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97 Seville SLS Northstar- smoking


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jnstreen.......this story is out of sequence and not making sense..It would be helpful if you were to consider some questions in order, before you go waste money!

1 the block test without question cannot improve from tightening intake bolts on that engine. If the test was done and returned a different color then you have combustion (exhaust gasses) getting into the coolant. Only 2 ways in, head gasket bad or block cracked. If it did turn colors, what did you do different the next time you checked it? (everything) did you add water/antifreeze? I don't think we are going to believe nothing was different other than tightening the intake bolts. It makes no sense when there is NO water running through the intake.

2 the water pump if leaking should be replaced, but there is no reason to do that until you have ruled out head gasket. the small amount of leaking you described will not cause overheating, unless let go so long as to have low coolant.

3 the alternator would also be a waste of money if the headgasket is bad and you were not willing to spend the money to repair it.

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K here in TN thy call that test that rockfangd told me to do a block test. Some friends of mine including an ex husband whom is a cetified mechanic told me to check the intake bolts that he had heard they work lose. so after I did the first test on each bank each bank showed a slight yellow color. So I kept reading either the paper that came with testing kit or the blue fluid. It told me how to find exactly which cylinder was showing bad. It was #2 and #7 so since I hadn't already tightened the intake bolts since I was right there check it. So I did and when I tightened them down without adding or doing anything else to it rechecked the number 2 and 7 and they were a pretty blue. Now I understand What you guys are saying but before the care was burning to rich. now we don't smell the fuel and it is sill smoking but nothing like it was. I know this car is confusing me so sorry if it is confusing all of you guys also.

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ok I do have another question..... Winterset I agree changing the alternator is a PITA. That aternator that was on it accordng to Auto Zone was the ORIGINAL alternator. Our Battery was also bad. I know the battery I put on it temporarily isn't the correct size but it did let us run the Cadi for about 2-3 days last time. Now snce I put the alternator on and yes if anyone is wondering if it is me that is doing the work or me taking it to have it done it is me doing the work... trust me my back with rods in it is letting me know it. After I got the alternator on it started right up. Then my husband called needing me to come get him from work so I figured to let the battery get charged good I was going to drive the Cadi. I got to the end of my driveway and it just quit. No clicking, no headlights, couldn't put the windows up, no security light I mean NOTHING. I went and got him in my sister's van and pulled in and I had headlights only by pulling the switch out not by using the twilight switch. butthe car still wouldn't do anything... then no lights no security light or anything. we have tried jumping it and that has no affects... the bttery is actually out of my daughter's 98 plymouth breeze which had been sitting in it's battery holder for close to a month without being started.I said maybe it is to weak to start it.. so we hadit tested and they said yeah that it did needed to be changed so they did a quick charge on it. and checked it and said it was good to go but still nothing. Can the battery be to small since we put a new alterntor on? could wire of shorted out? could I have gotten hold of a bad alternator? getting so confused......

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If the battery checked out good, there is a bad connection somewhere. Is that battery under the back seat like 99? I would look for the double post on the positive battery connection. I am not sure if that would be able to cause it to die, when already running, but it could definitely cause the start, no start problem. I am thinking a bad connection somewhere as opposed to bad battery or alternator. Have you cleaned the double post thing on the positive cable?, between the two cable ends.

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Likely you arent getting good battery connection.

Battery is under hood in right fenderwell.

Likely it is one of the 2 positives, you may be missing the spacer between them.

Also the alternator is not bad. I can do them in about 1 hour. I have done alot worse. They even made a removable plate to make it easier to get out.

It comes out through the bottom by the radiator support

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Why did you replace the alternator? Was it not producing an output?

It appears you have a bad connection at the battery - does your car have separate positive cables that connect at the battery? If so, disconnect the cables (negative first) and then check between the cable ends for corrosion. Clean any corrosion and re-connect the cables to the battery.

FYI - Autozone batteries are garbage - rarely will they make it out of the warranty period and their testers always seem to show them good. Once you sort out the headgasket issue, find an AC Delco distributor in your area and buy a 78 PG battery. That is the correct battery for the car.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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I am going to stick to the possible overheating in my assistance on this thread.

If you have an unexplained coolant loss that is a very bad sign for this engine.

Please tell us what happened when it overheated. Did the hot light come on? Was it puking coolant out of the radiator cap? Your pressurized surge tank should be filled only with 3 inches of 50/50 dexcool. Have you been adding coolant into the surge tank the last few days? Are there puddles under the car from the waterpump leak?

If you are not adding coolant, and the car just overheats on hills, you should check the "bolt with a hole in it" which is on the engine block side connected to the top hose leadng to the surge tank. Sometimes that gets plugged up with dislodged gasket material, and that allows the engine to form steam pockets that prevents the waterpump and thermostat from operating correctly. This chain of events causes the engine to overheat under the right conditions.

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ok got the car running again there was a lose wire but a 30amp fuse that ccording to the diagram goes to the battery was blown. so that is fixed. So thank you everyone for the inputs it helped a lot. KHE we replaced the battery cause the car wouldn't start and according to Auto Zone and Advance the battery was good at that time. so we took the Alternator off and had them check it and they bothe checked it twice and both time it showed up bad. So if something is bad on a vehicle you fix it.

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Winterset I have never noticed an overheating light on this 97 Seville.... now the only time it overheats is when you are climbing a steep grade but all around the water pump is signs of water leaking from that area. We have never noticed any on the ground. I am oneof these that won't etme car get comletey to th red it gets to that last white line before the red line andI have already turned on the heater to help cool it down. it it keeps geting closer to the red I pull over and stop. Now I have a question one of my neighbors who claims he worked for GM said that when they are in the red or running hot you do not shut the car down. Why can you not turn off the engine but leave the switch on to where the fans will keep working? or is he telling me a lie about that? I have never seen steam come from the surge tank when it is hot I go by the temperature hand. So am I doing omthing wrong? Like I think I have said the lst Cadillc I owned was a 66 Coupe De Ville and they sure are different today then they were back then.

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KHE we replaced the battery cause the car wouldn't start and according to Auto Zone and Advance the battery was good at that time. so we took the Alternator off and had them check it and they bothe checked it twice and both time it showed up bad. So if something is bad on a vehicle you fix it.

Yeah - I understand that... I was just asking what was wrong with the alternator. We are trying to help you with your car so please do not develop an attitude - after all, you are the one that is seeking assistance.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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Definately go with a new water pump if it is leaking. Possibly you were a little low, and it ran a little hot. You know it can be normal to see 230 if it's warm out, and the car is under load. You are doing good so far.

Also, save your old alternator. Should the big box store alternator ever fail, have the original rebuilt, and use that one.

It's worth checking the surge line when the waterpump job is being done, and put a $3.99 tube of bars stop leak powder in the top radiator hose - next to the water pump. GM recommended it for you car from the factory when new, and was required at coolant changes.

Hopefully you get the bugs worked out so you can really start enjoying your caddy!!

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k thanks for the information winterset. Oh yeah and the reason the quit running after replacing the alternator and wouldn't start is it blowed the batt 2 fuse which is a big 30 amps. cost me about $5 to fix it.

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Winterset and Rockfangd I appreciate your guys' help through all this.I would like to get your opinion on whether or not I should use blue devil on this car? I thought I had seen on a you tube video where the person showed the back where the warnings are, I saw where it said NOT TO USE ON NORTHSTAR but I went to there website and sent a message to them and the reply was yes you can use on the northstar. So I am confused as to yes you can or no you can't. it still smokes some but some people has asked if I changed the fuel filter when we changed the FPR. Was I suppose too? we found one place that it is leaking antifreeze and it is the hose under the surge tank... looks like maybe a heater hose.? it only has 2 clamps on it and maybe about 4 inches long (maybe). We are going to change it out. We also want to put plugs in it due to it missing. So that leads me back to IF I CAN use the blue devil will it be better to use it before we change plugs or change them then do the blue devil? Can you guys please give me some advice about these. Outside of it missing I normally change plugs when I get a used vehicle that way I know how old they are and about how many miles are on them.

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jnstreen.... couple things to consider.

1 are you going to at some time have the head gaskets repaired if that is indeed your problem? If so your mechanic that does that will not like that blue devil being done to it first.

2 if you are not willing to do the head gasket job if its called for then the blue devil is not your worry and may not be a problem and you can look at it as, what do you have to loose? From all past posts and any info gleaned on this forum it will NOT work on your northstar.

3 from your previous posts you have stated that the fluid did change color, which means head gasket failure, above applies.

4 from a different previous post you state that you no longer have fluid color change, which means no head gasket failure, so why add blue devil.

5 no one on this forum is going to believe tightening the intake bolts will have stopped a fluid color change in above test! Not intending to disparage any local mechanic, but facts are facts and there is no coolant that the intake bolts could effect. That brings us back to 1 and 2 above.

Having stated the previous, there is not a lot of reasons to continue repairing small things on a car that you would soon need to: either get the head gaskets repaired (at which time water pump, crossover gaskets, radiator etc.. would be much easier to work on)/ or give up on car. If you are convinced the head gaskets are good then repair away. The fuel filter in no way will make a car smoke, as the fuel pressure regulator might be able to. If it is running rough/lean the filter could be a cause. Most people look at them as cheap and easy, so not a lot of waste even if you change one that didn't need changed.

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jnstreen.... couple things to consider.

1 are you going to at some time have the head gaskets repaired if that is indeed your problem? If so your mechanic that does that will not like that blue devil being done to it first.

2 if you are not willing to do the head gasket job if its called for then the blue devil is not your worry and may not be a problem and you can look at it as, what do you have to loose? From all past posts and any info gleaned on this forum it will NOT work on your northstar.

3 from your previous posts you have stated that the fluid did change color, which means head gasket failure, above applies.

4 from a different previous post you state that you no longer have fluid color change, which means no head gasket failure, so why add blue devil.

5 no one on this forum is going to believe tightening the intake bolts will have stopped a fluid color change in above test! Not intending to disparage any local mechanic, but facts are facts and there is no coolant that the intake bolts could effect. That brings us back to 1 and 2 above.

Having stated the previous, there is not a lot of reasons to continue repairing small things on a car that you would soon need to: either get the head gaskets repaired (at which time water pump, crossover gaskets, radiator etc.. would be much easier to work on)/ or give up on car. If you are convinced the head gaskets are good then repair away. The fuel filter in no way will make a car smoke, as the fuel pressure regulator might be able to. If it is running rough/lean the filter could be a cause. Most people look at them as cheap and easy, so not a lot of waste even if you change one that didn't need changed.

airmike if we do have to redo the head gaskets it will probably be me, hubby and next door neighbor. We are the ones that have been doing all of the work. My father taught me how to do just about everything to a vehicle when I started learning the difference from a flathead and a phillip head screwdriver. cause he didn't want mechanics taking advantage of me cause I was female.

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Completely understandable.

I would not use blue devil. If it works it will be very temporary and you will be in the same boat again.

I will also tell you that even though I am very experienced mechanic I let the dealer take care of my 97 Seville.

Without a lift it tends to be alot more difficult when removing the engine.

If the car iss in very good condition and you do have pulled head bolts I would say it is worth it to fix it.

GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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I recall the "hot" light never came on, and there was no puking of coolant. With a small leak, and possibly not having a 50/50 coolant/water mix, you might have been seeing some spikes in temperature. If there was a head gasket breach, and you overheated, super hot gases would have quickly entered the coolant passages, and forced the coolant violently out the radiator cap. Along with this condition is a quick spike in temperature, and the "hot" light coming on. I would put in a tube of the GM recommended bars stop lean powder into the top hose After the leaks are fixed.

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since it is leaking around the water pump and we are probably going to change it this weekend I could add the bars stop leak powder then couldn't I? any sugestions on how to change the back plugs?

I recall the "hot" light never came on, and there was no puking of coolant. With a small leak, and possibly not having a 50/50 coolant/water mix, you might have been seeing some spikes in temperature. If there was a head gasket breach, and you overheated, super hot gases would have quickly entered the coolant passages, and forced the coolant violently out the radiator cap. Along with this condition is a quick spike in temperature, and the "hot" light coming on. I would put in a tube of the GM recommended bars stop lean powder into the top hose After the leaks are fixed.

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The back bank of plugs are easily removed using a 6-inch extension with a spark plug socket and a ratchet. Do not use anti-sieze on the new plugs when installing them as that will result in overtorquing them.

Kevin
'93 Fleetwood Brougham
'05 Deville
'04 Deville
2013 Silverado Z71

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