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Cowpie last won the day on July 17 2016

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About Cowpie

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    Reader (10+ posts)

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  • Car Model and Year
    2006 CTS
  • Engine
    3.6L V6 VVT (LY7)
  1. Believe it or not, but I actually am using a Pennzoil conventional 10w30 in my LY7 3.6. It meets the spec for the motor, which according to my owners manual is 6094M, also verified at Pennzoil website. And the Petroleum Quality Institute folks did a test on the Pennz 10w30 conventional and it actually was better than many full synthetics in both base oil characteristics and additive package. They were shocked at result and retested to confirm. Same result. It actually had better characteristics and stronger add pack than Mobil 1 Super Synthetic. Boat load of calcium detergents in it and substantial amounts of the anti friction tag team of Moly and Boron. Lower burn off rate (NOACK) than many 5w30 full synthetics, including the boutique brands. A killer oil for only $3 a quart I get it for at my local Farm and Home store. Some of us have speculated that SOPUS is using the new natural gas to liquid base oil in the formulation for it to have such good characteristics.
  2. Every vehicle I own from new gets trans fluid and filter changed out before 10,000 miles. Then every 60,000 miles thereafter. While GM has its ideas, I have my comfort zone to live in. Let's see..... 45 years of vehicle ownership and never had a transmission failure. Several vehicles taken well over 250,000 miles. It really isn't a flush via a machine you want. A complete fluid exchange via the cooler line is the way to go. Does not force anything thru that could possibly damage trans.
  3. Well, I didn't use a 40w in mine, but I did do an engine flush treatment over 2000 miles and moved to a 10w30 synthetic. After the second engine flush and oil change, the oil consumption dropped quite a bit. Instead of almost 1 qt per 1000 miles, down to 1/4 qt in 1000 miles. The catch can captured roughly 5 oz of oil over 1000 miles now, and that leaves about 3 oz unaccounted for so figure the engine is "using" it. 3 oz actual engine use in 1000 miles is pretty tolerable for a engine with 55,000 miles on it that was poorly maintained for the first 52,000 miles. The PCV port is poorly designed and needs some good baffling inside the valve cover to keep oil away from it during operation. And part of the reason for it grabbing so much oil before in mine had to come from excessive blowby on the piston rings. The two engine flushes could have gotten the rings freed up somewhat so things are sealing better and that slowed both the consumption and the PCV oil problem. No way to know for sure without a engine tear down.
  4. Yes, same brand of oil, Amsoil XL, just a change from 5w30 to 10w30. I used the Amsoil Engine Flush product, two different occasions, 2000 mile spread. The Signature Amsoil stuff just doesn't seem like a good value, very pricey, and I have no interest in extending drain intervals. Now that things have settled down, I will probably stick with 5000 mile oil changes. The XL compares favorably in pricing to off the shelf stuff (at preferred customer pricing) and has a pretty good add pack in it. A good bang for the buck. Took a road trip last weekend. Now at almost 1000 miles since oil change. Dumped the catch can last night. The can captured another 3-4 oz of oil from the PCV line. Added to the previous 2 oz it captured, 5-6 oz total captured. The oil level did drop by about 1/4 qt. So factoring out the catch can capture, the engine is "using" about 3 oz of oil in 1000 miles now. Not bad at all. I did a look up of the EPA estimated fuel economy on this model/engine, and this car is getting about 2-3 mpg better across the board than the estimates. Pretty darn good for a car that was very poorly maintained for the previous 52,000 miles before I got it. A real keeper now.
  5. Second week and another couple hundred miles. Catch can captured maybe 2 oz total since the oil change, and the level hasn't moved off of full mark. Think I indeed got a handle on the oil consumption issue. The consumption decreased dramatically to almost a non existent level. At this interval after an oil change before, I would easily be a bout 1/2 qt low. Anyone that has the consumption issue, what I did might be well worth giving a shot. Nothing to lose in trying.
  6. When I picked up a 2006 CTS 3.6L a couple of months ago with 52,000 miles on it, I learned pretty quickly that it was an oil eater. Dealer had changed oil before I took it, but after a couple of week of some serious consumption, I did an engine flush on the engine and changed oil and filter, using a 5w30 synthetic. I also put on a Elite Engineering catch can on the PCV line. As the vehicle was driven, the can collected about 1.5 oz of oil every 100 miles. Pretty sad. So after 2000 miles of this, I did another engine flush on the engine, changed oil and filter, this time using a 10w30 synthetic. Into the second week, and the oil level has not dropped a bit on the stick. I dumped the catch can at the oil change and have not checked it again since oil level hasn't dropped. Looks promising. Over 200 miles since the oil change and oil level staying the same, whereas before it would already be about 1/4 qt low by now . Not sure if the additional flush finally got rings and channel deposits taken care of or the 10w30 was a major factor, or both. The 10w30 should not have made that much difference, because a 0w30, 5w30, or 10w30 has the exact same viscosity at operating temperatures. Only the cold flow is different. But the 10w30 has a very low NOACK (burn off vaporization rate) compared to 5w30 or 0w30. Will continue to monitor, but things look much better. For there to be so much oil coming thru the PCV line, there had to be an excessive blowby issue to contribute to that. A couple of engine flushes might have got rings unstuck and got them sealing up well again. Without an engine tear down, there is no way to confirm anything, but seems a reasonable assumption.
  7. These engines are indeed "consuming" oil, but not in the way that many suppose. The PCV port is poorly designed, with no baffle, to prevent oil from being sucked up thru the PCV tubing and on to the intake. My 3.6L "eats" a lot of oil this way. I have a Elite Engineering E2 catch can on the PCV line. It captures about 1 - 1.5 oz of oil every 100 miles. That is almost 1 qt in 2000 miles. Almost mirroring exactly what the consumption rate is, and what many report. Not exact same amount as the consumption rate, but darn close. I am looking at a replacement PCV grommet for the valve cover, that has an integral baffle. Not sure if it would have the clearance or not to be viable option. Still looking into that.
  8. oil consumption

    Yours was the first response to the OP's question. He only mentioned two oils.... 5w30 and 10w30, which he was asking about using in place of the 5w30 he had been using. Nary a peep about a 40w. Then you responded that it is not wise to use a thicker oil. Clearly, that would be taken that the reference is 10w30 is thicker than 5w30. I just went back and made sure myself in case I was in error. You, in no way, even referenced 40w oils in your initial post response to the OP. Sorry if I ruffled your feathers, but as Walter Cronkite used to say on the evening news back in the day... "And that's the way it is". I in no way "criticized" you, I corrected an postulated error based on that information I gleaned from the first two posts of this thread. I did not say you were an idiot or some other diatribe. The only thing I said was wrong was your contention that one is thicker than the other. I also corrected what is an assumption by many folks, not just yourself, that viscosity has to do with thickness. It does not. It is resistance to flow. A simple google lookup will prove that. Nothing in my posts was intended as personal attack and I just re-read it, and I don't see any such in that posting. While iron will not flow when solid, it has the same molecular structure as iron that is heated and now can be poured. The molecular thickness never changed, only the viscosity, or flow, due to temperature. Oil is the same way. The only dig at anyone was the reference to someone who might go out, jump in the car, start it up on a cold morning, and immediately floor it and do a wide open throttle takeoff. I did say that would be low brain wave activity.
  9. oil consumption

    Thicker oil? A 10w30 is "thicker" than a 5w30? Not according to all the data sheets I have read from all the motor oil brands. The Viscosity at 100c (read that as as the operating temp of the typical engine) of a 5w30 and a 10w30 are the same, irregardless of brand. All that is different is the winter cold crank start rating. That is what the "w" stands for... winter, not weight. and the cold flow viscosity of a 5w30 vs 10w30, when it comes to full synthetics, is minuscule, and each has almost a similar lower cold flow pour point of around -40F. And viscosity is not a measure of "thickness" but a measure of resistance. In the next life, strike up a conversation with Isaac Newton and he will explain it to you. A 10w30 is not thicker than a 5w30. Both have a kinematic viscosity at 100c of about 10.8. Even at 40c, they are only a few points difference, hardly worth arguing over. It is a balancing act... you need resistance to flow (viscosity) to a degree that oil is not squeezed out of bearings under pressure too quickly, but you need a viscosity that is low enough to actually get oil into the bearing surfaces in a sufficient manner. And winter cold crank rating, or "w" in 5w30 or 10w30 has almost nothing to do with it except when the engine is started cold. And very few people, except those with a low brain wave activity, will start a engine cold and immediately do WOT and put extreme pressure on the engine components. Your contention would only be valid if the OP was considering using a 40w oil instead of a 30w oil. But regarding 5w30 vs 10w30, the 10w30 will have a lower NOACK (burn off vaporization rate) significantly less than a 5w30, because it requires far fewer viscosity improvers that the 5w30 has to meet the lower CCS rating. And it is the viscosity improvers that can shear under high pressure. A 10w30 typically will be more shear stable over the oil change interval than a 5w30. While it is common to say oils are thicker when cold, that is not accurate. They are not thicker, but have a higher resistance to flow. A 30w oil its the same thickness at -40F as it is at 200F. The only thing that changed was the resistance to flow.
  10. oil pressure low stop engine

    The reduction in zinc is why many oil blenders are now relying on moly, titanium, and boron to provide the necessary anti friction and extreme pressure protection that was traditionally provided by zinc. And they have no deleterious effect on emissions components and do a pretty good job. While zinc is interesting, with modern oils, I have grown more fond of those that have generous amounts of moly and boron in them.
  11. LOL! MOS2 is molybdenum disulfide, what most would simply call Moly. It has some very good properties. It is well known in the racing and high performance engine community. A great read on it, that won't hurt your head, is here..... Think of moly like a deck of playing cards. If you are pushing boxes along a ramp, there is friction that tries to work against you. If you spread out a layer of playing cards along the ramp, and then push the boxes, they slide along the ramp easier as the playing cards slide over one another. Moly has a natural plate-like structure than acts like those playing cards. But it does not build up like has happened with some the late night TV oil additive stuff that gets advertised. It is a natural friction reducer that can handle some very extreme pressures (over 500,000 PSI) and very high temperatures, and it will fill in microscopic imperfections in the metals it is used on. It is well known and has been relied upon in the lubrication industry, especially in extreme operating conditions like military turbine and aircraft rated reciprocating engines. Some oil blenders though do not use it, as it is somewhat costly. The higher quality oils and greases generally have some of it in varying amounts. When you combine it with Boron in the form of boric acid, it provides a great tag team of friction reduction in an engine. What primarily shears in a motor oil is the viscosity improvers (VI) that make it work at being a 0w30 and 5w30. It takes more VI to enable a oil to go from a low cold flow like 0w or 5w winter cold flow rating to a 30w at engine operating temperatures. And there are different grades of VI that blenders use in their oils. And this VI can shear under extreme pressure and cause the oil to go outside of the rated viscosity. Some full synthetic 10w30 oils have the ability to flow at cold temps, yet use no VI at all to do so. They are technically a straight 30w oil, but can naturally flow well enough in cold to qualify as a 10w30. These base oils therefore typically have very low NOACK (burn off or vaporization rates), and are highly resistant to high temp high shear. They are just plain tougher and hold up better in the worst of conditions. Given the timing chain issues that have become well known about the GM 3.6L DOHC engines and other issues, I prefer to use a 10w30 full synthetic that has generous levels of moly and boron, irregardless of GM wanting me to use a 5w30. But I also prefer it in all of my engines from the little single cylinder in my Yamaha portable generator on up thru the 12.7L Detroit in my commercial truck. I have found in the 12.7L, via stacks of used oil sample analysis reports, that a 10w30 seems to be more shear stable than even a 15w40. I get lower wear metal numbers and better longevity out of the oil. So oil thickness like 40w vs 30w is not the critical issue, it is the base oil makeup and the various additives that protect the engine.
  12. dexos1 is the latest GM standard, and it is good, it is built upon 4718M and 6094M. But it falls behind ILSAC GF-5 in dealing with ethanol, and considering that almost everyone uses E10 nowadays, by choice or not, and GM encourages its use, they dropped the ball on the dexos1 spec in this regard. This is why I don't really worry too much about dexos1 spec, even for my 2015 Silverado 2500 gasser. And there was a TSB out not all that long ago that stated API SN synthetics could be used in place of dexos1. So, GM doesn't have a real big issue with SN, ILSAC GF-5 is better than dexos1 for ethanol, so I just select 10w30 oils that meet SN, GF-5, 4718M, and 6094M and call it a day. 10w30 will never meet dexos1, but that is only because dexos1 requires a 5w30 or 0w30. Just because such a low cold flow is called for in the spec does not mean that it is needed across the spectrum for all applications. For that primary reason, I don't use a dexos1 oil. I prefer the better characteristics of 10w30 over 5w30 and 0w30, and I don't live in Alaska or run the ALCAN highway in winter, so I don't need the cold flow of a 5w30 or 0w30. But in reality, whether it is a synthetic, a blend, or a conventional, it is the additive package that makes up 20% or more of every quart that make a significant difference. Zinc was mentioned, it is a good extreme pressure additive, and yes, it has been reduced somewhat in the latest spec oils because of emissions stuff. But molybdenum disulfide (MOS2) in conjunction with boron (boric acid) does a darn good job as well and doesn't affect catalytic converters and such. I prefer oils that use generous levels of moly and boron in them. The best way to learn what comprises most oils on the market is to take a stroll over to the Petroleum Quality Institute of America website and take a look at the testing they have done on a lot of oils. They break it all down and show what they are made of. While base oils may be similar, the additive packages are all over the map. And yes, even among dexos1 certified oils. Dexos has certain requirements, but after that, the blender can pretty much play fast and loose with additives at their discretion. And some really don't put a lot of emphasis on extreme pressure protection and friction modifiers, while other blenders take it more seriously. There are mediocre dexos1 rated oils that just slide in under the wire regarding dexos1 compliance (and I wouldn't let them near my engines), and there are some pretty good ones that exceed the standard. But likewise, there are some non dexos1 approved oils that put some dexos1 oils to shame and meet or exceed the dexos1 standard. Usually the market focus it different, so they just don't bother with seeking dexos1 official certification. It is fee based and can be costly unless there is significant volume to overcome the initial and ongoing fee structure, so some don't feel spending the money for dexos1 approval is worth it. GM is the only entity that charges for oil certification. API doesn't, ILSAC doesn't, and the European oil standards do not require fees. And some of the EU standards are tougher than dexos1.
  13. To some degree I would concur, at least on the heavier viscosities. But not a 10w30? Quiz question: what is the kinematic viscosity at 100c (read that as the operating temperature of the engine) of a 5w30 vs a 10w30? Answer: The same! At operating temperature, 0w30, 5w30, and 10w30 all have the same kinematic viscosity of around 10.5 to 10.9. The only difference between them is the winter cold flow rating, which is what the "w' stands for. And that has more to do with cold starting than running the engine. The "w" is not a oil weight rating but a cold flow rating. Go to the SAE website and they will confirm this. And even then, unless one is dealing with some serious nasty cold at start up, it is not really an issue. Michigan gets cold, but not real nasty cold except in the U.P. (yes, I travel Wisconsin, Minnesota, Michigan, etc frequently year round). A 10w30 full synthetic generally will have a -40F to -45F cold flow pour point along with a rated cold crank start rating of -25F to -30F. So unless one is in Calgary, MT, ND, or Fairbanks, AK type of weather, a 10w30 will be fine. For those like me, that the car resides in a heated garage when not in use, a 10w30 will work just fine year round. It rarely gets below -20F in my area in Central Iowa. I lived outside of Fairbanks, AK for 10 years and used 10w30 conventional with no problems. But then, we were smart up there... we had block heaters, oil pan heaters, and electric battery blankets that all got plugged in when the vehicles were at home. That all being said, everything from my Yamaha portable generator on up thru my class 8 commercial trucks all get 10w30 oil. Different types, but still 10w30. My 2015 2500HD, my 2006 CTS, my JD zero turn mower, my JD 825i Gator, my ag tractor, my 2013 Freightliner semi trucks. 10w30 has a lower volatility rating (NOACK vaporization rate) than either 0w30 or 5w30, it also uses less viscosity improvers which can shear under extreme pressure, and it maintains a more level viscosity rating over the entire oil change interval. Many full synthetic 10w30 oils are actually straight 30w oils, but qualify due to their cold flow rating as 10w30. I have long since become very fond of 10w30 oils for all these reasons. And most full synthetic 10w30 oil will meet GM 4718M and 6094M specs, which are the basis of what dexos1 is built upon. The dexos1 spec just specifies a 5w30 minimum to cover all the bases of what most folks deal with in N. America. In some ways, it is not even as good at ILSAC GF-5 rating, which has a better ethanol emulsification spec than dexos1. Which seems strange, since GM is all over the idea of using ethanol.
  14. I picked up a 2006 CTS 3.6L several weeks back. Had 52,000 miles and looked like it came off the showroom floor. But oil consumption noticed right away. I cleaned the MAF and TB, changed air filter, did engine flush and changed oil and filter, did a top side cleanup using CRC Intake Valve Cleaner, did the PCV mod by increasing lower port holes to 5/64 and top one to 7/64, and installed a Elite Engineering E2 PCV catch can. The catch can has captured about 1-1.5 oz of oil every 100 miles. Now I know where most of the oil is going. But still using a little more than is being captured, so will do a change out this weekend and follow the lead of some folks outside the U.S. who are using a 0w40 or 5w40 in these engines. I am going to use a Euro spec 5w40 synthetic this go around instead of a 5w30 synthetic. There is no "requirement" to use Mobil 1. U.S. Federal law states that if something is required, then the OEM must provide it to the consumer free. So one can use any synthetic or synthetic blend they choose and still stay within warranty as long as it meets the spec required for their engine. For the newer stuff, that would be dexos1.