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I am not the brightest bulb in this pack and do not type very well therefore I do not post very often. But I enjoy reading this board.

Would like to see some comments on the below listed bulletin.

Models:

2007 and Prior GM passenger cars and trucks (including Saturn)

Perhaps someone can comment on Bulletin 00-06-006C

Dated May1, 2006

Subject: DEX-Cool ® Engine Coolant Information.

Supercede:

This Bulletin is being revised to update information. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 00-06-02-006B (Section 06-Engine/Propulson SYSTEM)

Various section are listed

Sealing tabs, Water Quality, Back Service, Contamination ect.

Question falls under Sealing Tabs.

"Cooling system tabslets (Seal Tabs) should NOT be used as a regular maintenance item after servicing a cooling system. Discoloration of coolant can occur if seal tabs are repeatly used over the service life of the vehicle. Where approprate, seal tabs may be used if diagnostics fail to repair a small leak in the cooling system. When a condition appears in which seal tabs may be recommended, a specific bulletin will be released describing their proper usage."

I would like to change Coolant every 2 or 3 years NOT 5 years.

Any comments appreciated.

Thanks

Frank

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My '04 did not have the sealing product factory installed. I suspect "discoloration" complaints from owners was a factor in the GM decision to discontinue routine use in production engines.

I use the fact that the material is visible in the surge tank as proof there is sufficient sealing product in the coolant. It might be an ugly brown source of worry to some owners, but to me, it is simply inexpensive insurance against nuisance leaks.

Jim

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"Cooling system tabslets (Seal Tabs) should NOT be used as a regular maintenance item after servicing a cooling system. Discoloration of coolant can occur if seal tabs are repeatly used over the service life of the vehicle.

Frank, I would have to concur with the previous poster. As far as I know, seal tabs have always been recommended with the Nothys (this coming from the Guru). The verbiage "Discoloration of coolant..." indicates to me that dealers were probably receiving complaints about coolant color and/or chunks of debris. Even if the Service Writer advised a customer correctly, I could see the customer thinking it was a line of BS.

I'll be using tabs every time I change coolant.

Just my $.02.

Mark

<!--fonto:Arial--><span style="font-family:Arial"><!--/fonto-->2007 DTS Performance - 50K

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As a matter of fact, I <i>am</i> driving 70 MPH in a phone booth.

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This is an interesting line of discussion.

First. It was confirmed that the tabs do NOTHING to prevent a head gasket failure.

Second GM has waffled on this at least 3 times since the Northstar system replaced the 4.x motors... At first... use them... Then when the 3.5 shortstar came out in 99/2000... Not needed... Then Umm no... never mind... about that, keep using them; they can't do any harm... Then starting in 04 -> No, we were right in 2000, Don't use them....

I'm confused...

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Greg

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This is an interesting line of discussion.

First. It was confirmed that the tabs do NOTHING to prevent a head gasket failure.

Second GM has waffled on this at least 3 times since the Northstar system replaced the 4.x motors... At first... use them... Then when the 3.5 shortstar came out in 99/2000... Not needed... Then Umm no... never mind... about that, keep using them; they can't do any harm... Then starting in 04 -> No, we were right in 2000, Don't use them....

I'm confused...

Let me add that I was reading the cooling system section of my 1996 Buick Regal shop manual and it says to add 2 Tabs to the cooling system when serviced.

As I said I like to service the cooling system of the Northstar about every 2 or 3 years and would include 3 Tabs in the lower hose BUT I am concerned about clogging something.

Thanks

Frank

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It gives me great pleasure to post this information from a good ole friend of ours "The Guru":

The original coolant supplement pellets (or dog turds as they are affectionately known ) were 1 inch in diameter and 5/8 inch thick. A 4.1/4.5/4.9 got dosed with 6 of those at the factory. A Northstar got dosed with 3 of those at the factory.

The size of the pellets was reduced several years ago. The "concentration" of the pellets is the same and the material is the same but the size of the pellet got smaller. You need to put about 5 of the newer, smaller pellets to equal 3 of the original. So a 4.1/4,5/4.9 engine would get 10 of the new ones and a Northstar would get 5 of the new ones. It sounds like you bought the new size. Don't worry too much about overdosing. The coolant supplement/sealer will not hurt anything and any plugging problems are very rare and usually due to improper installation of the pellets.

The pellets do not need to be crushed to be installed. They will melt and turn to mush very quickly. The factory did not crush them.... It won't hurt to crush them but it is not really necessary.

The pellets DO need to be introduced into the system so that they are in the bulk flow path of the coolant. A 4.1/4.5/4.9 gets the pellets put into the radiator. It will be necessary to crush the pellets with this engine as it is nearly impossible to get the full size pellet into the radiator tank because of the limited space in the end tank due to the trans cooler.

It is important with a Northstar to put the pellets into the RADIATOR HOSE not just put them into the pressurized surge tank. There is very little coolant circulation thru the pressurized surge tank of the Northstar system by design so the sealer will stay in the tank and may clog the coolant delivery line to the pump inlet. By putting the pellets into the radiator hose the bulk flow of the coolant quickly disperses the sealant thru the system. Either radiator hose is fine for the pellet installation.

The pellets do not "dissolve" per se. They just disentigrate and the tiny fibers/particles go into suspension into the coolant and are dispersed throughout the system.

The GM pellets are made by the same guys who make BarsLeak. The BarsLeak sealant is exactly the same stuff. You can buy the dry powder BarsLeak "gold" sealant in a small tube at most autoparts stores. DO NOT use the BarsLeak "liquid aluminum" sealant as the tiny metal particles will cause clogging in the sytem.

The sealant is simply ground up ginger root and walnut shells. Simple and effective.

Those who are familiar with Detroit know that it is famous for Vernors Ginger Ale. The BarsLeak company is located in Holly,Michigan, about 45 miles from Detroit. Guess where they got their ginger root from.... It was basically the trash from Vernors... Since Vernors left Detroit BarsLeak now has to buy the ginger direct and the cost went up considerably.

Personally , I recommend using the coolant supplement with both the green conventional coolant and the DexCool. There is nothing about DexCool that negates the need for the coolant supplement.

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Well, I do know they are sold in Pep Boys and its not just a GM oriented product, so I see no reason why they can't be used on other engines. Here is Bar's leaks web page, the tablets are down the page a bit:

http://www.barsproducts.com/product.cfm?id=37

Here is Bar's Leaks FAQ's find this section BAR’S LEAKS RADIATOR STOP LEAK

http://www.barsproducts.com/faq.cfm#Radiator

Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >>

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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It gives me great pleasure to post this information from a good ole friend of ours "The Guru":

The original coolant supplement pellets (or dog turds as they are affectionately known ) were 1 inch in diameter and 5/8 inch thick. A 4.1/4.5/4.9 got dosed with 6 of those at the factory. A Northstar got dosed with 3 of those at the factory.

The size of the pellets was reduced several years ago. The "concentration" of the pellets is the same and the material is the same but the size of the pellet got smaller. You need to put about 5 of the newer, smaller pellets to equal 3 of the original. So a 4.1/4,5/4.9 engine would get 10 of the new ones and a Northstar would get 5 of the new ones. It sounds like you bought the new size. Don't worry too much about overdosing. The coolant supplement/sealer will not hurt anything and any plugging problems are very rare and usually due to improper installation of the pellets.

The pellets do not need to be crushed to be installed. They will melt and turn to mush very quickly. The factory did not crush them.... It won't hurt to crush them but it is not really necessary.

The pellets DO need to be introduced into the system so that they are in the bulk flow path of the coolant. A 4.1/4.5/4.9 gets the pellets put into the radiator. It will be necessary to crush the pellets with this engine as it is nearly impossible to get the full size pellet into the radiator tank because of the limited space in the end tank due to the trans cooler.

It is important with a Northstar to put the pellets into the RADIATOR HOSE not just put them into the pressurized surge tank. There is very little coolant circulation thru the pressurized surge tank of the Northstar system by design so the sealer will stay in the tank and may clog the coolant delivery line to the pump inlet. By putting the pellets into the radiator hose the bulk flow of the coolant quickly disperses the sealant thru the system. Either radiator hose is fine for the pellet installation.

The pellets do not "dissolve" per se. They just disentigrate and the tiny fibers/particles go into suspension into the coolant and are dispersed throughout the system.

The GM pellets are made by the same guys who make BarsLeak. The BarsLeak sealant is exactly the same stuff. You can buy the dry powder BarsLeak "gold" sealant in a small tube at most autoparts stores. DO NOT use the BarsLeak "liquid aluminum" sealant as the tiny metal particles will cause clogging in the sytem.

The sealant is simply ground up ginger root and walnut shells. Simple and effective.

Those who are familiar with Detroit know that it is famous for Vernors Ginger Ale. The BarsLeak company is located in Holly,Michigan, about 45 miles from Detroit. Guess where they got their ginger root from.... It was basically the trash from Vernors... Since Vernors left Detroit BarsLeak now has to buy the ginger direct and the cost went up considerably.

Personally , I recommend using the coolant supplement with both the green conventional coolant and the DexCool. There is nothing about DexCool that negates the need for the coolant supplement.

Tahanks.

Appreciate the comments.

The tabs work.

Our 1996 Regal 3.8 Motor had the famous Plastic manifold leak coolant about 4 years ago and we had it replaced for about $1200.

Recently noticed it was slightly leaking coolant again.

Remembered reading about tabs in the shop manual.

Drained some coolant crushed up 3 Tabs and put n coolant system.

Within 100miles Intake manifold stopped leaking.

Thanks again for all the input!

Frank

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On those GM bashing sites, there were many people swearing that their cooling system is full of rust & debris - as the orange coolant had a tint of brown. I believe we all agreed in another post that these people are confused with the tabs. Those of us "in the know" I am sure can confidently continue to use the tablets. Your coolant will not look pretty orange, but we will appreciate the benefits of the supplement as the GM engineers designed.

I think it's funny that the guys that followed the procedure and added the tablets, probably got complaints from customers saying their cooling system is still full of rust!!!

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Great info BodybyFisher. Thanks.

Are you aware of any 'GM blessing' about using 'turds' with other GM engines? Not necessarily all aluminum ones like N* but with aluminum head/heads.

As far as I can gather, GM first used this product to help seal the cooling system on the 4.1/4.5/4.9 family of engines. These engines are infamous for developing "secret" internal leaks that contaminate the oil and basically "kill" the motor. These motors all have cast iron heads (AL blocks though)

The pellets were an easy fix for these motors... Not sure if these were the first, but they are definitely the most important.

caddy.jpg

Easin' down the highway in a new Cadillac,

I had a fine fox in front, I had three more in the back

ZZTOP, I'm Bad I'm Nationwide

Greg

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Is quite interesting that that bulliten was issued May, 1, 06.

I had my coolant serviced the beginning of Oct this year 06.

The service manager told me in no way did GM recomend or authorize the use of any additive in the coolant.

I argued with him about this for almost a week from the time of the service.

It states on the cowling over my rad that the pellets are required, and that the # of pellets is "I believe" 3.

It is written and labeled right under the hood. GM put that sticker there.

He finally said he would look into it.

After a week he contacted me per voice mail saying that "yes GM does recomend the tablets as stated".

I recieved that message after pulling into my garage with coolant pissing out of my vehicle. The call/message was left that afternoon.

Wether or not it was related is hard to say. Chances are not.

But what makes me wonder is the date of the bulliten that you have posted.

May 01 06

As compared to the date of the info that the GM service manager informed me that yes GM does recomend them.

Oct 23 06.

Personally.

If it was originally recomended and as such for that X amount of years. Then I would continue to do what was originally recomended.

As to other vehicles.....If not recomended then dont bother.

Is a shame that GM and its affiliates cant seem to get it all together as to what should or shouldnt be done.

Am wondering if its possible if we as consumers could do something to get some final and straight forward answer to this concern.

Makes you wonder if GM even knows what is really going on. And are possibly continuing to shuffle the deck to keep themselves out of the deep ?

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GM has recommended the sealant pellets for a long time. My 1997 FSM recommends them. The bulletin in May was an update or revision.

As to the service manager who didn't know about the pellets, I can only say that there is a shortage of good service managers in the world, but there is no shortage of idiots. Sometimes it takes a while to tell the difference, and then it takes longer to do something constructive about it. I'm grateful for the two Cadillac dealers that I have dealt with in the last ten years, and for their service managers.

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