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awd escalade torque steer


gearhead450

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Need help,,when under heavy accelertion i get extreme torque steer to the right ,to the point that the right front tire breaks traction as if the rear wheels are not driving the car at all.Its a 2003 ecalade that i purchased new and has never done this before.It started about 8 months ago and have had it to 2 cadillac dealers and they tell me there is nothing wrong with it.I drove others and they dont do it and i know there is something not right with mine,Can anyone suggest anything?

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Air pressure correct? Same tires all around? OEM tire sizes? Alignment correct?

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

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I found this, I hope it helps, Mike

Document ID# 1480147

2003 Cadillac Escalade

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Steering Pull, Lead Left on Acceleration and Lead Right on Deceleration - kw accelerate alignment decelerate front gear GMT820 torque #PI00751B - (Mar 22, 2004)

Steering Pull, Lead Left on Acceleration and Lead Right on Deceleration.

When servicing the vehicle with the VIN you entered, the following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the described symptoms.

Condition/Concern:

Vehicle may torque steer to the left with aggressive acceleration, and/or may steer to the right with deceleration.

Recommendation/Instructions:

Items to check when performing initial vehicle inspection:

  • Check tire pressures and verify conformance to 30 psi. Check for visible tire damage.
  • Verify there are no brake drags present by putting vehicle on frame lift and rotating tires
  • Examine front suspension for any visible indications of damage.
  • Observe front suspension upper control arm alignment tabs and verify the drilled hole in the alignment is centered over frame[rsquo ]s alignment pin. Verify all control arm bolts are tight.
  • Confirm that the rear suspension air leveling system is operating. With the ignition on and the vehicle at curb weight, there should be pressure in the rear shock absorber air bags. If an air line is removed at the rear shock and air escapes until both bags go flat, the system is likely working. Reinstall air line, turn ignition on, and weight for air compressor to energize air supply.
  • Verify that the steering wheel is accurately centered when the vehicle is going straight. This can be done on a known flat, no crown, road during a no load condition at speeds between 25 and 40 mph. The preferred method would be to do this on an alignment rack.
  • Measure the front wheel opening heights to ground. With tires at 30 psi, full load of fuel, and no occupants, measure from ground to highest point of the wheel opening. With the vehicle in the described condition, it is typical that the vehicle will have a lean with the right side being high. Right opening heights are typically 910 mm +/-5 mm (35.8 in +/- 0.2 in). Left opening heights are typically 900 mm +/-5 mm (32 in +/- 0.2 in). A 10 mm (0.39 in) difference, right side high is typical.
  • Examine the steering intermediate shaft and the joint between the upper and lower intermediate shafts. There must be no play in this attachment.
After verifying all of the above, and that the vehicle still pulls left during acceleration:

  • Loosen all three steering attachment bolts, do not remove. Push upward on the steering relay rod at the pitman arm joint and retorque the steering gear attachment bolts at the same time.
  • Put the vehicle on an alignment rack. Reset the front trim heights by turning the two torsion bar adjuster bolts. With the tires at 30 psi, full fuel, and no occupants, adjust so that both left and right front wheel openings have a relative height to ground of 910 mm (35.8 in). In Z height terminology, this will put the LF Z height at 116 mm (4.57 in) and the RF Z height at 111 mm (4.37 in). It is probable that the vehicle will require a left side torsion bar adjuster change to 15592574 (White stripe).
  • Set front alignment as follows: Right front caster = +3.5 degrees Left front caster = +2.8 degrees Camber, both sides = +0.25 degrees Total Toe = +0.1 degrees Tolerance is +/- 0.1 degrees on all measurements. Caster is ground (not frame compensated)
  • Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(02, 03, 04 GMC Denali, Denali XL, Yukon, Yukon XL) and (02, 03, 04 Cadillac Escalade, Escalade EXT)

© Copyright General Motors Corporation. All Rights Reserved.

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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I found this, I hope it helps, Mike

Document ID# 1480147

2003 Cadillac Escalade

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Steering Pull, Lead Left on Acceleration and Lead Right on Deceleration - kw accelerate alignment decelerate front gear GMT820 torque #PI00751B - (Mar 22, 2004)

Steering Pull, Lead Left on Acceleration and Lead Right on Deceleration.

When servicing the vehicle with the VIN you entered, the following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the described symptoms.

Condition/Concern:

Vehicle may torque steer to the left with aggressive acceleration, and/or may steer to the right with deceleration.

Recommendation/Instructions:

Items to check when performing initial vehicle inspection:

  • Check tire pressures and verify conformance to 30 psi. Check for visible tire damage.
  • Verify there are no brake drags present by putting vehicle on frame lift and rotating tires
  • Examine front suspension for any visible indications of damage.
  • Observe front suspension upper control arm alignment tabs and verify the drilled hole in the alignment is centered over frame[rsquo ]s alignment pin. Verify all control arm bolts are tight.
  • Confirm that the rear suspension air leveling system is operating. With the ignition on and the vehicle at curb weight, there should be pressure in the rear shock absorber air bags. If an air line is removed at the rear shock and air escapes until both bags go flat, the system is likely working. Reinstall air line, turn ignition on, and weight for air compressor to energize air supply.
  • Verify that the steering wheel is accurately centered when the vehicle is going straight. This can be done on a known flat, no crown, road during a no load condition at speeds between 25 and 40 mph. The preferred method would be to do this on an alignment rack.
  • Measure the front wheel opening heights to ground. With tires at 30 psi, full load of fuel, and no occupants, measure from ground to highest point of the wheel opening. With the vehicle in the described condition, it is typical that the vehicle will have a lean with the right side being high. Right opening heights are typically 910 mm +/-5 mm (35.8 in +/- 0.2 in). Left opening heights are typically 900 mm +/-5 mm (32 in +/- 0.2 in). A 10 mm (0.39 in) difference, right side high is typical.
  • Examine the steering intermediate shaft and the joint between the upper and lower intermediate shafts. There must be no play in this attachment.
After verifying all of the above, and that the vehicle still pulls left during acceleration:
  • Loosen all three steering attachment bolts, do not remove. Push upward on the steering relay rod at the pitman arm joint and retorque the steering gear attachment bolts at the same time.
  • Put the vehicle on an alignment rack. Reset the front trim heights by turning the two torsion bar adjuster bolts. With the tires at 30 psi, full fuel, and no occupants, adjust so that both left and right front wheel openings have a relative height to ground of 910 mm (35.8 in). In Z height terminology, this will put the LF Z height at 116 mm (4.57 in) and the RF Z height at 111 mm (4.37 in). It is probable that the vehicle will require a left side torsion bar adjuster change to 15592574 (White stripe).
  • Set front alignment as follows: Right front caster = +3.5 degrees Left front caster = +2.8 degrees Camber, both sides = +0.25 degrees Total Toe = +0.1 degrees Tolerance is +/- 0.1 degrees on all measurements. Caster is ground (not frame compensated)
  • Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(02, 03, 04 GMC Denali, Denali XL, Yukon, Yukon XL) and (02, 03, 04 Cadillac Escalade, Escalade EXT)

© Copyright General Motors Corporation. All Rights Reserved.

Thanks,dealer checked that ,but mine is opposite and my right front wheel breaks traction,that bullitin was not it

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Do you have rear wheel steering?

I would have the alignment checked by an independent shop. I would rotate the tires and see if it makes any difference. Obviously something is wrong and I am really surprised that it was not found in my post above that was extensive analysis. Check this:

IPB Image

IPB Image

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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Have the THRUST ANGLE on your alignment checked, Positive Thrust Angle will pull you to the right... I would have an independent shop check it, see this:

Thrust Angles Description

IPB Image

The front wheels aim or steer the vehicle. The rear wheels control tracking. This tracking action relates to the thrust angle (3). The thrust angle is the path that the rear wheels take. Ideally, the thrust angle is geometrically aligned with the body centerline (2).

In the illustration, toe-in is shown on the left rear wheel, moving the thrust line (1) off center. The resulting deviation from the centerline is the thrust angle.

Thrust Angle

Thrust angle is the line that divides the total angle of the rear wheels. The rear tires are not just following the front tires, they are actually establishing direction of the vehicle. In doing so, a direction of thrust is developed. The thrust angle created by the rear wheels is used as a reference for aligning the front wheels. Ideally, the thrust angle should be identical to the geometric centerline of the vehicle.

If thrust angle and geometric centerline are identical, the position of the tires would then form an absolute rectangle and the front tires could be aligned to the rear tires, resulting in a perfectly centered steering wheel.

Because of unitized construction, factory tolerances and a varying degree of damage and/or wear, it is increasingly unlikely that the axles will be parallel. When the rear axle projects a different angle than the front axle, the driver will need to turn the steering wheel to compensate in order to drive in a straight line.

On situations where the thrust line and geometric centerline are not identical, a thorough inspection of the rear axle and suspension system must be done. Replacing defective components should aid in positioning thrust angle close to the geometric centerline.

If the thrust angle is not identical to the geometric centerline and there are no defective components, align the vehicle using the thrust angle instead of the geometric centerline. Aligning the front wheels to the thrust angle is preferred to aligning to the geometric centerline. The ability to do this is a significant advantage of four wheel alignment. The result should be a straight steering wheel as the vehicle moves straight-ahead.

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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Seems to me an alignment problem would manifest itself all the time. What you're describing sounds exactly like torque steer -- like what you might get from a FWD platform. I think your suspicion is that the center AWD unit (the "transfer case") is not sending power to the rear axle for some reason, and I tend to agree with that, based solely on your description of what's going on. It sounds like a visit to the dealer is in order. This may be covered by warranty still. Didn't Cadillacs have a 5 year/60,000 mile powertrain warranty?

Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond)

"When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?"

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Seems to me an alignment problem would manifest itself all the time. What you're describing sounds exactly like torque steer -- like what you might get from a FWD platform. I think your suspicion is that the center AWD unit (the "transfer case") is not sending power to the rear axle for some reason, and I tend to agree with that, based solely on your description of what's going on. It sounds like a visit to the dealer is in order. This may be covered by warranty still. Didn't Cadillacs have a 5 year/60,000 mile powertrain warranty?

yes its a warranty item,,but why would the right front wheel break traction on a alignment problem?and yes it exactly like the old fwd torque steer

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gearhead450,

This is a *very* interesting thread.

I hope you'll post back when you find the answer. Too many people neglect to do that.

Regards,

Warren

Posted Image

There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved. - Ludwig von Mises

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If your rear strut or air shock is wear or not supporting the torque could lift the opposite front, look your LR strut/air shock assembly to be sure their is no problem.

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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If your rear strut or air shock is wear or not supporting the torque could lift the opposite front, look your LR strut/air shock assembly to be sure their is no problem.

Thanks to everyone who has replied.I now have some ave. to pursue.I now have a feeling it might be in my air suspension or my rear wheels are not driving at all,Im open to other ideas but will let everyone know when and if i find the problem.Could be a big fire in the future of my escalade

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Just to eliminate issues, I would rotate the tires and make sure the problem does not chase a tire/wheel combination.

Bruce

2016 Cadillac ATS-V gray/black

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yes its a warranty item,,but why would the right front wheel break traction on a alignment problem?and yes it exactly like the old fwd torque steer

The right front wheel SHOULD NOT be breaking traction if the AWD system is working, regardless of the alignment or condition of the shocks. If any wheel is breaking traction, on a reasonable surface such as dry pavement, it means that the AWD system is probably not distributing the torque correctly. It could also be something like a wheel speed sensor problem, MAYBE. But my guess is that it's some function of the AWD system misbehaving.

Especially if it's a warranty issue, take it to the dealer and replicate the problem for the dealer tech. Sounds like a weird one.

Jason(2001 STS, White Diamond)

"When you turn your car on...does it return the favor?"

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Here is a description of the 2003 AWD system:

Transfer Case Description and Operation

The Borg Warner (BW) model 4481, RPO NR3 transfer case is a one-speed, full time, all wheel drive (AWD), transfer case. The transfer case provides power to both axles, through an external planetary type differential, which has two different sets of pinion gears. The planetary differential provides a 40/60 torque split, front/rear, full time. This means both axles are constantly being driven for maximum traction in all conditions.

The transfer case external type planetary differential functions the same as a typical rear axle differential. The transfer case differential pinion gears function as the spider gears, and the sun gears function as the side gears.

The following actions occur because of the planetary differential:

If the vehicle is on a hoist, the front propeller shaft can be rotated by hand.

The vehicle cannot be driven if one propeller shaft is removed.

Operating the vehicle on the hoist can damage the differential pinion gears, by over-spinning.

Operating the vehicle with one propeller shaft removed causes over-spinning of the differential pinion gears.

The BW 4481 design of the planetary differential allows the use with the Vehicle Stability Enhancement System (VSES) vehicles. The VSES takes use of the planetary differential, by applying braking to a tire that has less traction and dividing the engine torque to the other axle.

The BW 4481 case halves are high-pressure, die-cast magnesium. Ball bearings support the input shaft, the front output shaft, and the rear output shaft. The transfer case requires DEXRON®III ATF GM P/N 12346143 (Canadian P/N 10952622), which is red in color

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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yes its a warranty item,,but why would the right front wheel break traction on a alignment problem?and yes it exactly like the old fwd torque steer

The right front wheel SHOULD NOT be breaking traction if the AWD system is working, regardless of the alignment or condition of the shocks. If any wheel is breaking traction, on a reasonable surface such as dry pavement, it means that the AWD system is probably not distributing the torque correctly. It could also be something like a wheel speed sensor problem, MAYBE. But my guess is that it's some function of the AWD system misbehaving.

Especially if it's a warranty issue, take it to the dealer and replicate the problem for the dealer tech. Sounds like a weird one.

I have had it in two two dealers,both say they agree with me ,then they cant find whats wrong then they say its normal,,and again i know its not normal

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How badly is it breaking traction, can you hear the tire screech?

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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find a similar vehicle and take a test drive. if it drives the same as yours, than maybe the dealer has a point. but if you say your vehicle is behaving different than you seem to recall than something must be up.

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