly...you will by me dinner at Ruth Crist...., it makes a BIG BIG difference Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 OH, OK.... please consider getting poly...you will by me dinner at Ruth Crist...., it makes a BIG BIG difference I've looked for poly bushings but I can't find them for '94 Eldorado. I don't believe Thermoplastic is the same as polyurethane? Here are some Moog thermoplastic bushings (scroll down the page and you'll see them--they're blue). They are about the same price as the ACDelco bushings which must be Thermoplastic or something similar because they are much harder than the original bushings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 OH, OK.... please consider getting poly...you will by me dinner at Ruth Crist...., it makes a BIG BIG difference I've looked for poly bushings but I can't find them for '94 Eldorado. I don't believe Thermoplastic is the same as polyurethane? Here are some Moog thermoplastic bushings (scroll down the page and you'll see them--they're blue). They are about the same price as the ACDelco bushings which must be Thermoplastic or something similar because they are much harder than the original bushings. YES!!! Mine were MOOG... They are MUCH harder they don't flex at all, and that keeps your lower control arm from moving fore and aft at all.. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 See my post #85 in this thread, to see the thermoplastic MOOG bushings http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...13481&st=75 Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody Posted March 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Mike, I wish you lived closer I could use some help on my problem, If all you require is dinner my wife was the Manager at Ruth's Chris here in Michigan for 2 years and after our daughter was born she decided to just wait tables. More money less hours. We still get 50% off all meals and well the drinks don't always find them self on the tab Woody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Mike, I wish you lived closer I could use some help on my problem, If all you require is dinner my wife was the Manager at Ruth's Chris here in Michigan for 2 years and after our daughter was born she decided to just wait tables. More money less hours. We still get 50% off all meals and well the drinks don't always find them self on the tab Woody Just my luck to live so far away , I love that place... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
90IROC Posted September 12, 2008 Report Share Posted September 12, 2008 OH, OK.... please consider getting poly...you will by me dinner at Ruth Crist...., it makes a BIG BIG difference I've looked for poly bushings but I can't find them for '94 Eldorado. I don't believe Thermoplastic is the same as polyurethane? Here are some Moog thermoplastic bushings (scroll down the page and you'll see them--they're blue). They are about the same price as the ACDelco bushings which must be Thermoplastic or something similar because they are much harder than the original bushings. YES!!! Mine were MOOG... They are MUCH harder they don't flex at all, and that keeps your lower control arm from moving fore and aft at all.. geez i wish I would have seen this thread earlier. I have a knock in my front end and have repalced - struts - sway bar end links - rac and pinion - a bunch of other stuff I don;t remember all trying to fix this noise. I am willing to bet the blue bushing (strut rod?) in the pic is no good and causing me the noise. is there a step by step available if I am going to do this myself? is it a simple re & re? thx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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