PC is crashing...what to do?

[epricedright]

When you get your new power supply, do the following:

Look at the OLD power supply inside the computer. All the plugs that lead from the power supply will have numbers stamped on them such as P1, P2 etc. Make a note by writing down, what P1, etc. are plugged into. Example, P1 might be plugged into the floppy drive, so make a list that shows P1 and then Floppy Drive, next to it. By doing this, when you remove the old power supply and install the new one, you will easily know what plug goes where.

EP, looks like you are on the road again? I think Marika deserves kudos for sticking with you this whole time - bouquets and sweets for the lady....

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh!! I'm blushing!!

Good tip there Marika, I'll be sure to do that. I found myself writing down where each plug went into what slot when I removed all the cards, so I agree the plugs for the PS (10X more plugs) will be a puzzle if I'm not careful. I was looking at all those wires and plugs last night and was wondering what plugs come with the new one. Being it's a Compaq PS, I shouldn't have to do any splicing or plug modifications (should be all plug and play) correct?

Thanks again Marika! I really do appreciate all the help you've given me. I realize you went the extra mile, and for that I Thank You!

Just curious, do you work on pc's for a living? I'm humbled by your knowledge and expertise...very impressive!

If you replace the old power supply with an identical new power supply, you really won't have any problems installing the new one as long as you write down what plug goes where. NEVER splice power supply lines for a computer, those lines all carry very specific levels of voltages and different lines, even if they look the same, might have slightly different voltages. There's usually a schematic on the power supply or you can look it up at the manufacturer's website which will tell you what voltages are running through which wires. But don't overthink the plumbing because it's easy to replace a power supply so long as you make a note of what was plugged in where and you buy a matching power supply to replace the old one.

I don't work on PC's for a living. My experience with computers go back to 1971 and some of the first IBM main frame machines. I just seem to understand computers better than I understand people.

I just ordered the new power supply and should have it by tomorrow or Wednesday.

I ordered it from The Best Part Inc http://www.thebestpartinc.com/217220-002.html They matched PC Parts On Time's price of $20 and with shipping, the total cost was $26.50 Most other sites wanted $100-130 for the same part. I didn't even look at Compaq's site. The good news is I just found out the power supply he is sending me is Brand New. It's the OEM original (same part number) with a 90 day warranty. Can't beat that!

[JimHare]

OEM Power Supplies tend to be crap - they put in the minimum they can, and most people don't realize that, after they've added another HD or any kind of power-drawing device (e.g. a new V/Card with a fan, etc etc), they've crossed the line for stock power supply. I've seen them as low as 125 or 150 watts, which is puny, and underpowered for anything bigger than an iPod.

PC components are notoriously finicky when it comes to steady, even power requirements, and even a half-volt here and there can make a big difference. I've probably built upwards of 50 or so PCs for clients, and always make sure I use a strong P/S - PC Power and Cooling makes excellent units, for one. I use to buy 'em by the half-dozen.. lol. A 450w power supply from them will take just about anything you throw at it.

As Marika noted, the trick is getting the small leads for all the interal things like the PC speaker, the HDD LED, the On/Off switch, the reset button, etc etc all correct. The two big white leads are a snap, they won't be a problem. Make sure you seat the D-connectors from the wires on the P/S to the HDs and CDs correctly. One trick I've used in the past is to use just a tiny bid of WD-40, sprayed on my thumb and index-fingertips and then rubbed around the outside plastic rim of the female leads coming from the P/S, to make them slide into the device connector easier, and make removal easier down the road.

Be very careful with static electricity, and toss that old unit away right off. Most P/S's have capacitors in them that can retain quite a shock if you mess around with them.

Now, ahem, who was it that first suggested it was probably the power supply early yesterday morning? (cough cough...)

[epricedright]

OEM Power Supplies tend to be crap - they put in the minimum they can, and most people don't realize that, after they've added another HD or any kind of power-drawing device (e.g. a new V/Card with a fan, etc etc), they've crossed the line for stock power supply. I've seen them as low as 125 or 150 watts, which is puny, and underpowered for anything bigger than an iPod.

PC components are notoriously finicky when it comes to steady, even power requirements, and even a half-volt here and there can make a big difference. I've probably built upwards of 50 or so PCs for clients, and always make sure I use a strong P/S - PC Power and Cooling makes excellent units, for one. I use to buy 'em by the half-dozen.. lol. A 450w power supply from them will take just about anything you throw at it.

As Marika noted, the trick is getting the small leads for all the interal things like the PC speaker, the HDD LED, the On/Off switch, the reset button, etc etc all correct. The two big white leads are a snap, they won't be a problem. Make sure you seat the D-connectors from the wires on the P/S to the HDs and CDs correctly. One trick I've used in the past is to use just a tiny bid of WD-40, sprayed on my thumb and index-fingertips and then rubbed around the outside plastic rim of the female leads coming from the P/S, to make them slide into the device connector easier, and make removal easier down the road.

Be very careful with static electricity, and toss that old unit away right off. Most P/S's have capacitors in them that can retain quite a shock if you mess around with them.

Now, ahem, who was it that first suggested it was probably the power supply early yesterday morning? (cough cough...)

Thanks Jim! Yes, you da man!

I was under the impression that my Compaq, or Compaq's in general were proprietary and only Compaq power supplies could be used. I'm pretty certain my CPU is as well. I never checked into the power supply, just assumed that was the case based on the replies here. I figured I HAD to go with OEM. Is that not the case?

[epricedright]

Given the length of this thread, it seems some of my questions get lost. In summary, here are a few questions I still have:

1. Why do you suppose I had no restore capability before I did any of this work, when it was just restating on it's own? Maybe I have both a power supply and RAM problem? Or maybe the mother board is bad as well? All caused by overheating I presume. Could a bad power supply cause it to not be able to restore?

2. I believe I had a power supply problem from the start, before I went into the case. Reason I say that was because I had to repeatedly hit the on/off button on the front of the pc to start it. Sometimes it would work with one push of the button, other times, 2-3 pushes. Is that typically a warning the power supply is going bad, or could it be the switch?

3. Is my power supply proprietary, and only the Compaq OEM can be used, without having to redo plugs and what-not?

4. Do I put the WD-40 on all the plugs, or just the HD and DVD plugs?

5. After installing the new power supply, do I want to boot up in safe mode? Could someone please explain how I do that? After hitting the start button, do I push the F8 button repeatedly? The only times I've done that was with tech support on the line. Once in safe mode, then what? What should I do be looking for? And how do I get out of safe mode? I know safe mode is safer, but why?

Thanks again!

[Regis]

Hi Ed,

Once again, stick with the basics first. When you get the power supply unit go ahead and install it. Note where each wire goes. Use masking tape and label or take a digital pic or better yet just unhook from the old ps and hook into the new one, one wire at a time. It's easier than you think. I think you'll be surprised.

Skip the WD-40 bit. You'll just get yourself worked up with another step. I can see why Jim might use it but the trade off is that WD-40 is an excellent dust magnet and I'm not sure of it's plastic friendliness. Again stick with the basics.

Once the new power supply is installed, simply start up in Normal mode and go from there. Don't get ahead of the problem(s). It just might solve your issue(s). If your computer still doesn't boot up in Normal mode then try again in Safe Mode. But let's not get ahead of ourselves. That's my advice Ed. Take it for what it's worth. I'll check back after the new ps is installed to see what has transpired. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.

[epricedright]

Hi Ed,

Once again, stick with the basics first. When you get the power supply unit go ahead and install it. Note where each wire goes. Use masking tape and label or take a digital pic or better yet just unhook from the old ps and hook into the new one, one wire at a time. It's easier than you think. I think you'll be surprised.

Skip the WD-40 bit. You'll just get yourself worked up with another step. I can see why Jim might use it but the trade off is that WD-40 is an excellent dust magnet and I'm not sure of it's plastic friendliness. Again stick with the basics.

Once the new power supply is installed, simply start up in Normal mode and go from there. Don't get ahead of the problem(s). It just might solve your issue(s). If your computer still doesn't boot up in Normal mode then try again in Safe Mode. But let's not get ahead of ourselves. That's my advice Ed. Take it for what it's worth. I'll check back after the new ps is installed to see what has transpired. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.

Thanks Regis!

If it doesn't start up in normal mode, how do I start in safe mode? I don't necessarily need to know how to diagnose it any further in safe mode, but just how to get there, to see if it runs in safe, if it doesn't run in normal mode. I would also like to know how to get back to normal mode from the safe mode. It's tough to be working on something and have to wait on a response while I'm in the middle of it, if you know what I mean. I like to have a road map made up beforehand for the what ifs. I understand what you're saying about taking one thing at a time, and sticking to the basics. Please don't take me the wrong way, but for comparison sakes, this would be like trying to tell someone how to change their brakes by saying, ok, go take your wheels off and post back for the next step.

[Regis]

Click the link. The page is laid out in a nice and easy to use manner. Accessing Safe Mode

[epricedright]

Click the link. The page is laid out in a nice and easy to use manner. Accessing Safe Mode

That's definately easy. So it is F8. Thank you!

So to get out of safe mode, just click restart and after it reboots, I take it I will get a prompt to start in normal or safe mode, or does it go straight to normal mode? Nevermind, I'll figure it out.

[epricedright]

Here is the Omega vacuum I used in case anyone was interested. I paid $50 (just found my receipt) for it on eBay.

http://www.atrix.com/vacuums_omega.htm

I was going to bid on this for my brother in-law and spaced it. Missed The Deal!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1

[JimHare]

Hi Ed,

Skip the WD-40 bit. You'll just get yourself worked up with another step. I can see why Jim might use it but the trade off is that WD-40 is an excellent dust magnet and I'm not sure of it's plastic friendliness. Again stick with the basics.

Reg, I use just a tiny bit, like I said, and in all the years I've used it, have not had a problem - I think it helps when you need to loosen those plastic D-Connectors down the road. Too many people yank on the wires instead of the connector, and then one or more of the four leads loosens up and you've got a problem. But yeah, if you splash it on like after-shave, it could be more trouble. Ed's probably got more on his mind than worrying about tight connectors..

[Regis]

Hi Ed,

Skip the WD-40 bit. You'll just get yourself worked up with another step. I can see why Jim might use it but the trade off is that WD-40 is an excellent dust magnet and I'm not sure of it's plastic friendliness. Again stick with the basics.

Reg, I use just a tiny bit, like I said, and in all the years I've used it, have not had a problem - I think it helps when you need to loosen those plastic D-Connectors down the road. Too many people yank on the wires instead of the connector, and then one or more of the four leads loosens up and you've got a problem. But yeah, if you splash it on like after-shave, it could be more trouble. Ed's probably got more on his mind than worrying about tight connectors..

Hi Jim,

I like the concept behind the WD-40 idea. I can appreciate it. I've used a pinch of general purpose silicone a time or two myself. But if you look at all the information presented to Ed and the manner in which it has been presented, I think cutting out a few non-essentials is in order. I could have mentioned the silicone trick but it's not pertinent to getting the pc back up and running. A small pair of needle nosed pliers will remove any sticky connector with or without silicone or WD-40 in your case. We all have our bag of tips and tricks to share. My only concern here is that Ed get his pc back up in the shortest amount of time and with the least amount of effort. If he wants to fart around with peripheral items afterwards then fine. I mean no offense to you or to anyone else if I come across as a bit curt. Please don't mistake it as such. This board is filled with intelligent members who have vast knowledge in many areas. So how do you channel all that great information so it's useable, orderly, and not cluttered and confusing? There needs to be a lightening rod. I don't particularly care to be that rod. But I think one is needed. So who will be it and am I off base in saying so?

[epricedright]

I received the power supply today, my that was fast. I will hopefully get a chance to install it later tonight or tomorrow. *Fingers crossed-wish me luck*

First, I need to watch "Hacking Democracy" on HBO tonight.

[epricedright]

Well, I installed the new power supply tonight and everything seems ok so far. I'm typing from that pc now as a matter of fact. The power supply replacement was a piece of cake actually. The plugs were no problem getting lose either.

What test should I run next to make sure everything is ok?

I haven't yet run the memtest that I have on CD. Should that be the next step? I believe I need to run that as a bootable CD? I've never done that before. Here is the email I received Sunday from Texas Jim:

You have to set your bios so the computer KNOWS to look for a bootable CD in the cd drive.

On the Compaq .. as it "FIRST STARTS" to boot hit the "F10" key. That will take you into BIOS.

Hit "ENTER" 1 time to tell it you want English, then use the arrow keys to move to the right, I think 2 times, and you should see a screen about "BOOT ORDER" Set it to boot from the CD first. Then when you exit BIOS, with the Memtest Cd in the CD ROM, Memtest will then run automatically.

Question: How do I exit BIOS? Will I be prompted to leave?

Does that sound about right? Should I test for other things first?

Thanks!

[Regis]

If everything seems fine then I wouldn't load anything. You might want to access Device Manager,

System Information, and DirectX Diagnostic Tool to make sure the memory values are all the same. All 3 will list how much RAM you have on the initial or front page. The DirectX Diagnostic Tool will be the most accurate out of the 3 but check the other 2 also. Other then that check the Device Manager for any missing components or errors. Then run a virus and spyware scan. Make sure both are updated before scanning.

[Texas Jim]

Well, I installed the new power supply tonight and everything seems ok so far. I'm typing from that pc now as a matter of fact. The power supply replacement was a piece of cake actually. The plugs were no problem getting lose either.

What test should I run next to make sure everything is ok?

I haven't yet run the memtest that I have on CD. Should that be the next step? I believe I need to run that as a bootable CD? I've never done that before. Here is the email I received Sunday from Texas Jim:

You have to set your bios so the computer KNOWS to look for a bootable CD in the cd drive.

On the Compaq .. as it "FIRST STARTS" to boot hit the "F10" key. That will take you into BIOS.

Hit "ENTER" 1 time to tell it you want English, then use the arrow keys to move to the right, I think 2 times, and you should see a screen about "BOOT ORDER" Set it to boot from the CD first. Then when you exit BIOS, with the Memtest Cd in the CD ROM, Memtest will then run automatically.

Question: How do I exit BIOS? Will I be prompted to leave?

Does that sound about right? Should I test for other things first?

Thanks!

Kim,

I don't think I would do anything more to it at this point. If all seems Ok, let it run for a couple of days and see if any problems crop up.

To answer your other question about exiting BIOS, hit escape and a screen will come up telling you to hit F10 to save your settings. Hit F10 if you want to save any changes you made. Hit escape AGAIN and you will get a screen with 3 options, EXIT WITHOUT SAVING, REMAIN IN BIOS and SAVE SETTINGS AND EXIT. Choose what is correct at that time.

BUT if it is running OK now ... you don't need to go into BIOS. It can be pretty easy to change a setting you really don't want changed. Call me if I can help.

[epricedright]

System Properties and System Information both show my RAM to be 640MB - which is correct. Don't see where to locate the RAM from the Device Manager. The DirectX Diagnostics tool doesn't appear to be on my pc. Everything appears normal in my Device Manager; everything's there and no errors that I saw. I updated and ran my AVG Anti-Virus Free Version and no viruses were found. I updated and ran Spybot Search and Destroy, typical spyware found and eliminated. I update and ran Lavasoft Ad-Aware SE, typical spyware found and eliminated.

I looked at the test results from AVG anti-virus, it appears my pc has been acting up since 9/29/06. There were completed test everyday up till 9/29 (scheduled to run every morning), then the next completed ones were 10/8, 10/18, 10/19/06. Tonight was the first time in a while I've been able to run a complete test without the pc restarting on it's own. Being I don't use my desktop like I used to, I had no idea it was acting up as bad as it was.

I will let her run for a few days and she how she does. Looks like she missed me was all though, and just needed a little TLC and clean up. I will stay on top of the cleaning from now on - she taught me a big lesson! I will make a point to clean her whenever I clean my furnace and outside AC unit - every 6 months.

Cleaning tip I learned from the tech who came out to install a couple items and cleaned my pc 2 years ago...use Rubbing Alcohol on the plastic and metal outside case...AMAZING! Will make it look like new!

Thanks again to EVERYONE who has helped! I really appreciate it! I learned a boat load, and I'm sure I saved quite a bit by fixing it myself. If it weren't for you nice folks, it would certainly have ended up in the bottom of my lake.

[Regis]

The DirectX Diagnostics tool doesn't appear to be on my pc. Everything appears normal in my Device Manager; everything's there and no errors that I saw.

Hi epricedright,

Congratulations on getting her back up and running. You have The DirectX Diagnostics Tool. Here's how you access it. Click Start, then Run, in the box that appears type in dxdiag and click OK. It may take a few seconds for the window to come up. A nice tool for testing video, sound, etc.

Also in reading back I noticed that I called you "Ed" a couple times. What was that all about? LOL

[epricedright]

The DirectX Diagnostics tool doesn't appear to be on my pc. Everything appears normal in my Device Manager; everything's there and no errors that I saw.

Hi epricedright,

Congratulations on getting her back up and running. You have The DirectX Diagnostics Tool. Here's how you access it. Click Start, then Run, in the box that appears type in dxdiag and click OK. It may take a few seconds for the window to come up. A nice tool for testing video, sound, etc.

Also in reading back I noticed that I called you "Ed" a couple times. What was that all about? LOL

Hi Regis,

I just ran the DirectX Diagnostics Tool and everything looked ok...640 MB RAM. I had no idea that tool was there...pretty cool! Thanks for helping me find that. Ironically it said my video was ok as well...not! I still need to replace my video card. I'm going to wait a few days and let her run to make sure it's ok before buying that card. That will give me time to find a good card for a decent price. I need a AGP 4X card it seems. I wonder if an 8X card will be backwards compatible with 4X? And if it has a fan, does it get it's power from the AGP slot, or will it need a power plug? If plug, is that plug split off from another plug or card, or ? I didn't see any extra power plugs in there, and my current card has no fan. I guess another question would be could my power supply handle it? I've already added another hard drive and replaced a CD drive with a DVD burner.

The Ed part - I wasn't sure. I figured Ed was your abbreviation for epricedright, didn't bother me at all though. No worries!

[Regis]

Are you sure the video card is bad? Intermittent video display problems.... hmmm ...... I would suspect the monitor before the video card. When a video card is going bad it goes bad in a hurry and doesn't usually fix itself. One day it's good and the next day Poof it's gone. Now a tube style (CRTs) monitor can limp on for quite awhile when it's bad. Personally I've gone through many more monitors than I have video cards. Others may chime in on their experiences.

An 8x video card should be backwards compatible. And a video card fan is powered by the AGP slot. No hook ups needed. When you were in dxdiag did you run the display tests under the Display tab? If you ran the tests and everything was Ok then I would start looking elsewhere for the problem. I was talking to Body by Fisher about your situation and my thoughts and this is what I came up with. I believe your cpu fan was intermittently sticking for some time. A sticking cpu fan will cause all kinds of problems that can be difficult to identify. I've had a sticky cpu fan blow out 2 video cards and one ps unit. Interestingly enough it took me a little while to figure that out because it was intermittent. The fan always turned while I was looking at it (kind of like watching water boil) and it took a monitoring program to catch it sticking now and then. After that experience I've become attuned to the sounds of all my fans.... fear will do that. I can tell when even one fan (I have 7) is having a problem. I've had to service the cpu fan on the last 2 desktops I've owned. And not from dust but from the bearings drying out. Something to think about.

[epricedright]

Are you sure the video card is bad? Intermittent video display problems.... hmmm ...... I would suspect the monitor before the video card. When a video card is going bad it goes bad in a hurry and doesn't usually fix itself. One day it's good and the next day Poof it's gone. Now a tube style (CRTs) monitor can limp on for quite awhile when it's bad. Personally I've gone through many more monitors than I have video cards. Others may chime in on their experiences.

An 8x video card should be backwards compatible. And a video card fan is powered by the AGP slot. No hook ups needed. When you were in dxdiag did you run the display tests under the Display tab? If you ran the tests and everything was Ok then I would start looking elsewhere for the problem. I was talking to Body by Fisher about your situation and my thoughts and this is what I came up with. I believe your cpu fan was intermittently sticking for some time. A sticking cpu fan will cause all kinds of problems that can be difficult to identify. I've had a sticky cpu fan blow out 2 video cards and one ps unit. Interestingly enough it took me a little while to figure that out because it was intermittent. The fan always turned while I was looking at it (kind of like watching water boil) and it took a monitoring program to catch it sticking now and then. After that experience I've become attuned to the sounds of all my fans.... fear will do that. I can tell when even one fan (I have 7) is having a problem. I've had to service the cpu fan on the last 2 desktops I've owned. And not from dust but from the bearings drying out. Something to think about.

No,I am not certain the videocard is bad, but last year I posted a thread about this and I believe that was the conclusion we came to. I have switched this monitor and cable with another pc, and it looked fine there. I also tried my other monitor and cable that looks fine on the other pc, and on this pc, and I get the same thing. What I have is a dark screen with flourescent colors. This problem is not intermittent, but 24/7. I have tried switching settings, to no avail. Here is that thread:

http://caddyinfo.ipbhost.com/index.php?sho...hl=monitor+dark

Maybe I need to do further test on the card. I just ran the directX test just now and it appeared ok there. There were some suggestions made in that thread, that I did not try. If I didn't respond I tried it, then it wasn't done. I'm getting confused now as to what my next test should be to determine if my video card is indeed bad.

Regarding the CPU fan, should I try adding a drop of oil in the bearing? I honestly believe the CPU fan was not doing it's job due to all the dust that was in there and in the heatsink. The fan was 80% clogged. The Heatsink was 100% plugged. Same thing with the power supply...95% clogged with dust at the air inlet holes.

[Regis]

Given that information it seems likely that the video card is toast. I rarely hear of a fanless vid card going bad unless it was affected by another component. 4x vid cards are fairly inexpensive. I wouldn't get too crazy with getting a high end card unless you figure on upgrading the rest of the components. And that wouldn't be a good idea cost wise. An AGP 4X TNT vid card can be had rather cheaply and it's still a very good card. But at this point any vid card is better than what you currently have apparently. And definitely go with the AGP card as opposed to the PCI if the slot is present. It's a dedicated video card slot and much faster than the PCI slot in regards to video display. If you get an AGP card you may have to go into CMOS to configure the system to read the AGP slot (it's easy). But you can cross that bridge when it's time.

[epricedright]

What do you think about either of these two?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...681&CatId=0

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...096&CatId=0

I do some video editing and DVD burning. My son plays games on the pc every now and then. I'd like to have two monitors up at once...sounds like fun! I'm open to any and all suggestions. I'd like to keep it under $60.

Thanks!

[Regis]

Both are nice. The second card just edges out the first one in resolution. And it has a fairly large heatsink even though it's fanless. Weigh the features and benefits. You'll be happy with either I'm sure.

[epricedright]

Both are nice. The second card just edges out the first one in resolution. And it has a fairly large heatsink even though it's fanless. Weigh the features and benefits. You'll be happy with either I'm sure.

Ok, thanks! So those two aren't overkill for my system and needs then? The first card is NOW not available...lol

I might as well get one of these as well and update to USB 2.0 and get rid of that 1.0 hub I have.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/Se...sp?EdpNo=762407

I will be sure to add that after I know everything else is ok. One thing at a time, I now know. This will work with USB 1.0 devices, correct? I just looked, my 2 rear USB ports are currently built into the motherboard it appears? Will a new USB 2.0 card plug and play into a PCI slot? I have 2 USB ports in the rear and 2 in front. They're not in the PCI slots. Can I change the ports in front to be USB 2.0? Maybe run a cable from the card to the front somehow, or unplug the front USB cables and connect them to the back of the new USB 2.0 card? Are the USB cables typically hard wired in or just plugged into the mother board? The new card will have 2 internal USB slots. Bottom line, I would like a USB 2.0 port in front to hook my camera and flash drive to. I guess I could go with an external USB 2.0 hub and put that up front.

Thanks!

[epricedright]

It's been 4 days now since I replaced the power supply and no sudden restarts or crashes. Everything appears normal now. Does anyone have any answers to the above questions before I buy that USB 2.0 card?

Thanks!