BodybyFisher Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 As far as I see it, GM has been building GREAT Cadillacs since 1991, anyone that has been around knows they built mediocre cars from the mid 70's THROUGH 1990, but they were reacting to the gas crisis, competition from imports, etc, they have since turned it around. Keep reading the internet and you will get all the bad news you can take about the so called head gasket problem.. Again, they have improved the NS consistently, and the dealers are part to blame. Let me say this, my 96 Deville has a TON of problems right now, its 11 model years old and it has 95,000 miles on it. Let me say it again, as these cars get older they need replacements, period. ALL CARS DO. Just realize that in the 50s, 60s, and 70s when cars hit 100K they are junk, just tow them to the junk yard and you could almost guarantee needing a tranny around 80K... No one fixed the AC compressor's they just CUT the belt off... We did a survey look at this poll, 15% needed headgaskets: http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...p;hl=timeserted The 4-6-8 was ahead of its time in thinking, and the electronics and computers at the time were NOT up to the task, but you have to reward GM for coming up with a gas saving innovation. GM has heard the wake up call and is on the right track. Lets all try looking forward and not digging up the 4100 or the 4-6-8 to make our points. Try taking a look at how the Northstar has evolved over the years, the original Northstar is a relic.. Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick7997 Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 Lotta good points in here.... some of my posts on these type of threads really tend to anger people, so, I apologize in advance... That being said.. #1. GM Dealers are undermining the company. I tend to agree with that. Some of these "bad apple" dealerships really need to be pruned out of he family tree.... that being said, there are also good dealers out there, with good techs, who do good work... It's kind of sad, a dealership near me, a Cadillac store, their sales department is truly frightening, their service is a crapshoot, but their parts department and parts guys have been great. So, they get my parts business. It's really too bad about the rest... This will anger some I'm sure, but I think GM could take a cue from Harley on their dealerships. At an HD dealer, the people there are as enthusiastic about their product as you are.... they share your pride of ownership... and they must have some real teeth in their dealership ratings, because the people in the stores literally are falling over themselves to help you.... at least that's been my experience. #2. Unions. I am a little sickened by the heavy union bashing I see, especially on other forums. It's not the union members fault. They bargained for the deals they got, and the company gave those deals. Laying ALL the blame on unions... I don't buy it. #3. Consumers Report. It's crap, I totally agree. So import biased. I had some expensive Toyota products years ago... Cadillacs are less trouble to own. And also, if you think Caddy dealers rip people off, don't go in a Toyota store.... wow. I got an $1800 estimate one time... for a leaky thermostat. Whew.... How CU arrives at their goofy "ratings" I have no idea... but it's all crap. Maybe I've just been really lucky, but my GM products have been very good to me. They're not perfect, but neither is anyone else. I personally am pulling hard for them, and hope that this will be a wake up call for them.... Again, I apologize if this offended anyone.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter1972 Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 I think: Part of GM issue IS with mass producction... So big. Too many cars remain from the 80-90's. Mid 80's cars with peeling paint....knocking rods.....etc. Still good cars..just so many remain...sets off negitive perception.. Too many cars. That being said. There is a life cyle to vehicles. 10 years is a very long time. GM built so many that it is now a issue.. It's a image issue. Its's easy to find a 1988 Pontiacs. Worn down but still going..... No 1988 Toyotas to be found...nowhere to be found...think about it.. Hence the 'clean' feel.. We have all seen these GM cars. Beat...barely running, kid, worn, 200k cars. It sets up a negative image issue. Seeing that, "I dont want a GM car..." "I want to try something new." Customer impact issues. Pontiac Azteck was a step in the wrong direction. The issue really started back in 1958...at GM. Maybe I am understanding your post wrong. But your crazy it's easy to find Pontiacs from the late 80s but no Toyota's You must be joking right the GM products made in the 80s are some of the worst pieces of crap to ever come out of Detroit in both fit and finish and reliability. Those old 4 banger Toyota pickups ran forever as far as I can remember. True the body's would rust out before the engines would quit. Maybe I drank to many Budweiser's in the 80s but thats how I remember things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter1972 Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 Lotta good points in here.... some of my posts on these type of threads really tend to anger people, so, I apologize in advance... That being said.. #1. GM Dealers are undermining the company. I tend to agree with that. Some of these "bad apple" dealerships really need to be pruned out of he family tree.... that being said, there are also good dealers out there, with good techs, who do good work... It's kind of sad, a dealership near me, a Cadillac store, their sales department is truly frightening, their service is a crapshoot, but their parts department and parts guys have been great. So, they get my parts business. It's really too bad about the rest... This will anger some I'm sure, but I think GM could take a cue from Harley on their dealerships. At an HD dealer, the people there are as enthusiastic about their product as you are.... they share your pride of ownership... and they must have some real teeth in their dealership ratings, because the people in the stores literally are falling over themselves to help you.... at least that's been my experience. #2. Unions. I am a little sickened by the heavy union bashing I see, especially on other forums. It's not the union members fault. They bargained for the deals they got, and the company gave those deals. Laying ALL the blame on unions... I don't buy it. #3. Consumers Report. It's crap, I totally agree. So import biased. I had some expensive Toyota products years ago... Cadillacs are less trouble to own. And also, if you think Caddy dealers rip people off, don't go in a Toyota store.... wow. I got an $1800 estimate one time... for a leaky thermostat. Whew.... How CU arrives at their goofy "ratings" I have no idea... but it's all crap. Maybe I've just been really lucky, but my GM products have been very good to me. They're not perfect, but neither is anyone else. I personally am pulling hard for them, and hope that this will be a wake up call for them.... Again, I apologize if this offended anyone.... I just wanted to state that I did say a few remarks about the Autoworkers unions being part of the problem and I believe they are. I myself was a Teamster local 140 Tractor trailer driver for half of my driving career and I've been on more than one Union picket line. But that doesn't mean I side with Union labor right or wrong while the company goes down the toilet thats the part of the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybob Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 sorry but not digging up the past with junk motors yes the 4-6-8 motor was ahead of its time but do not work so what good was it??? The 4100 junk motor made caddy a dam fool. As far as the orig northstar junk motor not much of a relic since lots of people are still pumping tons of money into these 90s junk motors as of right now. Dont get me wrong I been driveing caddys since the 1970s and at that time had little or no problem with junk motors plus at that time a caddy did not cost more than some peoples homes. I think if you go out and pay almost $50,000 for a car it should last at least 100,000 miles without any major engine work. anyone who dont agree is liveing in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter1972 Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 sorry but not digging up the past with junk motors yes the 4-6-8 motor was ahead of its time but do not work so what good was it??? The 4100 junk motor made caddy a dam fool. As far as the orig northstar junk motor not much of a relic since lots of people are still pumping tons of money into these 90s junk motors as of right now. Dont get me wrong I been driveing caddys since the 1970s and at that time had little or no problem with junk motors plus at that time a caddy did not cost more than some peoples homes. I think if you go out and pay almost $50,000 for a car it should last at least 100,000 miles without any major engine work. anyone who dont agree is liveing in the past. I just read your posts and you are right on the money with the things you've said some people in these forum have the GM and Cadillac rose colored glasses on I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 LISTEN BILLYBOB, the 468 is from about 1981 that is 25 GD years ago isn't it????????? How about the 4100 and 4500, the last time they were used was about 1990, 17 years ago HUH? Both were new directions (electronics and aluminum), and both had problem but YOU are talking about 17 and 25 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You missed the Cimmeron.... This BILLYBOB is an enthusiast's Cadillac board, most hear don't really care to hear negative ANCIENT history stories. Take your negative bashing stories here, where you can lament the old dayz of the cast iron, gas guzzling and high emissions engines and cars that lasted 100K: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html sorry but not digging up the past with junk motors yes the 4-6-8 motor was ahead of its time but do not work so what good was it??? The 4100 junk motor made caddy a dam fool. As far as the orig northstar junk motor not much of a relic since lots of people are still pumping tons of money into these 90s junk motors as of right now. Dont get me wrong I been driveing caddys since the 1970s and at that time had little or no problem with junk motors plus at that time a caddy did not cost more than some peoples homes. I think if you go out and pay almost $50,000 for a car it should last at least 100,000 miles without any major engine work. anyone who dont agree is liveing in the past. I just read your posts and you are right on the money with the things you've said some people in these forum have the GM and Cadillac rose colored glasses on I think. No Peter, I have seen you post negative comments on other threads, so you need to hear this. This is an enthusiast's board, the love of a Cadillac is NOT logical. Its a Love and I suppose we do wear rose colored glasses. We Love the Cadillac and DO NOT care to hear what know it all malcontents thing. Do a search and you will see that we OVER AND OVER say this is an ENTHUSIAST'S board Yea..... you agree with BILLY? Pulling the 4100 and 468 out of 17 and 25 year history..... that is funny as hell... Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter1972 Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 LISTEN BILLYBOB, the 468 is from about 1981 that is 25 GD years ago isn't it????????? How about the 4100 and 4500, the last time they were used was about 1990, 17 years ago HUH? But were new directions, and both had problem but YOU are talking about 17 and 25 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You missed the Cimmeron.... This BILLYBOB is an enthusiast's Cadillac board, most hear don't really care to hear negative ANCIENT history stories. Take your negative bashing stories here, where you can lament the old dayz of the cast iron, gas guzzling and high emissions engines and cars that lasted 100K: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html Listen body by fisher this thread was about why Toyota is closing in on GM and people gave their interpretations why thats all. I think it's a shame that a foreign car maker will over take the mighty GM soon and I personally and my family's company have given GM through buying pickups and Cadillacs about 1 million dollars in the past 50 years. LISTEN BILLYBOB, the 468 is from about 1981 that is 25 GD years ago isn't it????????? How about the 4100 and 4500, the last time they were used was about 1990, 17 years ago HUH? But were new directions, and both had problem but YOU are talking about 17 and 25 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You missed the Cimmeron.... This BILLYBOB is an enthusiast's Cadillac board, most hear don't really care to hear negative ANCIENT history stories. Take your negative bashing stories here, where you can lament the old dayz of the cast iron, gas guzzling and high emissions engines and cars that lasted 100K: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html Listen body by fisher this thread was about why Toyota is closing in on GM and people gave their interpretations why thats all. I think it's a shame that a foreign car maker will over take the mighty GM soon and I personally and my family's company have given GM through buying pickups and Cadillacs about 1 million dollars in the past 50 years. Wheres my negative posts I can't have an opinon. [Pls refrain from personal attacks]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Nunnally Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 The base 368 engine used with the 8-6-4 multi-displacement was a terrific, reliable engine. The 8-6-4 multi-displacement got a lot of bad press; some of it was not deserved, as the owners did not like the performance as designed. It however was very simple to disable, and then the engine operated as any other engine. The HT4100 had a lot of early issues, which were corrected in the 4.5L and 4.9L engines. The 4.5 and 4.9L engines are terrific, reliable powerplants. The NS 4.6L is a nice engine. It tends to use oil for a variety of reasons which we have covered in depth -- low friction rings, bore hone, etc. Still a nice engine. Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95SevilleSLS Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 LISTEN BILLYBOB, the 468 is from about 1981 that is 25 GD years ago isn't it????????? How about the 4100 and 4500, the last time they were used was about 1990, 17 years ago HUH? But were new directions, and both had problem but YOU are talking about 17 and 25 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You missed the Cimmeron.... This BILLYBOB is an enthusiast's Cadillac board, most hear don't really care to hear negative ANCIENT history stories. Take your negative bashing stories here, where you can lament the old dayz of the cast iron, gas guzzling and high emissions engines and cars that lasted 100K: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html sorry but not digging up the past with junk motors yes the 4-6-8 motor was ahead of its time but do not work so what good was it??? The 4100 junk motor made caddy a dam fool. As far as the orig northstar junk motor not much of a relic since lots of people are still pumping tons of money into these 90s junk motors as of right now. Dont get me wrong I been driveing caddys since the 1970s and at that time had little or no problem with junk motors plus at that time a caddy did not cost more than some peoples homes. I think if you go out and pay almost $50,000 for a car it should last at least 100,000 miles without any major engine work. anyone who dont agree is liveing in the past. I just read your posts and you are right on the money with the things you've said some people in these forum have the GM and Cadillac rose colored glasses on I think. No Peter, I have seen you post negative comments on other threads, so you need to hear this. This is an enthusiast's board, the love of a Cadillac is NOT logical. Its a Love and I suppose we do wear rose colored glasses. We Love the Cadillac and DO NOT care to hear what know it all malcontents thing. Do a search and you will see that we OVER AND OVER say this is an ENTHUSIAST'S board Yea..... you agree with BILLY? Pulling the 4100 and 468 out of 17 and 25 year history..... that is funny as hell... Just thought I'd point out that it was a 368, not 468 billybob, the reason they didn't work was because the computer was too slow and didn't react it time to switch it back to V8. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the engine. People just snipped the two wires to the computer and the engine ran like a dream. I haven't actually heard anything about theh 4100's so I can't comment on them. If they northstar was such crap, why was it Ward's ten best engines of the 20th century? You're on a board where people are asking for help on their problems, of course it's going to look like there are a lot of problems because they are all funneling to here. I have not seen one northstar go to crap. It's probably one 1 out of 10,000 that goes bad. Think of how many engines are out there and you just here of a few that go bad?? Why don't you compare cadillac to other companies, I'm sure cadillac's problems are far less than a lot of companies. Like bodybyfisher said, this is an enthusiast's board. I haven't heard much more on Toyota, but it seems that they have leveled off and GM is still staying strong. I wouldn't worry about it too much. A lot of the reasons why foreign companies can rise up so easily is because of their cheap labor. Everyone here wants to be rich and it's hard to keep people working, over there people live to work. Toyota is a good company, but I would never buy one. They ride like crap, they are cheap looking and cheap, and they are lighter than a pancake. I wouldn't want to be hit by a semi, much less a suburban or something, with one of those. -Dusty- - 02 Seville STS, white diamond - 93 Sixty Special, Tan with vinyl top - 79 Coupe DeVille, Tan with Tan top - 06 GMC Sierra Z71, Black - 92 Silverado C1500, black and grey - 83 Chevy K10 Silverado, Black and Grey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 Wheres my negative posts I can't have an opinon. [Pls refrain from personal attacks]. [please refrain from personal attacks].... like I said, this is an ENTHUSIASTS board: Air your anger, negativity and negative statements here: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter1972 Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 LISTEN BILLYBOB, the 468 is from about 1981 that is 25 GD years ago isn't it????????? How about the 4100 and 4500, the last time they were used was about 1990, 17 years ago HUH? Both were new directions (electronics and aluminum), and both had problem but YOU are talking about 17 and 25 years ago!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You missed the Cimmeron.... This BILLYBOB is an enthusiast's Cadillac board, most hear don't really care to hear negative ANCIENT history stories. Take your negative bashing stories here, where you can lament the old dayz of the cast iron, gas guzzling and high emissions engines and cars that lasted 100K: http://www.gmsucks.net/GMGripeSites.html sorry but not digging up the past with junk motors yes the 4-6-8 motor was ahead of its time but do not work so what good was it??? The 4100 junk motor made caddy a dam fool. As far as the orig northstar junk motor not much of a relic since lots of people are still pumping tons of money into these 90s junk motors as of right now. Dont get me wrong I been driveing caddys since the 1970s and at that time had little or no problem with junk motors plus at that time a caddy did not cost more than some peoples homes. I think if you go out and pay almost $50,000 for a car it should last at least 100,000 miles without any major engine work. anyone who dont agree is liveing in the past. I just read your posts and you are right on the money with the things you've said some people in these forum have the GM and Cadillac rose colored glasses on I think. No Peter, I have seen you post negative comments on other threads, so you need to hear this. This is an enthusiast's board, the love of a Cadillac is NOT logical. Its a Love and I suppose we do wear rose colored glasses. We Love the Cadillac and DO NOT care to hear what know it all malcontents thing. Do a search and you will see that we OVER AND OVER say this is an ENTHUSIAST'S board Yea..... you agree with BILLY? Pulling the 4100 and 468 out of 17 and 25 year history..... that is funny as hell... Wheres my negative posts I can't have an opinon. [Again, Please refrain from personal attacks] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95SevilleSLS Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 The base 368 engine used with the 8-6-4 multi-displacement was a terrific, reliable engine. The 8-6-4 multi-displacement got a lot of bad press; some of it was not deserved, as the owners did not like the performance as designed. It however was very simple to disable, and then the engine operated as any other engine. The HT4100 had a lot of early issues, which were corrected in the 4.5L and 4.9L engines. The 4.5 and 4.9L engines are terrific, reliable powerplants. The NS 4.6L is a nice engine. It tends to use oil for a variety of reasons which we have covered in depth -- low friction rings, bore hone, etc. Still a nice engine. Dang it! You said it was a 368 before I could finish my last post! Agreed, I loved my 4.5 that I had in my 90 caddy. 166,000 miles and ran like a freakin dream! Had a lot of power too. Nice engine?! It is a great engine! What other engine can be ran WOT for 300 hours? -Dusty- - 02 Seville STS, white diamond - 93 Sixty Special, Tan with vinyl top - 79 Coupe DeVille, Tan with Tan top - 06 GMC Sierra Z71, Black - 92 Silverado C1500, black and grey - 83 Chevy K10 Silverado, Black and Grey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 Wheres my negative posts I can't have an opinon. [] This is the NEGATIVE post I saw you post Well from all the posts it seems like every one of these cars trunks leak and I don't have the time or care to chase this leak on a 5 year old car that I bought for ten grand to get back and forth to work 2 miles down the street. Don't get me wrong I love this car and am a crazy person when it comes to keeping cars clean and waxed and basic maintenance. But I got in the trunk and my wife drove through the car wash and I can't see where it's comming from so the hell with it I pushed the knock out out and sprayed some primer and thats that. In a few years I plan on buying a late model STS and if this car gives me too many problems like some people have in this forum I will take it down to my familys pit and Take one of the Cat D 9 s and crush it into the ground. Sorry I just had a bad day I love my STS NUFF SAID, I may not post here everyday, but I get a flavor of what is going on, and I remembered this thread.... Like I said it was negative and unnecessary to attack the people on this forum Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Nunnally Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 This topic appears to have veered away from useful discussion and is closed. Bruce 2023 Cadillac CT4-V Blackwing Follow me on: Twitter Instagram Youtube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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