Burque Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Thanks for the insights. Both of the previous suggestions entail significant work on my part however. And, the idea of a juckyard engine does not gaurantee me not to encounter the same problem in 20,000 miles - even with a hydrocarbon check. While I'm not scared of the work - I'm not sure if its in my free-time allotment anyway (I'm thinking a minimum of 40 hours - over several months, plus getting the engine in and out (through the bottom of the car I assume), plus borrowing the tools and stand from my GM-head friend), and making room in my garage (which is not a trivial task, as it is filled with machinery and woodworking stuff - dust is not amenable to mechanic work). I will consider both of these ideas. However, I'm still looking for comments on competent shops within an 8-10 drive from central New Mexico. I guess I could pay to have the engine pulled, then ship it to Canada (I've heard goods things about some outfits there), but I have to believe this is less cost effective than taking the entire car on a short road trip myself. EIther way, I'm with you on the oil pan gasket/seal, as well as top engine stuff - the water pump idler is squeeling off-and-on now (probably from me hosing down the top-side radiator hose to get the water temp down enough to add water to the idling engine after my wife brings it home from getting the kids). Sorry for the digression. Any comments on competent shops are still welcome. Thanks, Burque Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 You need to use the TImeserts and repair the engine properly - DO NOT shortcut ANYTHING. If you don't have a factory shop manual, buy one. Once the engine is repaired properly, it will outlast the rest of the car. Dropping the powertrain is not that difficult of a job. All you need is a garage and an engine hoist. I'm curious as to why you thought the starter replacement was difficult? I'd rather change a Northstar starter while standing up vs. laying on a creeper with crud falling in my eyes... Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burque Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Kevin, You own a creeper? I though that's what they made carpet remnants for. I guess I didn't consider the starter replacement difficult. As well it was suprisingly easy to determine to be the culprit through a fairly easy series of relay checks. I was simply taken aback at having to remove the intake manifold to get at the starter - as a 40 year backyard mechanic, I was considering a simple two-bolt out and in job. The alternator however... laying on my back with crud in my eyes trying to hold a 25 pound starter in my hand while trying to start bolts with my index and middle fingers - I tough getting it out was tough, because you have to remove it with the rear-side bracket and then remove the bracket from the starter before it will slide through the little access panel recess. I got it done eventually - and now the neighbors know to keep their kids inside the house when I work on my cars. My other vehicle is a C-K 3500 four-wheel drive long bed - I'm used to working with room - I was able to sit under my truck and remove the fuel tank/pump without jacking up the vehicle. Don't get me wrong - I am a Caddy fan - the front-wheel drive Northstar is not amenable to driveway mechanics on things that are not top-engine though. So I agree with you - I'd rather do the Time-sert repair - I just don't want to do it myself. I'd like to find the easiest way to get it done. $2-3K is reasonable for me as a total cost - I just don't see that with a pay-to-pull, pay-to-ship, pay for the Time-sert job, then pay to reinstall. I'm really not set up to pull an engine. I do however think I could get it done if I hauled the vehicle to a location within a day's drive that can do it all in one shot - which does not include Canada or Ohio. Jerry / Burque Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 I will be 60 next year, my first car was a 64 Grand Prix, then a 66 Cadillac Coupe Conv. My entire experience came from that era, points, heat risers, vacuum modulators, drum brakes, carburators, etc. We have always said here that, when you start looking at the Northstar and even the 4.9 to some extent, you have to learn everything over. On my 96, I did the crossover seals (a rough job), tilted the carriage to replace the input speed sensor and solenoids in the side pan, dropped fuel tanks to get to the fuel pump, replaced the starter, replaced the AC compressor and alternator, heater pipes, suspension, etc, and while dropping the carriage is rough, I personally don't find working on this Northstar system to be difficult. But then again I have the hands of a surgeon (I saw you comment on the alternator bolt clearance, yes it was tough even with the radiator and AC compressor out, but I love challenges) I junked my 96, because I dont trust anyone besides myself to do the job right, and I dont have the room to do the job without the entire neighborhood seeing the job and I am getting too old for it. Its a physically challenging job. The parts to do a timesert job are about $800 and UP if you decide to replace torque converters, HVAC covers, heater pipes, seals etc. Good luck with this job Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHE Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Kevin, You own a creeper? I though that's what they made carpet remnants for. now the neighbors know to keep their kids inside the house when I work on my cars. Jerry / Burque I have a creeper. Makes it much easier to maneuver under the car. Anything mechanical or electrical seems to require a dose of profanity during a repair - it seems to persuade things... Kevin '93 Fleetwood Brougham '05 Deville '04 Deville 2013 Silverado Z71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BodybyFisher Posted October 22, 2012 Report Share Posted October 22, 2012 Funny, when I was dropping the fuel tank on a 95 Eldo a couple of weeks ago, my language definately changed, and yes, I do credit it with getting the job done at times. Its amazing how things loosen up when you mumble YOU SOB!, it worked for my Dad also Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1 >> 1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/gm/obd_codes.htm How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/ Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAUL T Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I just had an Uncle buy a 1998 Deville with 76,000 miles with a headgasket problem for $1000. He found a good engine at a salvage yard with about the same mileage for around $1000. He found a local experienced cadillac mechanic to pull the old engine (out the top) and put in the new engine for $500. It is a beautiful low mileage car for $2500 total. I am with JohnnyG. Find a good used engine and find a local cadillac tech that may work out of his garage on the side. You could do it yourself by pulling the engine out of the top, it has been done by more than one person on this forum. My Uncle lives southwest of Fort Wayne Indana, thats not far from Ohio. He can give you the name and address of his mechanic if you like. PM me and I will give you my Uncles phone number if you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burque Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Paul, Key phrase, "find a good Cadillac mechanic". I have been asking around - I'm condident that soon enough I will get a recommendation for a mechanic. I actually got an estimate for an outboard motor, lower unit rebuild once, and as I was leaving the repair shop with my motor parts in hand and an "I'm not spending $900 on a repair - I can figure out myself"attitude, I ran into the mechanic who did the analysis outside having a smoke. Next thing I knew, I had the lower unit rebuilt and reinstalled for $150 (rebuilt in his apartment and reinstalled at my house) - that was 10 years ago - still running strong. Maybe I'll hang around the Cadillac dealership with a carton of smokes. I reside in New Mexico - not alot of good machine shops or Cadillac mechanics around here. Still considering both options - junkyard engine or repair job. Do you think pulling the engine can be done by any decent mechanic - through the top? I'd rather ship the engine to Ohio or Indiana rather than the entire vehicle. I have seen a few shops that use the NS300L inserts and others that use the Sure-grip studs. Any comments on either of these? I am not crazy about the studs, but some mechanics seem to think the NS300L inserts work well. I have found reasonable quotes for repair in the midwest that use both of these techniques. The guy that uses the studs does the work in situ (doesn't pull the engine) - I think I'll skip this one. But the Midwest Cadillac Repair seens credible - still a shot in the dark without any real testimony. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 I did a web search on "Midwest Cadillac Repair." They have a web site: http://midwestcadillacrepair.com/ There seems to be one testimonial on the other board but little else turned up. My personal opinion, based on lots of successful DIY stories on Caddyinfo, is that any good, honest, careful mechanic that does Northstar head gasket and Timesert jobs regularly can do the job reliably. The only thing that bothers me is that they don't use TimeSerts but the NS300L seems to be a "one-upmanship" design over the TimeSert, with guides and such that ensure proper drilling and tapping. Since the nature of the insert doesn't change the clamping force equations so long as new OEM head bolts are used, I don't see any harm in using the NS300L inserts, other than that there is no equivalent to Bigserts, which means that if there is an insert failure, the block is scrap - which is not a very likely scenario if the repair is done correctly. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airmike Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Paul, Key phrase, "find a good Cadillac mechanic". I have been asking around - I'm condident that soon enough I will get a recommendation for a mechanic. I actually got an estimate for an outboard motor, lower unit rebuild once, and as I was leaving the repair shop with my motor parts in hand and an "I'm not spending $900 on a repair - I can figure out myself"attitude, I ran into the mechanic who did the analysis outside having a smoke. Next thing I knew, I had the lower unit rebuilt and reinstalled for $150 (rebuilt in his apartment and reinstalled at my house) - that was 10 years ago - still running strong. Maybe I'll hang around the Cadillac dealership with a carton of smokes. I reside in New Mexico - not alot of good machine shops or Cadillac mechanics around here. Still considering both options - junkyard engine or repair job. Do you think pulling the engine can be done by any decent mechanic - through the top? I'd rather ship the engine to Ohio or Indiana rather than the entire vehicle. I have seen a few shops that use the NS300L inserts and others that use the Sure-grip studs. Any comments on either of these? I am not crazy about the studs, but some mechanics seem to think the NS300L inserts work well. I have found reasonable quotes for repair in the midwest that use both of these techniques. The guy that uses the studs does the work in situ (doesn't pull the engine) - I think I'll skip this one. But the Midwest Cadillac Repair seens credible - still a shot in the dark without any real testimony. Jerry I would have to consider the future plans for the car. For mine I intend to drive it until it rusts to the ground, so a junkyard engine would not be acceptable. I would not want to put an engine in only to find out in a year it had the same problem! If you were to buy a bad engine and have the heads done prior to install then you would have less time lost and the repair that should last. If you were wanting to repair it and sell it in the near future I suppose you could put in a used engine and not feel bad about it. I haven't checked salvage yards for a used/bad engine but I wouldn't think there would be a very big call for bad engines. Maybe you could even trade your old engine (core) for theirs, with a small fee to get that done. As for the guy installing studs in the car, I would love to see that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burque Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 My future plans are to keep the car as long as possible - my wife LOVES the car. I have to admit, when we bought it, I was a little skeptical about the value for the dollar - it was/is well worth it. I'd like to keep it around for my daughter to drive to and from high school in a few years. It is a solid, solid vehicle. On another topic (and I'll post this seperately), anyone have thoughts on the SRX? I know they changed the basic body style after 2008, which resulted in less room inside the vehicle. I'm sure however the have improved the design over the last few years, especially for the AWD version. Of course, I'm looking for the most room, AWD, V-8 version. Comments on the FWD or the 6-cylinder performance? Reliability? Flaws? I will not buy new, but am considering 2008-2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadillac Jim Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 I think that to get the rear head over the studs the cradle would have to be lifted so that the rear bank was at windshield level. -- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data -- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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