bigjayzway Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 Well it happened. I was driving, and next thing I knew....I could not see anything out the back window. All I saw was smoke...lots of it! White smoke. Of coarse I thaught the worst, and was thinking there goes the motor. I pulled over, and I had a sigh of relief, when I saw a huge ½ hole in the side of the rad!.. I know, relief? Better than a head, I guess. Well I went to get another rad.....NOPE. Not around here! 2 weeks before I could get one with the oil cooler, and extra capacity. SO! I took one without the cooler lines for the oil, and plugged the lines. Fits great, and runs awesome. Saved $345.00 too!!! I am now happy. Just thaught I would share this with you all. Big Jay Life is too short to grow up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CadiKing Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 I took one without the cooler lines for the oil, and plugged the lines. Fits great, and runs awesome. Saved $345.00 too!!! I am now happy. Just thaught I would share this with you all. Big Jay Hey Jay! What about the ol cooler lines? Are you sure they're not tranny cooler lines..? Won't the oil get hot? just asking.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acklac7 Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 I believe somone on the site pinched there tranny coolant line while R&R'ing the radiator. The pinched line caused the tranny to overheat and go south....I sure hope you didn't plug the trans cooler line! (if your model has one to begin with) A.J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 I believe somone on the site pinched there tranny coolant line while R&R'ing the radiator. The pinched line caused the tranny to overheat and go south....I sure hope you didn't plug the trans cooler line! (if your model has one to begin with) This is EXACTLY what I thought of Jay when you said you disconnected your cooler lines. BE VERY CAREFUL, you may overheat your tranny and it will be toast. See this http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...ion+cooler+line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 2, 2005 Report Share Posted November 2, 2005 By the way you have two different cars listed one with a 4.9 and one with a 4.6 specify which car we are talking about. I assume its the 98, Mike My 96 has tranny cooler lines attached to the left side of the radiator, did you plug those? Are you planning on keeping this radiator or is this just holding you over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjayzway Posted November 4, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 By the way you have two different cars listed one with a 4.9 and one with a 4.6 specify which car we are talking about. I assume its the 98, Mike My 96 has tranny cooler lines attached to the left side of the radiator, did you plug those? Are you planning on keeping this radiator or is this just holding you over? I changed the rad in the 98 STS, and yes I did remove the OIL cooler lines. It came with or without this year. I removed the lines all together, and pluged the holes with M20 drain plugs. It works great! I don't pull a trailer, so it really isn't an issue. I am just happy I saved so much money, and didn't have to wait almost 2 weeks for a rad! If anyone needs to replace their rad, and is worried about the oil cooler lines, don't worry. Big Jay Life is too short to grow up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I don't know what this converts to in canadian dollars but rockauto has your radiator with oil cooler for $194.79. I will try to find out how important the oil cooler is. Its unlikely that GM would go to the trouble to add an oil cooler if you didn't need it. Given that your oil will be hotter you may want to consider utilizing a higher viscosity if you begin to hear tappet or knocking, hot oil tends to thin out more. You speak about towing, you need a transmission cooler if you are towing, towing does not affect engine oil cooling. The end tanks house a transmission oil cooler in the right side and and engine oil cooler in the left side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 One more thing, if you are not cooling your oil to the spec assumed by the PCM, do not change your oil any more based on the Oil Life Monitor you will want to change it more frequently. The oil life monitor takes into consideration that the oil is cooled to a certain temp, which will no longer be happening. Just a thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navion Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 By the way you have two different cars listed one with a 4.9 and one with a 4.6 specify which car we are talking about. I assume its the 98, Mike My 96 has tranny cooler lines attached to the left side of the radiator, did you plug those? Are you planning on keeping this radiator or is this just holding you over? I changed the rad in the 98 STS, and yes I did remove the OIL cooler lines. It came with or without this year. I removed the lines all together, and pluged the holes with M20 drain plugs. It works great! I don't pull a trailer, so it really isn't an issue. I am just happy I saved so much money, and didn't have to wait almost 2 weeks for a rad! If anyone needs to replace their rad, and is worried about the oil cooler lines, don't worry. Big Jay On my 94 SLS, it did not have the oil cooler, but it DID have a line that looped back into the oil filter adapter. I suspect that the oil cooler bypass valve is forced to remain open due to your plugs. At the very least, I would check to see if your engine should be equipped with the loop. I think that there is a possibility that you are also bypassing your oil filter with this set-up. When I needed a radiator, I bought it off of the internet. I bought it from U. S. Auto Parts (Team Radiator) in July of 03. It listed for $536.37 and cost $159.96. Shipping was included. When I opened it I noticed that it had the oil AND the trans cooler. I have since put over 25,000 miles on it with no (radiator) problems. Britt Britt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjayzway Posted November 4, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I had my mechanic check into the oil cooler lines before I did anything. I am not bypassing anything, nor am I doing any harm to the oil itself. Some models came with, some without the cooler, and extra capacity. I made sure of all these problems that could be before I went ahead with this procedure. Thanks for the concern guys. Big Jay Life is too short to grow up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regis Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Wow Jay! I think some of us are just stunned and at a loss for words at your justification for going the "cheap" route. An appropriate analogy here would be a windshield without any wipers. Sure it'll run fine..... until you need them. Have you ever tried running your car without the EGR canister? Runs great if not better. However, the cylinder heads get incredibly hot without the egr in place but since that can't be seen during normal operation of the car that must mean it's OK to do......right? Since the weather is cooling off and if you only make short drives and don't get caught in heavy traffic I think you'll probably be OK. But come summer or a situation where things heat up.....I think you'll wish you had done things properly. I'm not going to try to assess the competency of your mechanic but i'll simply say that it's very difficult to find a mechanic that knows the Northstar engine. I wish you luck Jay. "Burns" rubber " I've never considered myself to be all that conservative, but it seems the more liberal some people get the more conservative I become. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimD Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 My '98 does not have the (optional) crankcase oil cooler plumbing, or the fittings in the radiator tank. What would be the oil cooler fittings at the oil filter adapter are plugged closed. There is no loop-back tubing installed. The are many differences between '97 and earlier compared to '98 to '04 Sevilles. Jim Drive your car. Use your cell phone. CHOOSE ONE ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Jay, all I can say is that you are a piece of work. Why do you come here? Didn't it occur to you that it might be a good idea to run this idea by a few people familiar with your car before you redesign your oil cooling system? ME? If it has an oil cooler, I replace it with an oil cooler! SAVE MONEY? You are driving a Cadillac man, maintain it correctly! Oh but that's right you are the guy that suggested this: "If you don't want to spend too much, you could use small C clamps on the top of the airbox. There are some really small ones, and if you paint them black, you will not notice them." http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...c=7259&hl=clamp You have said this about your mechanic: Awesome info. from everyone.... Thanks so much. I showed my mechanic the posts, and he is now informed. He is taking this advice seriously, and talked to his father(owner of the shop) They are going to change their ways. That was after this: Well I am going to flush and fill the rad this week. My mechanic tells me to go with the regular coolant(green). What should I do? In spite of that, you have SO much confidence in your mechanic to REDESIGN the OIL COOLING SYSTEM and then come here and DISPUTE an airplane mechanic (britt) with your "mechanics" opinion? You don't run this controversial "repair" by this board at all and make this statement, "If anyone needs to replace their rad, and is worried about the oil cooler lines, don't worry! All I know is this, if any of your vehicles end up in the FOR SALE section, I will be clicking the BACK button quickly, I wonder what the Guru would think about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 My '98 does not have the (optional) crankcase oil cooler plumbing, or the fittings in the radiator tank. What would be the oil cooler fittings at the oil filter adapter are plugged closed. There is no loop-back tubing installed. The are many differences between '97 and earlier compared to '98 to '04 Sevilles. I don't have any fittings at the oil filter adaptor either but I do have an oil cooler in the radiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgnoon Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Jeeze, a little harsh there mike? :-) If the mechanic says it's fine, and it ends up not being so, then come time to replace the tranny...Jay files a lovely little lawsuit. Perhaps even one with a settlement ample enough to replace the '98 with an '06/'07 STS? :-) With a good lawyer perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adallak Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 The Guru recommended to bypass a leaky tranny cooler (on the other forum). It was 4.9, but I do not think it makes much difference. QUOTE: "A leaking oil cooler in the radiator end tank will cause oil in the coolant. No question. That is what it is. Follow the oil cooler lines from the oil filter adapter at the oil filter. They go to the end tank of the radiator. You can remove the radiator from the car, unbend the tangs that crimp the end tank in place and remove the end tank. That will allow you to remove the oil cooler in the end tank and replace it. If the car is just driven locally and never used for towing or anything it is fine to disconnect or bypass the oil cooler if you want to for a beater. Just cut the oil cooler lines/hoses near the radiator fittings and hook then together to bypass the cooler. Use a piece of tubing and clamps. If you do this, use double clamps and safety wire the clamps together the keep the hoses from pushing apart when the oil pressure is high on cold starts. It is perfectly fine to run without the cooler. The oils since the engine was engineered for 1992 have improved considerably and will easily handle the normal operating temperature of the 4.9 unless you are doing some heavy duty driving such as towing or continuous hill climbing in a hot ambient. Use the 15W40 Delo/Delvac/Rotella oils in it and it will be fine without the cooler. You should take care of this ASAP as likely coolant is getting into the oil but you don't see it. That will happen when the system is shut down and the hot (pressurized) radiator pushes coolant into the oil side of the cooler. This has the effect of depleting the oil and causing potentially severe engine wear. I would bypass the cooler or replace it and change the oil immediately. Use the heavy duty oil mentioned and add a pint of GM EOS (engine oil supplement) available at any GM dealer to spike the oil with the ZDP antiwear additives to prevent any further scuffing or wear that may have started. Don't delay and don't bypass the oil change and EOS addition." The saddest thing in life is wasted talent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Jeeze, a little harsh there mike? :-) If the mechanic says it's fine, and it ends up not being so, then come time to replace the tranny...Jay files a lovely little lawsuit. Perhaps even one with a settlement ample enough to replace the '98 with an '06/'07 STS? :-) With a good lawyer perhaps. Yes it is harsh, it was intended to be harsh. Since you only have 33 posts, you probably didn't know that I can be harsh. I am harsh when unsupported, unsanctioned, unresearched, untested, undiscussed; ideas, fixes, "solutions" are put forward as a good thing. I have a real problem with that. The audacity not to discuss an issue as serious as this with the knowledgeable people on this board and then to come back and throw out Rube Goldberg solutions is irresponsible and amateurish, especially since the "mechanic" has already shown himself to be uninformed. I will jump all over this type of bull crap everytime I see it so that new members that search for radiator problems 2 years from now don't find this and think that it is a reasonable thing to do. I want to say something plain and simple. EVERYTHING I HAVE DONE ON MY 1991 SEVILLE AND 1996 DEVILLE, AND I HAVE DONE A LOT, I HAVE DISCUSSED, GOTTEN ADVICE, RESEARCHED AND RUN THE IT BY THE KNOWLEDGEABLE PEOPLE ON THIS BOARD. Maybe I am too idealistic, maybe I am old-school or maybe I am too orthodox. Maybe I see this as a family that comes together and discusses their Cadillac issues before they go ahead and do anything substantial. Those who know me, can you imagine me, ME.... doing anything on my Deville without discussing it here first? How incredible would it be for me to..... replace my starter without discussing it here?, let alone me redesigning, modifying or eliminating any components! I would discuss it here! Like I said, maybe I am too idealistic. Not even that.... setting aside the technical side of the discussion, Jay says he saved $359, when a new one is only $160! If he came here he would have gotten the correct radiator, at a great price and we would have suggested going to a radiator shop and having the side tank replaced, for PEANUTS and keeping the radiator cooler! But his mechanic knows better.... Every once in a while I lose myself and think that this is a community, I think that we are, a family, a group and it takes something like this to make me realize that this is just a bunch of letters on a monitor in a virtual environment and it means nothing, is that what this is? Because that is what this thread was to me, its insulting and it wakes me up and makes me want to be reluctant to help. But like I said, I am too idealistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgnoon Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I know that you are harsh, and the post was a comment on such assumption. 33 Posts has nothing to do with anything. I've been reading since darn near when you joined. Nobody needs to be attacked like that. And if nobody else cares to comment on your harsh ways, then I will. (BTW: The smiley faces don't help any), And Although I agree with your feelings for the board, not everybody does, and we shouldn't assume tha tthey do. THANKS Scotty! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 By the way, you are talking to the wrong person about lawsuits. If I give the green light for someone to do something unorthodox on my car and something goes wrong, it is unethical and immoral for me to sue someone at that point since I shared in the decision making process, in this case to save money. I wish we would stop thinking that way as a society. I have a relative that has work done by home depot. floors, kitchens, etc. home depot as you know has sub-contractors do work for them. When the job is done, he finds something insignificant and then lodges a complaint and and badgers them and home depot eventually settles and gives back in some cases thousands of dollars. When he showed me the insignificant 'flaw' he had in his floor that he sued over, I was shocked, but then he gloats over getting $1400 back for it... He does it constantly.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I know that you are harsh, and the post was a comment on such assumption. 33 Posts has nothing to do with anything. I've been reading since darn near when you joined. Nobody needs to be attacked like that. And if nobody else cares to comment on your harsh ways, then I will. (BTW: The smiley faces don't help any), And Although I agree with your feelings for the board, not everybody does, and we shouldn't assume tha tthey do. THANKS Scotty! :-) The funny faces are not there to LAUGH they are tongue in cheek. But it seems you picked up on that, its sarcasm. I personally don't care if I am thought to be harsh, just so you know it, but since you have been reading since I have joined, you know that. Did you browse the old board also? I stand by my prior post about this being a community and a family and we share the common thread of our Cadillacs. However, I am too protective of this family and of some of the members thanks for the wake-up call, I ASSUME EVERYONE FEELS THE SAME WAY ABOUT THE BOARD WHEN THEY HAVE 570 POSTS.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgnoon Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Of course! I only just started posting myself when I picked up the new (old) car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willie Hank Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 The way I see it, this is a free forum and people can post what they want, and hopefully be professional. There are times I have not been professional, and tried to make humor, but ended up being insulting. I now refrain from logging in during the weekend late evenings, if I had a few. Bottom line, 'let the buyer beware' of information posted on this forum. That is, if someone makes a recommendation that may not be wise to others, its at your risk if you accept it or not. I will say this is a great site!!!! There are many people (like Scotty, Adcock, the LED guy, Cardio-Doc), that devote a lot of time sharing their own knowledge and expereinces. And there are 'newbies' that really don't understand the N* and/or want to take shortcuts, and save a buck. And, that alright too. I still think Bosch wires are just as good as OEM, and worth the money saved. But from the many posts I've read, I would not replace a N* alternator with anything but the OEM unit. I didn't bring this up for debate, but only to point out everyone has their own viewpoint, and rationale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Thanks Willie and you are right. Sorry, Big Jay, I just thought that we meant more to you and that you would consider discussing serious issues like you had with us and keep us in the loop. We could have solved your problem and solved it cheaply IMHO. From my perspective, your vehicle is less than it was with the oil cooler. Hey but I am old school when it comes to this stuff and take very few chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Scotty when I had my problems with my Seville you helped me like I was a brother, in other words family. You spoke with me on the phone and allowed me to air out my head and we together worked on solutions. There were many people on this board that gave there time to help me. Yes we are family here and if it takes a bit of "harshness" to keep me on the right track in taking care of my treasured Seville then by all means do what must be done. Everyone may not know it but I was ready to scrap my Seville, then the family here got together and made my car what it is today. When I press on the excelerator and feel how tight the engine is that Scotty found for me I think of this board. These cars are big investments, people take pride in there machines, people take pride in the help provided on this board, some take it personnal. There are not many now a days that give a hoot, let alone strangers. So if a stranger, that acts like family here, wants to take pride in what is posted here I think we are all luckey as hell to have them here. That is my openion and I'm sticking to it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 I just replaced my radiator about 2 months ago. The manufacturer is Performance. Cost $151.00 with free ground shipping at discountradiators.com. So far, I'm very happy with it. I also replaced both upper and lower hoses. My Eldorado has Trans cooler lines that feed into the radiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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