WarrenJ Posted December 6, 2007 Report Share Posted December 6, 2007 BodyByFisher, That Crimson Red '02 ESC you showed me at http://www.generalsalescars.com/pre-owned/...e_row5_col3.htm is a beauty. It's priced more like an ETC, however. A tad high even then. It's also got the wrong wheels on it. Still looking. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted December 6, 2007 Report Share Posted December 6, 2007 The wheels are the same as those on my 1997 ETC, which has the premium chromed aluminum wheels. I ran a quick KBB price. I took off OnStar, added the Bose system the CD changer, and the sun roof (visible in the photos), and assumed 50,000 miles. There is no KBB check box for premium (pearl white or crimson pearl). For my ZIP code (south Jersey near Philly) I got a higher price than posted for the ESC for Excellent condition, sold and warrantied by a dealer. As a starting point for negotiation, it's not bad. I would look at it. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted December 6, 2007 Report Share Posted December 6, 2007 Warren during our phone conversation last night, I said, the price on their web site was a starting point of the discussion. You need to speak to Mc Kay directly. Wheels?, a deal killer, Cardio Doc will fix that. Photos say nothing, you need to see the car. In addition as I mentioned they have an ETC coming in with 35K on it. You need to call Mc Kay. Use this site as leverage, that we have a stream of buyers, etc. There are cars that float through SMALL car lots and there are special cars that have been babied, you need to see this car and the ETC, these are babied and maintained cars, not EBAY, or cars 2000 miles away in Florida Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted December 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 The wheels are the same as those on my 1997 ETC, which has the premium chromed aluminum wheels. I ran a quick KBB price. I took off OnStar, added the Bose system the CD changer, and the sun roof (visible in the photos), and assumed 50,000 miles. There is no KBB check box for premium (pearl white or crimson pearl). For my ZIP code (south Jersey near Philly) I got a higher price than posted for the ESC for Excellent condition, sold and warrantied by a dealer. As a starting point for negotiation, it's not bad. I would look at it. Thanks Jim. That's interesting. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted December 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 Warren during our phone conversation last night, I said, the price on their web site was a starting point of the discussion. You need to speak to Mc Kay directly. Wheels?, a deal killer, Cardio Doc will fix that. Photos say nothing, you need to see the car. In addition as I mentioned they have an ETC coming in with 35K on it. You need to call Mc Kay. Use this site as leverage, that we have a stream of buyers, etc. There are cars that float through SMALL car lots and there are special cars that have been babied, you need to see this car and the ETC, these are babied and maintained cars, not EBAY, or cars 2000 miles away in Florida Mike, Thanks for all your help. It's deeply appreciated! Cardio-Doc, likely a swell guy, will result in quite an expense to replace the wheels. I have those same wheels on my '98 and frankly don't care for them. I know, it may seem a little thing, but I simply, really, don't care for them. For the kind of money at stake here I'd like the car to be a little bit closer to "perfect." At least in the wheel department. Also, I'm always wary of things that are just "not quite right." I'll look forward to the "incoming" machine. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jim Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 Mike, Thanks for all your help. It's deeply appreciated! For the kind of money at stake here I'd like the car to be a little bit closer to "perfect." At least in the wheel department. Also, I'm always wary of things that are just "not quite right." I'll look forward to the "incoming" machine. Regards, Warren Warren, If you would be willing to travel down here to the Dallas / Ft. Worth area, where Bruce and I are... I will go by two of the dealers today, where I know someone, and tell them what I am looking for. Or what "YOU" are looking for. Over the years I have bought a TON of Cadillacs from these guys. 12 to be exact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jim Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 Warren, Here is a 2000 ETC. http://www.autotrader.com/dealers/dda/deta...ler_id=55701608 I will be close to them later today... if you would like, I will stop and take a look at it. This is the dealer I use for service on my DTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted tcb Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 [quote name='WarrenJ' Cardio-Doc, likely a swell guy, will result in quite an expense to replace the wheels. I have those same wheels on my '98 and frankly don't care for them. I know what you mean. I had those same chrome wheels on my 1995, so they date the car. Many refer to them as "cookie cutters" ... they really do look like large cookie cutters ... no offense to the guys who own them, but the ETC wheels look more current to me. The wheels on the car that Texas Jim suggests were used on mid-90's SLS' ... kind of strange to see them on an Eldorado. It looks like you want ETC rims, like the ones pictured. Good rims from Doc will set you back around $1k ... not an insignificant sum when you're paying $15k for a used car. 1989 FWD Fleetwood, Silver 1995 STS Crimson Pearl on Black leather 1997 STS Diamond White 1999 STS Crimson Pearl 2001 STS Silver 2003 STS, Crimson Pearl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted December 7, 2007 Report Share Posted December 7, 2007 I never liked those rims either, they look stamped, I didn't realize that those wheel were not stock. Who knows however maybe the prior owner changed the wheels as he liked the look. I considered calling the dealer to ask them why those wheels are on it. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 Warren, check out post #6 http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadil...tml#post1320031 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 Those are the same wheels that came on my 1997 ETC. Here's a photo (pardon the circular fisheye, and allow for distortion because you are also looking at part of the tire sidewall, the inside of the fender well, the sky, the driveway below the car, the side of the car, the street behind the car, and the garage in front of the car; click thumbnail for 4" X 4" photo): -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 The enlarged vie looks like you have 22" rims the rims look great in that photo Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted December 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 Thanks everyone. Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stsjoe Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 I never liked those rims either, they look stamped, I didn't realize that those wheel were not stock. Who knows however maybe the prior owner changed the wheels as he liked the look. I considered calling the dealer to ask them why those wheels are on it. I would think the dealer would put whatever rims you want on, if you bought it new. My 95 ETC had the cookie cutters, the SLS and ESC's had them too but not chromed. Mine also had a hood ornament! and the grill badge. The original owner said he wouldn't drive a caddy without one so the dealer put one on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenJ Posted December 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 I would think the dealer would put whatever rims you want on, if you bought it new. My 95 ETC had the cookie cutters, the SLS and ESC's had them too but not chromed. Mine also had a hood ornament! and the grill badge. The original owner said he wouldn't drive a caddy without one so the dealer put one on But I wouldn't be buying it new. Sorry, but the wrong wheels light up a flag for me. It's not "perfect." It's been "altered." I'd be worried. Other "alteration" concerns arise. Has other work been done on the car? Maybe an after market system of some sort? An alarm? A small point, perhaps, but I'm anal. Being so has served me well. And the dealer would most certainly *NOT* put whatever wheels you wanted on the car. He would install what he had in stock and available; period! Regards, Warren There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stsjoe Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 And the dealer would most certainly *NOT* put whatever wheels you wanted on the car. He would install what he had in stock and available; period! Regards, Warren That's what I meant Warren, if you were at a Caddy dealer and liked the car but wanted the rims off the one next to it and the deal hinged on it they would swap 'em and probably also if you were on the used car end of the lot. Ater all they are Cadillac rims not aftermarkets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 The fisheye picture of my wheel was taken with the camera bout four inches from the center of the hub, and only about half the tire shows from that angle. As I said in the post, you are looking up into the wheel well and past that to the sky, and down at the driveway. You can see the driver's side rearview mirror past the fender well at about 1:30 O'Clock. You can see me and the camera, with large flash unit, reflected in the hub center. My experience agrees with WarrenJ's. The dealer will, though, have a certain amount of aftermarket stuff in stock for new car buyers to suit common requests, such as hood ornaments and such. When I bought my car they made noises about adding the padded top, a different year car's wheels or aftermarket wheels, and the raised crest hub centers, and I turned them all down. I requested the pinstriping but they didn't want to do it because they were busy with the 1998 cars they were selling lot hotcakes, and it would delay delivery of my car for a couple of days. Likewise with the seat warmer. I insisted on the sunroof and OnStar and they did put those on. The sunroof is from the same people who make them for Cadillac and it plugged into the harness, and the only difference between it and the factory sunroof is that I didn't lose the overhead console with sunglass compartment (I keep my polarized clip-ons in there). But, I think that these wheels are standard, with about $1,000 extra for the chromed versions. I don't think that the dealer or anyone else made changes to the wheels. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Posted December 8, 2007 Report Share Posted December 8, 2007 Warren, check out post #6 http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums/cadil...tml#post1320031 SOLD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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