KenD Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 I am having a heck of a time getting this alternator out. I cannot seem to find bolt #4 for starters, then bolt #3 I believe is the one that backs out into the manifold as shown in the pics. Bolt #2 I have been able to take out, but bolt #1 I can't get any tools in there to get a good grip on. I hope that the pic shows the proper bolt to take out as it's behind my power steering line it seems. Or, is the bolt that I'm looking for the one that has a piece of negative battery cable attached to it. The FSM is a help, but in this case, I'm trying not to strip anything. I've attached some pics. Any help is appreciated. (pics aren't showing up for some reason) Ken 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Use a short wrench (I believe 13mm) to get at the two bolts on the back of the alternator. Once you loosen all the bolts sufficiently so the alternator can be moved a bit then you will be able to release some of the torque on the rear bolts and you may even be able to remove them without a wrench. You should protect the radiator with a piece of cardboard and drop the alternator out the bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Thanks Mac. I think that this alternator has been replaced before. Bolt #4 (rear) that I can't see, might not have been put back in. Bolt #3 (rear) that you can see when you look down on the alternator was backed out against the manifold already (loose) when I moved my cooling fan over for a better look. The one that is screwing me up is the bolt that is behind my power steering return line. I can't get a good grip on or leverage on it. I pretty sure I was using a 15mm wrench, but I would love to be able to get a socket on there for some leverage. I am determined to get this thing out! 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 When I did mine, I removed the battery and had to do a little rearranging of the cable and a line if I remember correctly. The bolt that backs out into the manifold was just enough to le it drop finally. Are you following a Helms Manual? Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 When I did mine, I removed the battery and had to do a little rearranging of the cable and a line if I remember correctly. The bolt that backs out into the manifold was just enough to le it drop finally. Are you following a Helms Manual? Kent Hi Kent, no, I'm using the factory service manual. So, that bolt that is behind my power steering return line is the bolt I'm looking for then. 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 I wish I was more computer smart. I'm sure you have it done by now but the Helms says, skipping 1 and 2 Remove or disconnect 3. air cleaner 4Left engine torque strut 5Upper trans cooler line 6Right cooling fan 7Left cooling fan ( Second time I just moved it over) 8Serpentine belt from generator 9Bolt from top of generator 10Bolt from lower front of generator 11Harness connector and output cable from generator 12 Two bolts from generator rear bracket to generator (the one nearest the exhaust manifold can only be backed out so far 13 A/C splash shield from cradle(3 bolts) 14Acess panel from bottom side of radiator suppot(4 Bolts.) 15Engine harness clip from cradle 16Generator from vehicle ( the generator comes right out that bottom hole if you hold it just right) I removed #13 and 14 right away my second time and did alot of the work from the bottom. at least you can get a different angle. I think I took the tire off too . It's a pain. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Okay, I got three of the 4 bolts out. The two front ones are out and the one the backs into the manifold is out (it was already out and loose so I'm assuming that this is the second time around for an alternator. I can't seem to find the 4th bolt though. I have the cooling fan moved over slightly so I could get the rear bolt that backs into the manifold (it was the closest bolt, ) Is the 4th bolt under the manifold slightly and that's why I can't see it? Is it one of the bolts that you have to do blindly, if you know what I mean? I haven't had to do #5 and I don't think that I would have to from what it looks like. I did remove the large upper coolant hose though. Did you do step #5? Kent, on #15 it says the engine harness clip from cradle....what is that? Does the alternator automatically drop after the last bolt is out? I have 3 bolts out and it still seems to be in there pretty solid. I can't wiggle it at all. Maybe a hammer is in order.... For the drivers side cooling fan, is the electrical connector right at the fan? Sorry for all the questions. It's still quite cold up here in Canada and I'm doing this piece by piece. For what it's worth, removing the battery as you had noted earlier made it much easier to get to that bolt that was behind the power steering return line. Ken 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Okay, I got three of the 4 bolts out. The two front ones are out and the one the backs into the manifold is out (it was already out and loose so I'm assuming that this is the second time around for an alternator. I can't seem to find the 4th bolt though. There are two bolts on the back of the alternator. Regarding the bolt that was already backed-out of the manifold, it cannot be removed while the alternator is still in position. It can, however, be backed out allowing the alternator to be removed (See factory Service Manual pg. 6D3-12, See No. 12). This manifold bolt is one of two on the back of the alternator, which are secured to a bracket. Bolts are to be torqued to no more than 36 LBS. FT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 The bolt that is backed out into the manifold, is attaching the generator to the rear generator bracket. There should be another bolt that is a little up and out(away from the motor) going through the same bracket and into the generator. I think this is the bolt you are looking for. It sounds like it might be missing. The generator should come down ok, be careful for a sudden release. Sort of a balance act. Remember how you get it to drop out so it goes back UP the same way. I think you have to free up the harness (remove it from attaching clip) for dropping room. Make sure you back the manifold bolt out as FAR as you can. Rethinking things, if the bolt that backs out into the manifold is the out (away from) bolt going through the rear generator bracket into the generator, the missing bolt is down and in towards the motor a little bit going through the same bracket in the same direction. That is also a pain but is does come out. Sorry about going in circles. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Thanks! I've attached a link to a picture of the bolt that I believe is the one that backs out into the manifold. So, if this is correct, then the other bolt is still up and behind this, correct? If so, then I think it's missing since I can't see it with a flashlight or cannot really feel it there either. Like I said earlier, when I moved my cooling fan, this is exactly the way that I found the bolt. LOOSE like this. http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t7/juli...r1/IMG_0935.jpg If that last bolt is missing then why isn't my alternator dropping down....things that make you go hmmmmmm... My wife says to take it to the garage. I say that you get no satisfaction taking it to the garage for the 3.5 book labour at $105 per hour. The money we save goes to a trip to the Domincan next year. That shut her up pretty quick and put a smile on her face. 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 That is the outer bolt. There should be another bolt in and lower towards the motor a little bit That bracket isn't real big. You should be able to see iT and reach it just barely. Maybe the head is snapped and that is why it won't drop. You still should be able to tell something if you get in the right area and locate the hole. I had to turn the fan and use little screwdriver(s) to release the snap connection from the fan. Have to go to town. Good luck! I just tied the radiator hose forward. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Thanks Kent. The only way that I can get more room to work is to take out the cooling fans. Once that is done, then I should be able to gain better access and have less headaches. Appreciate everyones input! Ken 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 I have heard this job is a nightmare, i think I would remove the cooling fans and radiator LOL Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 The right side (passenger side) cooling fan should be removed. If I remember correctly, the left side (driver's side) must be moved over or removed in order to provide ample room to move the right side fan over towards the driver's side. It's been a while so I don't remember if I removed both fans or simply detached both and moved them towards the driver's side. I strongly suggest that you use a piece of cardboard (or better a thin piece of Luan board which can be purchased at any Home Depot) to protect the radiator from being gashed by the alternator as you remove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kcd1184 Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 I did alot of the work from underneath and if I remember , that is the only place you can SEE the back bolt from. Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Well, as far as I can tell right now, one of the rear bolts is missing. I put my hand up to feel for it and all that's there is a hole where the bolt used to be. That explains also why the rear bolt that backs into the manifold is loose too.....lazy mechanic figured it was too hard to replace and left it out and then got lazier and didn't even screw the other rear bolt in when this sucker was replaced before. So, I will have to lift the car up and take off the shields to get to the last front bolt which was a mystery until I took a VERY hard and long look at my FSM and noticed that I was unscrewing the wrong bolt. DUH! I'll keep you posted. Supposed to be a balmy 5 degrees C tomorrow so I can work a little more on it. 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northstar Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 To get to the last bolt on the back of the alternator you come from the driver side and under the exhaust manifold with 2 long 3/8 extensions on your ratchet and a 15MM socket. This is why the FSM says to remove BOTH fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkz71 Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 I did the alternator on my 95 Eldo. It's very easy to remove the pass side fan, which makes it easy to get to the rear bolts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 To get to the last bolt on the back of the alternator you come from the driver side and under the exhaust manifold with 2 long 3/8 extensions on your ratchet and a 15MM socket. This is why the FSM says to remove BOTH fans. I'm doing it the real hard way and that's leaving the fans in since I can't get the electrical connector clip off the driver's side fan to move it out and since I can't do that, i can't get the passenger side cooling fan out either. So, I had to loosen them and move them over slightly to get some working room. I think that the bolt that backs into the manifold is stripped since I cannot get this sucker off the back end of the alternator. Other than that bolt, this thing is ready to drop. I'm tempted to just get my cutting tool and cut that sucker off and just replace the bolt under the manifold that was missing. Heck, this things been holding with two bolts anyways for the last 7 years probably. I am going to take some photos when i replace the alternator so that EVERYONE can see how friggin hard this is and then they can pray to their higher power that they never have to do this EVER on their car. 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkz71 Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 The bolt that backs into the manifold stays there, it tells you that in the FSM. I did this job in about an hour & a half. I am an auto technician but a novice should be able to do it in 3 hours tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 Hey clarkz71, I have only really been working on it for about 2 hours after reading and then doing. I have the FSM and yes, I do know that the bolt only backs out and does not completely come out, but it just sits there and spins even though I have it completely backed out to the manifold. Like I said earlier, it's cold up here still with snow on the ground and my garage isn't large enough to have all kinds of room to move around et al. I'm doing this piece by piece, lol, and so far so good. It will be MUCH easier to put it back in since I know how it comes out. I do thank you for your input though as every little bit counts. Ken 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spurlee Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 The bolt that backs into the manifold stays there, it tells you that in the FSM. I did this job in about an hour & a half. I am an auto technician but a novice should be able to do it in 3 hours tops. Man I am impressed! I looked at doing the job on my 1996 El Dorado and even though I'm pretty handy with a wrench, I passed on the job. The tech that did mine dropped the sub frame and came at it from underneath. Ended up removing the alternator from the bracket, then the bracket from the engine to make room to drop it! Much wrench work... Scott 1996 El Dorado 2006 STS 2000 Corvette Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenD Posted March 8, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 Okay, it's out. I had to do some jigging with that last bolt, but I now have it in my greasy little hands (actually it's outside on the steps) It's an ACDELCO alternator and I'm gonna get it rebuilt (with Canadian/US parts) the same day and put this back in this weekend. Gonna buy a different 15mm wrench though. I need one that ratchets by itself so I don't have to turn, pull it off, turn, pull it off etc. The money you save you go buy some tools, lol. Anyways, I will do a photo shoot of this project the best that I can when I put it back in. FWIW the alternator will only drop out the bottom ONE way when you've got it loose and that is with the pulley towards the middle of the car and one of the mounting holes facing down. So you have to twist it around a bit to get it out and even then I had to pull a bit to get it out of the bottom hole. Good gawd! Total time right now to get this thing out was about 2 1/2 hours and this is by someone who is a newbie to this type of thing as all that I did was read the FSM. I'm pumped!! My avatar has never looked so good! Ken 1994 STS Pearl White 260,000 KM (163,000 miles) <img src="http://img45.photobucket.com/albums/v137/caesar/caddycaesar.jpg" border="0" class="linked-sig-image" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkz71 Posted March 8, 2007 Report Share Posted March 8, 2007 Great job, looking foward to the pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northstar Posted March 9, 2007 Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 The voltage regulator is what usually goes bad on this alternator so you could buy a new one for around $30.00 US and install it yourself. I did this last time my alternator went bad and it worked great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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