rockfangd

The ongoing Deville thread

132 posts in this topic

Hi All. Figured I would start a thread to share my progress on my new to me 97 Deville D'Elegance.

I want to bring it back to its former cadillac glory. I will have some questions but feel free to read it all.

I will try to post some pics of the progress.

Here is what I have done to it so far

7 hours in detailing the interior. from dash to back of trunk.

master window switch and driver window motor

photocell for twilight system

new remotes.

power antenna

swapped in higher line radio unit

putting in a new fuel filler tube tomorrow.

It still needs

back bumper

front bumper is pushed back about 1" on both sides? any ideas on this one?

Mufflers are shot

rear knuckle bushings are bad

rainsense sensor missing

wipers only work on high, low, intermittent, and wash all dont work. Does anyone know if the motor can be repaired?

I assume it has to do with the board on it.

engine has possible overheating issue. I wont know more til I get it on the road. Fingers crossed.

I cannot wait to get this car up and running. I love it, I miss my eldo but love the devilles more.

I will update my progress


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Regarding the front bumper, apparently it had a bumper-thumper sometime in the past and the bumper shock absorbers were not replaced. You should replace them when you get a chance. They prevent unibody damage if you have another bumper-thumper, and with the short front bumper you are more likely to have grille, headlight, or hood damage when you would not otherwise have any.

Regarding the rain sensor, they are usually replaced with the windshield but cost extra; apparently someone cheaped out the windshield on a replacement, probably without the owner's knowledge. The rain sensor is available separately. Putting it on is a painfully meticulous job but easy enough.

Regarding the windshield wiper speeds and washer, the schematic in the 1997 FSM pages 8A-91-1 and -2 show that the rain sensor is between the switch and the wiper motor. The missing rain sensor is probalby your problem. I would replace the rain sensor before I touched the wiper motor.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Thanks. I was hoping to be able to get the bumper back into its place without too much work.

I picked up a used rain sensor but I cannot use it. Dealer wants 200.00 for the crazy thing so I looked everywhere for a used one. The one I got has damage to the sensor area. But it should work on low and should make 1 sweep each time the sensitivity setting is changed. I can hear a click from the motor area but nothing happens.

Also sometimes on high the wipers go nuts and only go up about 4" then down repeatedly


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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I think the trick with rain sense unit is that special clear custom adhesive that must be used to hold the module to the windshield. Otherwise just having the unit installd, and hanging down should give you normal function to your wipers. I thought the fluid pump was attached to the fluid tank? I believe that is a separate issue from the wiper motor, and ran sensor.

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And by normal, i mean off, high, and low. You will not have delay, because rain sense replaces that finction, and obviously it would not detect rain on the windshield being the sensor is just hanging on a wire over your rear view mirror.

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The washer pump may be bad also. I have replaced a few


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Well got the filler tube in today, It was rotted just like my 96 was. I thoroughly washed the whole area behind the plastic panel. It was covered with dirt and what not.

the good thing is that the car looks very structurally solid. I plan to get at least a few years out of it


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Have you tried getting the rain sensor and adhesive form GMPartsDirect and similar places?


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Are you prepared to do the head gasket job? Jasper? Doing it yourself or sending it out? i am anxiously waiting to hear if it was a clogged bolt, or if the bolts indeed pulled. Hopefully its something minor.

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Well I finally put the car on the road tomorrow. I am just as anxious as you lol.

I wont be driving it tomorrow but will try it wednesday morning.

I will be sending it out if the engine has issues. I just dont have the time to get into it.

I want to take it on a few short trips before I try going to work with it. dont want to have issues.

I had to reseal one tire, was going flat rather quickly. found the chrome peeling at the bead seat. Fronts of rims are mint though. Common issue.

I dont actually prefer the chrome because of that issue. My Seville has chrome also but does not have that problem. Probably because it has never seen a winter. I will be updating tomorrow. I have a few pics to post also


GM FAN FOREVER

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Today went ok. put 30 miles on it. the first time I drove it it shut off coming to a stoplight. I would never have known if the oil light had not come on. Check engine light did not come on.

hottest coolant temp was 222. It fluctuates alot. goes up to about 222 while getting up to speed but then quickly drops down around 205. Keep in mind it is about 30*f here.

I am going to drive it for a few days and monitor it. If all is ok and still passes by products test next week I am going to drain the coolant again.

I removed the wiper motor module(pulse board..) and cleaned the connections. Works a little better. Got low now. In rainsense mode each time I switch sensitivity they come up about 4" then park.

I swapped out the washer pump, Old one tested good though. May need a second person to see if it is doing anything.

And lastly I washed it.

before

th_filler%202_zpsabcdnyib.jpg

After

th_filler_zpsn0poiwcz.jpg

th_1208151939_zpshv59xzbo.jpg

th_engine_zpsv2tntrvv.jpg


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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That is a beautiful car. Thank you for the photograph.

The temps sound normal to me. It's normal for the temperature to fluctuate a bit if the A/C is off and you are not moving very fast. Turn on the A/C and both fans come on at low speed and the temperature should be steady as a rock. Press the Temp control button to put it on Auto and that should do it.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Thanks. The color is unique.

The AC does not work. It looks like whoever did the radiator botched the AC condensor. I am probably going to have to pull everything back apart on that.

As soon as you turn on ac it throws a code. May still turn on the fans though.

Washer pump still not working. Bench tested ok. When I put the stalk to the wash position it cycles the wipers but no pump operates.

Also Is the wiper motor cover different between rainsense and no rainsense.

I bought a complete unit but the plug is different that goes to the module. Mine is a 8 pin plug rectangle, the other one is a flat 5? pin plug


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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The most likely problem with the washer is a cracked or loose hose. An air leak on the intake side will keep the pump from priming and be very hard to find or even see when you are looking at it. An output side hose can be off or kinked.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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So far things have been ok. No lights or codes.

Left muffler is about falling off though. (waiting on the new one)

I had no backup lights so I removed the panel and checked the bulbs. They were fine. So I found the blown fuse underhood, it is the park/rev fuse.

I replaced the fuse and now I have backup lights. But I also hear a click when I turn the key on. Almost sounds like the shiftlock. Everything is working fine so I assume it is ok.

The key in chime does not work. The lamp reminder chime works though. Maybe the ignition itself?

As for the rain sense issue the part is 200.00 I am working on it though. Apparently it is 97 only. I wish I knew someone that knows more about that generation. I found a new sensor for 100.00 but although identical the part number is different so I have no idea if it would work.


GM FAN FOREVER

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Tonight made me nervous.

I just hit 100 miles.

I was at highway speeds and came to a small incline so I gave it more gas to keep up speed and the coolant temp shot up from 208 to 245 quickly.

i turned up the temperature (already had heat on)

Then out of nowhere the temperature was back down to 205.

I am going to put the muffler on it, Check the waterpump tensioner to see if it is free. (the belt feels tight but I want to know for sure)

Then saturday I will be inspecting it.
After that I want to do another bi products test.

I also want to test the radiator cap


GM FAN FOREVER

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I guess another test can be a very clean cylinder head. It can be inspected with a small scope camera thru the spark plug hole. The cylinder against the firewall on the passenger side would be the one to check first.

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Check to water pump belt for slipping, check that the tensioner is free and applying adequate tension and check the pulley bearing for free movement. I just went to install a WP tensioner I took off 2 years ago and the pulley was very tight. Upon closer inspection the bearing seal was cracked and I suppose the grease had been thrown out and it solidified.

20151209_152324_zpsuvatsgyu_edit_1449842


Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >> http://z-cut.de/US/dtcobd1.html

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> http://carprogrammer.com/Z28/PCM/OBD2/On-BoardDiagnosticTroubleCodes(OBD-II).mht

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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...

I was at highway speeds and came to a small incline so I gave it more gas to keep up speed and the coolant temp shot up from 208 to 245 quickly.

i turned up the temperature (already had heat on)

Then out of nowhere the temperature was back down to 205.

... Check the waterpump tensioner to see if it is free. (the belt feels tight but I want to know for sure)

Ringer for a pulled head bolt. The waterpump belt can give the same symptoms, as can a plugged bolt-with-a-hole, a sticking thermostat, or a thermostat installed backwards. The nose can tell from the overflow tank, though. Also, sniff the exhaust right after the next cold start.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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I will try and check it further tomorrow. I want to try and do a by products test tomorrow.

the low coolant message came up twice this morning. I see no signs of leaking. And I had just topped it off 4 days ago. I filled it to 2" from the top of the reservoir


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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Hmm, can you pressurize the cooling system? Check cap's ability to hold pressure. A loss of system pressure would drop pressure and it would spontaineously boil. Cap holds 11 and system pressure goes to 13 say and it calls for a 15 lb cap.

I like to start small before hitting the panic button and assuming head gasket. The inverted cone method of thinking verses concluding that looks like the 50s cadillac chevron where all potential causes are at the top eliminated one by one until is only one conclusion left at the bottom that you test for and verify to confirm that IS in fact the cause. To assume is to make errors no matter how smart you may be.

I think you said the engine once passed a by products test and I have no doubt you stuck your big nose into the coolant tank and took a strong wiff... so I am not ready to give up and tear apart your engine. I smelled a distinct exhaust smell in my tank!

Plus, when my headgasket blew I had a misfire and there was no driving it in any type of traffic as the temp took off. I actually had and felt my head gasket blow.

Keeping fingers crossed


Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >> http://z-cut.de/US/dtcobd1.html

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> http://carprogrammer.com/Z28/PCM/OBD2/On-BoardDiagnosticTroubleCodes(OBD-II).mht

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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I plan to do another by products test sunday.

I do know that the tank stunk like hell but my sniffer just does not work well. The low coolant light is on right now but I dont want to add any coolant til I do the test.


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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The tank had a distinct exhaust smell in it.

Yesterday I replaced a starter in a 98 Eldorado. It has been losing coolant so while I was doing the job I kept my eye open for causes. What I found when I pulled the intake out was that the 18 inch pipe that connects to the water pump body and to one of the heater pipes at a green silicone hose was badly rusted which to me was unusual. When I started the car, steam was coming from that pipe and the area became wet. I happen to have a replacement pipe and will replace it today. Hopefully that will solve the coolant loss problem and resultant overheating.

Follow any coolant smells and look for steam.


Pre-1995 - DTC codes OBD1  >> http://z-cut.de/US/dtcobd1.html

1996 and newer - DTC codes OBD2 >> http://carprogrammer.com/Z28/PCM/OBD2/On-BoardDiagnosticTroubleCodes(OBD-II).mht

How to check for codes Caddyinfo How To Technical Archive >> http://www.caddyinfo.com/wordpress/cadillac-how-to-faq/

Cadillac History & Specifications Year by Year  http://www.motorera.com/cadillac/index.htm

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If the coolant checks OK, flush it anyway. If it smells, whatever is causing that can't be good to leave in there.


CTS-V_Dashboard.jpg
-- Click Here for CaddyInfo page on "How To" Read Your OBD Codes
-- Click Here for my personal page to download my OBD code list as an Excel file, plus other Cadillac data
-- See my CaddyInfo car blogs: 2011 CTS-V, 1997 ETC
Yes, I was Jims_97_ETC before I changed cars.

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Ok so yesterday I had the car inspected. Then I went through and checked the WP tensioner. It was tight but I was able to free it up. Needs a belt though as it is close to the limiter.

I had to put in half a gallon of coolant to get the message off.

So Today I decided to drive it like I would normally drive a Cadillac.

It was not long at all before I got my diagnosis on the car.

I got on the highway and got right on the throttle. It held steady temp as I accelerated hard.

But as I held the throttle to hold my highway speed it suddenly soared upward. I lost heat. Before I knew it it was up to 260.

I let off and tried to take it easy so I could make it back home but it had other ideas. The temp would not go down even after I got it off the highway.

I could hear air like crazy purging through the system. The lights and warnings came on and engine cut to half power. I was only about a quarter mile from home.

I got it home, shut it down. Let it cool down and started it up. It instantly failed the by products test. You could see the smoke purging through the cap opening like exhaust.

Stunk like pure exhaust.

So I guess I have to figure out what to do with it now. The last one had repaired cost me 3500 from the dealer. I cannot afford to do that this time.

I will likely have to settle for having a used engine installed.

I have seen this situation quite a few times. If you baby one that has a HG problem it can be slightly covered up, but as soon as you drive it the way it is designed it will leave you stranded.

My friend bought a 97 a few years back and it was fine on the test drive and idled all day. He went to bring it home and never made it. I see very nice condition cadillacs in the salvage yards because of this. I guess it is hard to justify spending too much money to have the engine repaired.

I have parked it for now and am going to call around to try to get prices and ideas. I guess I will be driving my truck lol.

I will update this when I figure out what I am going to do


GM FAN FOREVER

Nice, clean, luxury= fine automobile

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